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I asked for YOU to quote the job...

Discussion in 'General Signmaking Topics' started by Bigdawg, Jul 2, 2012.

  1. Bigdawg

    Bigdawg Just Me

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    I sent a job out for quoting to a local CNC shop. First experience with them. The job is a lil complex and we aren't going to vectorize the job unless we actually get some money in my hand...

    But instead of quoting the job, I get a note back that he can't quote without vector art (understandable).

    He then tells me that he sent the job to Gemini to quote formed plastic (not what we asked for) and it will cost $850 from them - so he's sure he'll be cheaper than that if we get vector art.

    I'm irritated on a few levels! But mostly - WTH are you sending my artwork to Gemini for??? Or any other vendor??? Am I wrong in thinking he should have just declined to quote the job and suggested that I send it Gemini if I want formed plastic?

    Is it really appropriate to send the job to another vendor? or am I way off base for thinking there's not a chance I'll do business with a company that sends my artwork out to other vendors without my permission???
     
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  2. wildside

    wildside Very Active Member

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    i don't think they should have sent it off to gemini

    on the other hand, it could be said the same way as your customer came to you to get a quote, but you sent it off to another vendor.........
     
  3. ova

    ova Member

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    on the other hand, it could be said the same way as your customer came to you to get a quote, but you sent it off to another vendor.........[/QUOTE]

    Apples and Oranges.

    Her customer should not care how she gets the finished product to them. Doesn't matter if she does it in house or thru a wholesaler.

    On the other hand, she should have been notified of what the CNC guy was doing. Plus, I don't see how the CNC guy will make any money doing the job this way. He's supposed to already be doing it at whole sale rates.

    Dave
     
  4. Tigertron

    Tigertron Member

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    If I sub out I sure the heck don't tell the customer that.
     
  5. SD&F

    SD&F Very Active Member

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    Stacy,
    I think that you have the right to outsource and that your vendor should be straight up with you if they cannot do it. I do very little outsourcing so when I do, I do not want that handpicked vendor to do the same to me. They should have told you, but sometimes it is up to us to know what they can do.
     
  6. +1



    i don't tell my customers my large banners are from merritt.....
     
  7. Bigdawg

    Bigdawg Just Me

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    I guess if I had been asking for formed plastic I could understand... a little...

    but I wasn't. Ever.

    It kind of hit me as "Hey - I don't know what the price is going to be... but I sent it off to someone else so I could see what their price is" Just didn't think it was the right way to handle it.

    And I don't see it the same as outsourcing for my customer... apples and oranges in my mind.
     
  8. Gino

    Gino Major Contributor

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    Your second post sounds just about spot on................


    Sounds like someone has too much knowledge of how they think they can beat the norm and is just spewing forth terms hoping to dazzle you with their bullsh!t.

    I'd search a little further for a vendor which will not only work with you, but also be upfront with you. You want someone you can speak to, work with, turn a profit and most of all..... someone you can trust
     
  9. J Hill Designs

    J Hill Designs Major Contributor

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    no doubt. I can see them saying 'we cant complete the job without vector art' but they sure as heck should be able to give you a quote
     
  10. Brad Knight

    Brad Knight Member

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    Well, as a CNC guy, I would wholesale based on machine time (and material) in order to estimate the machine time i need the vectors in order to do at least rough toolpath - especially on complicated jobs.
     
  11. Gino

    Gino Major Contributor

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    C'mon.... you mean you can't look at a jpeg and make an educated estimate and maybe just bid it a tad high in case you're off a bit ??
     
  12. Techman

    Techman Major Contributor

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    IF the troops fail to execute and the objective is not clear,, the general is at fault.

    If the troops fail to execute and it is obvious by their actions that objective was misleading or misunderstood,, it is the generals fault.

    If the troops fail to execute and the mandated objective was only perfectly clear according to the general,, it is the generals fault.

    If the troops fail to execute and the objective was perfectly clear then it is time to retrain the troops.

    There is no other outcome.. possible when the objective is perfectly clear.
     
  13. Techman

    Techman Major Contributor

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    oh yes..

    Using a cnc as a glorified jig saw??? Rough guess? yup,,, Reliable accurate quote??? Nope.

    The cnc software is so good now that a proper vector will give a reasonable actual time it will take thus giving a good quote.. CNC work is not a guessable activity. Anybody who plays the guessing game will always underbid..

    I am willing to wager he was trying to give you an accurate guess on how much to expect to pay using gemini as a base line. He was trying to help you out since you sent him some speculation work.
     
  14. Rick

    Rick Certified Enneadecagon Designer

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    As a former CNC guy, I did not require vectors to quote a job... i've sent 300 page submittals with thousands of signs that required CNC and at no time did they need every layout to quote. phoooey!
     
  15. Locals Find!

    Locals Find! Very Active Member

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    I would have to say the guy sounds like he was being very open and honest with you. He wasn't sure where to bid the job based on the available information. So, he got a quote to form a baseline for the job. Saying, he would come in less than what they quoted. This is a good thing.

    He didn't have to reveal to you his methods and, probably shouldn't have. Although I don't think he should be faulted for being upfront and openly honest about how he reached his numbers.

    Sometimes, in life & in business people get so used to being pissed off at everything & everyone they forget what old fashioned honesty in business looks like.

    Time to have a :toasting: and relax.
     
  16. i fly by the seat of my pants allot, and usually overbid....

    back to the topic, sure probably apples to oranges, but i think your being a little too sensitive, i mean it's not like he sent a picture of you in your skivee's...
     
  17. FS-Keith

    FS-Keith Active Member

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    agreed
     
  18. Scott Reynolds

    Scott Reynolds Active Member

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    How was cnc work quoted back before "cnc software was so good"? Lets say back when it was just G code and stepper motors. Im not trying to fan the flames, Im genuinely curious. Scott
     
  19. FireSprint

    FireSprint Very Active Member

    +1

    For one reason or another, he couldn't quote it. This might be due to lack of experience or maybe he really couldn't. I'm not a CNC Guy, I don't know. It was good of him to check the competition for you and be open about it.
     
  20. skyhigh

    skyhigh Major Contributor

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    Sounds like he was trying to help you out.....possibly giving you other avenues.
    All artwork with Gemini should be confidential, as a wholesale only company.

    As for not being to give you a quote......hmmmm, I give quotes without vector artwork, but perhaps this was really complicated? I wouldn't think so, if Gemini offers something similar.
    or he's really anal with precise quotes. I may give a range, if I was unsure...... like $250-$300 as an example
     
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