Need Help decal not stinking to wall paint

[easystar]

applied a wall decal using chrome mirror (oracal) to flat wall. within a day it started to buckle. I think it has something to do with the paint used. I remember reading some paint manufacturers use silicone as a paint ingredient for harder surface and scuff residence. Not sure what brand, but would like any feedback from
others experiencing decal issues with flat walls.

 

[Gino]

You will hafta find out what kinda paint was used and how long it was allowed to dry before your putting on the failing vinyl.

In fact, that's a question one should always ask and insist upon an answer before just nilly-willy putting vinyl on an unknown surface.

 

[Chasez]

I agree with Gino, now a days almost every paint is "easy clean" or whatever it may state. These paints contain silicates that cure to the surface. You need to know the right techniques to clean etc. to get vinyl to adhere. Always find out the type of paint that was used/will be used prior to production. You could even go as far as using the 3M adhesion test kit to test the wall to see if the vinyl will stick (for larger jobs).

Chaz

 

[Billct2]

yep

 

[MikePro]

+1 our sales reps carry around 1" chunks of scrap vinyl to test surfaces on clients' walls prior to production. if we get un-stick-able surfaces, we upgrade the vinyl to something more like an Arlon 8000 motorcross-style hightack adhesive. works like a charm.

we've lost a lot of $$$ in the past by simply assuming any vinyl will work, as it had in the past 20yrs, just to produce graphic-drive to location-spend an hour cursing at the vinyl while the client laughs at your frustration-return to shop-reproduce-reinstall-and still look like a schmuck.

 

[bigben]

We use the 3M test kit if we want to be 100% sure the vinyl will stick there. But for basic jobs of just quick check, we just stick painters tape. If it stick well, the vinyl will hold. If not, we use the 3M kit and go from there.

 

[Andy D]

We have had issues with vinyl sticking to paint also.
I have been told this is due to the government lowering the VOC acceptable levels &
as others have pointed out, manufacturers adding all kind of anti scuff and even scents to their paints.
I always tell customers about this prior and let them know we have no control over what kind of paint
they choose to use & they can either have it mounted to a substrate and have that mounted to the wall,
or take their chances.

 

[ikarasu]

We had a customer who just moved into a new location, and wanted his metal baydoor wrapped. We design... Print, cut everything... setup a date to install it, get there and it wont stick at all. Normally it sticks at least a little... But we couldn't even get the transfer tape off. We told the Customer it was our mistake, we should have tested vinyl first... and we will come back with some sample material and re-do it all at no cost.

Come back with the highest tac material we have... Stuff that sticks to anything. Test it... and it comes off easily too. IT at least sticks with a lot of pressure/cohercing... but it comes off with little effort. It also leaves a huge oily patch on the vinyl. The client tried to pressure wash the door thinking it was just dirty (We told him it was the paint) We come back, same thing. Nothing we have could make it stick...

He wanted the wrap so bad, he re-painted the door. Sometimes high tac will work, sometimes a lot of heat will work... Sometimes it's futile to even try. We wasted hours going back and fourth... first time we found a door we couldn't work with though. And our sales rep learned a lesson, and now brings a couple squares of every material to make sure stuff will work!

 

[Modern Ink Signs]

This is what is known as "A learning experience". I'm seeing more and more posts about graphics being applied to walls and not sticking.


Here are somethings to think about/do next time.

• Test wall
• Choose an appropriate material. Some just can't be used given the painted surface
• Wipe / Clean the wall with 70% isopropyl alcohol. This can change the surface energy of the painted surface enough for you to install the graphics. You may have to clean several times
• Slight heat can also change the surface energy
• Find out what type of paint(s) were used
• When was it painted. We should be waiting at LEAST 30 DAYS to allow for the paint to fully out gas.

Out gassing example.
You wash your blankets, throw them in the dryer and when you reach in they feel dry. But as you pull them out the parts in the center are still damp. This is what you have with fresh paint. To the touch it may feel dry but it really is not.



I can't stress enough that you just can't charge blindly into projects. Until EVERYONE doing what we do understands this and charges the appropriate price for everything the better off we ALL will be.



Now here is how this should have gone, in my opinion.

• Quote the project and include

1. Design Time
2. Product
3. Site inspection/Wall test
4. Installation
5. Travel

• Receive approval and down payment for project
• Design
• Approval
• Produce
• Install
• Collect balance due