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Design taken to another sign shop, should I say anything?

vinylink0331

vinylink0331

New Member
We recently did some work for a previous customer who had a white work van. In his words he wanted " To make it a huge billboard." He gave us some artwork that was so tiny I had to redraw the entire image out point by point. We actually worked on several different designs and finally came up with something that worked perfectly. Well, after we gave him the price, he took the layout, (which was already perfectly adjusted to fit his van, which was also in the proof) to another sign company and got them to do the exact same design. Not one thing was different. So should I mention it to the customer or just consider it a lesson learned.

We told him specifically that he could not just take our design to another shop without at least changing some aspect of it, so he knew it was wrong. I just seen it ride by like several minutes ago. We even called him back when we knew he was shopping around and knocked some money off of the price. We told him to at least call us to see if we could match the price since we had already done all the work. Well he never called back and you know the rest. Your opinions on this matter would help a lot.
Thanks.
 
Marlene

Marlene

New Member
sounds like you e-mailed him a file that could be used which is a huge bad idea. always make them small prints 4" or so at 72 res so that they are useless to anyone who makes an attempt to blow them up to use. how did you relay to them that they couldn't take this to shop prices or have it made? there's anotehr thread going on right now about artwork being taken that you might want to read thru as there's a lot of good info in it.
 
jiarby

jiarby

New Member
why are you doing layout before you get the job? You need to qualify the customer before burning any design calories.
 
vinylink0331

vinylink0331

New Member
Agreed

Thanks, for the advice. Yes, lesson learned for sure. From here on out, nothing gets designed without some payment up front. I'll check out those threads for advice. I'm not letting anyone else waste my time or take advantage of our business. We are changing all of our rules.
If people don't like it, so be it. I'm sure they don't expect to work for free, I know I'm not going to.
 
iSign

iSign

New Member
bill him, explain the other guys price was cheaper for a reason... your bill represents part of the reason... after that, if it was still cheaper... the remaining reason may start showing up in a year, when either the graphics fail, or the other sign business fails (or both)
 
Craig Sjoquist

Craig Sjoquist

New Member
What Jiarby said

When a customer says can you draw up a design ... you say cost of drawing up a design / layout is $$$$$... they go well we want to see what we are getting... you go I'll do some quick sketches to see if we are on the same track at that time payment and we go further.

This is a great reason for certification of sign shops....
 
C

CentralSigns

New Member
I had same kind of thing happen but I was on other end. Customer wanted a proof made so they could shop price with it. They come right out and said that, I couldn't believe it. The job was for a the town on a local project. I said I only do proofs for sign jobs I have a deposit on. They didn't want to give a deposit, and pushed that they needed to see my design to decide if they would go with me or not. I asked them what did they want for the design to look like or have in it. They had no idea what they wanted. Still they couldn't get the idea that I don't design for free, after a few days of emails, they stopped with that.

I held my ground, but two competitors gave them a design about a week later. They sent the designs to me asking for my price on each of them for me to produce, as seen in the competitors emails. They even sent the design with the competitors emails and prices attached, talk about balls. I told them I don't do business that way either, the designs they got from my competitors were their designs. If they want a design they would have to pay for design time, and I would love to produce something for them. Again they replied that unless I design a sign for them they couldn't go with me, they were looking to shop the best design around.

Hope this isn't the trend for the future in our industry. I wounder what would happen if I sent the emails back to the two competitors.:banghead:
 
Jillbeans

Jillbeans

New Member
Never design without a deposit.
Never design for free.
If you don't put a value on your work, neither will the client.
When you told him specifically that he could not take your design to another shop was this verbally or in writing?
Chalk it up to a lesson learned, you won't do it again I'm sure.
Love....Jill
 
Bigdawg

Bigdawg

Just Me
Just had this happen with a major development industrial park... I happen to have to pick up a package at the UPS hub which is out in the boondocks... I drive out there and there's my sign... exactly as I proofed it out to them 6 months ago... and before anyone starts saying "deposit please" there is no way the boss will start asking for deposits for monumnet sign proofs. Damn fools around here hand 'em out right and left and if we don't proof a big job like this with the bid... no chance of getting it. Just the way our economy is working down here.

This wasn't a cheapo either... we are discussing now what we can and will bill them for. I vote for all design time to arrive at the proof we finally settled on... which they said they didn't like and weren't going to pursue... damn liars.
 
signmeup

signmeup

New Member
I try to get them to see the logic in paying for a design and then shopping it around. That way they get the best price on the same design. Otherwise they're comparing apples to oranges.
 
Graphics2u

Graphics2u

New Member
signmeup said:
I try to get them to see the logic in paying for a design and then shopping it around. That way they get the best price on the same design. Otherwise they're comparing apples to oranges.
Click to expand...
I admit I'm bad about doing proofs with no deposit. However I'm in a smaller community, only shop within 30 miles and 90% of my business is from people I know, But I like this reasoning from signmeup. Get them to pay for design then shop.
 
Pat Whatley

Pat Whatley

New Member
Bill them, go ahead and accept the fact that they aren't going to pay the bill, sit back and decide if you want to take it to court or not. If you take it to small claims court be prepared for them not to show up so you'll win a default judgement. Ask the judge what in the hell good a default judgement is since it doesn't make them pay the bill. When the judge tells you that collections are your problem, not his, refrain from mumbling something about how f*&#(ed the judicial system is because judges have no problem collecting to contempt of court.
 
J

Just Another Sign Guy

New Member
i know a few ppl posting in this thread already know this because we have reviewed projects together but for the others...there are companies that do NOTHING else than design signs, specificy all of the materials, methods of construction and then send the drawings and specs out for bid to sign companiesl...and here's the kicker...they are paid HANDSOMELY for this service..and then there are shops that are giving away this service that could result in a very good chunk of change for them in annual sales...i understand others are doing it but it makes NO sense to me.
 
V

vroongraphics

New Member
I agree with Dan. Design can be a fair chunk of change over time. And with Jill, who said..."never design for free" -- my experience is that when you do it "for free" once, they will resent you for charging for your time in the future.
 
signcrafters london

signcrafters london

New Member
DanStriker said:
i know a few ppl posting in this thread already know this because we have reviewed projects together but for the others...there are companies that do NOTHING else than design signs, specificy all of the materials, methods of construction and then send the drawings and specs out for bid to sign companiesl...and here's the kicker...they are paid HANDSOMELY for this service..and then there are shops that are giving away this service that could result in a very good chunk of change for them in annual sales...i understand others are doing it but it makes NO sense to me.
Click to expand...
The kicker is that many clients accept that they have to pay the out-of-town design company big bucks for their design or logo. In fact, many brag about it. Then they want to haggle with me.
 
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