Installation Guide

[LoGl]

Hi...we recently hired someone to start doing installations for us. Of course Signs 101 is a great resource, but I wondered if anyone had any recommended installation resources they could suggest.

For example: Books, particular companies websites (years ago Laminators, Inc. had put out a great booklet I still have), youtube channels, etc.

I would like for him to be able to do some research prior to needing the information for a particular job. A few hours a week spent learning some of the industry not just in a "carpentry" kind of way. My husband is a GC and doesn't always look at sign installs the same way as we do, especially when it needs to be aesthetically pleasing. He often has great tips, but I am hoping to point our guy in the direction of great sign installs...from blade signs to window lettering, to fabricating with pvc, mdf, etc.

Any suggestions are appreciated.

 

[ikarasu]

Hi...we recently hired someone to start doing installations for us. Of course Signs 101 is a great resource, but I wondered if anyone had any recommended installation resources they could suggest.

For example: Books, particular companies websites (years ago Laminators, Inc. had put out a great booklet I still have), youtube channels, etc.

I would like for him to be able to do some research prior to needing the information for a particular job. A few hours a week spent learning some of the industry not just in a "carpentry" kind of way. My husband is a GC and doesn't always look at sign installs the same way as we do, especially when it needs to be aesthetically pleasing. He often has great tips, but I am hoping to point our guy in the direction of great sign installs...from blade signs to window lettering, to fabricating with pvc, mdf, etc.

Any suggestions are appreciated.

Youtube, is what I use. When I first started to do installs... I had 2 guys at the shop teach me different ways to vinyl. both in their 50s... I then went to a 3M wrapping course, and was taught a 3rd way. Then I saw on you tube a couple more ways.... Every person will approach, and do installs differently. What works for one, won't always work for others... Generally youtube is pretty good with the basics. Not just 1 channel, but a general search of something such as window perf install brings up dozens of people showing you how. I use a little bit from each person, and I now have my own way of doing installs.

In the day and age of google... you can search for any type of install + instructions, and find some good resources. If your installer is a good one.... he'll see what others are doing wrong (If they are) And learn how to adjust accordingly.

Probably not the answer you were hoping for... But I'm not aware of a 1 site-fits-all for installations. Different companies specialize in different areas... It would be nice to have 1 site with tutorials though, wouldn't it?

 

[player]

Good for you for asking. There is so much more to installing signs than it looks. The fact that the faces catch wind and as you go larger the forces increase exponentially is something one must consider.

Try this book to start:

https://www.amazon.ca/Engineering-Sign-Structures-Introduction-Analysis/dp/0944094309

It is a very valuable resource. Especially if you are hiring engineers who are not familiar with the sign trade.

 

[LoGl]

Good for you for asking. There is so much more to installing signs than it looks. The fact that the faces catch wind and as you go larger the forces increase exponentially is something one must consider.

Try this book to start:

https://www.amazon.ca/Engineering-Sign-Structures-Introduction-Analysis/dp/0944094309

It is a very valuable resource. Especially if you are hiring engineers who are not familiar with the sign trade.

Thank you for this! This looks like just the type of book we need! I realize that you can google/youtube specific installs, but some basic principles are so essential! Obviously doing this for many years, you learn a million ways to do things, but I was hoping to find some direct references. And when I am saying installs....it is everything from free-standing signs, to walls (dealing with brick, concrete, stucco, etc.) issues, as well as vinyl films, etc.

It would be great if it were all compiled somewhere!! This book recomendation looks like a great start! So thank you!

 

[2B]

there is tread right now with some valuable tips in the correct installation methods

http://www.signs101.com/forums/showthread.php?133182-Level-or-Parallel-for-parking-garage-signage

 

[Jester1167]

There are some good videos in the link below along with http://www.robivers.com/store/info-tools/

http://www.signs101.com/forums/showthread.php?132969-Best-Installation-Videos

Nothing can replace hands on experience. I suggest asking all your material and equipment suppliers if they are hosting any training classes. Avery and Mutoh have training classes all over the country. 3M will often team up with Glantz, Tubelite or other suppliers to host classes. These are typically but not always short classes with a lot of people and the supplies you get can offset some or all of the cost. Your installers won't get a lot of one on one hands on time but they will learn quite a bit.

A lot of times you can get training at tradeshows as well. Walking the show floor seeing the demonstrations and talking with other installers can be priceless.

The highest cost and most benefit is muti-day training courses; Justin Pate, Rob Ivers, Geek Wraps, Lowen, 3M, Elite Wrappers... These are the types of training you send an owner or lead installer to. You want one loyal person in the shop that will be around for years and can train all the other employees because it an investment.

The key to the whole process is to know and understand the basics so you can evaluate the other sources. There is a lot of bad information out there, including here. The loudest and most forceful voices/posts aren't always right.

As an example; some reputable installers use Denatured Alcohol for final cleaning. I was taught to use Isopropyl Alcohol because denatured alcohol has additives in it to make it undrinkable. Each manufacture adds something different and typically it is some kind of petroleum distillate that can leave a slight oily film.

Remember, this industry is constantly changing, technology, inks, materials, and techniques. Education is a lifelong pursuit.

 

[SeanMcM]

There are some good videos in the link below along with http://www.robivers.com/store/info-tools/

http://www.signs101.com/forums/showthread.php?132969-Best-Installation-Videos

Nothing can replace hands on experience. I suggest asking all your material and equipment suppliers if they are hosting any training classes. Avery and Mutoh have training classes all over the country. 3M will often team up with Glantz, Tubelite or other suppliers to host classes. These are typically but not always short classes with a lot of people and the supplies you get can offset some or all of the cost. Your installers won't get a lot of one on one hands on time but they will learn quite a bit.

A lot of times you can get training at tradeshows as well. Walking the show floor seeing the demonstrations and talking with other installers can be priceless.

The highest cost and most benefit is muti-day training courses; Justin Pate, Rob Ivers, Geek Wraps, Lowen, 3M, Elite Wrappers... These are the types of training you send an owner or lead installer to. You want one loyal person in the shop that will be around for years and can train all the other employees because it an investment.

The key to the whole process is to know and understand the basics so you can evaluate the other sources. There is a lot of bad information out there, including here. The loudest and most forceful voices/posts aren't always right.

As an example; some reputable installers use Denatured Alcohol for final cleaning. I was taught to use Isopropyl Alcohol because denatured alcohol has additives in it to make it undrinkable. Each manufacture adds something different and typically it is some kind of petroleum distillate that can leave a slight oily film.

Remember, this industry is constantly changing, technology, inks, materials, and techniques. Education is a lifelong pursuit.

Slightly off topic but I some times notice after cleaning a window with Isopropyl Alcohol it leaves an oily film like you said, the only way i have found to remove that film is to give it a thorough rub down with a dry cloth. This is the Isoprpyl Alcohol we use http://www.viponds.com.au/digital-print-prep-products.

Are there better options out there that do not leave this film? This doesn't happen on every window i clean with this Alcohol tho.

 

[player]

Slightly off topic but I some times notice after cleaning a window with Isopropyl Alcohol it leaves an oily film like you said, the only way i have found to remove that film is t o give it a thorough rub down with a dry cloth. This is the Isoprpyl Alcohol we use http://www.viponds.com.au/digital-print-prep-products.

Are there better options out there that do not leave this film? This doesn't happen on every window i clean with this Alcohol tho.

The isopropyl alcohol to use is 99.9% isopropyl alcohol.

It's fairly cheap. You can usually find it at drug stores.

 

[Jester1167]

Slightly off topic but I some times notice after cleaning a window with Isopropyl Alcohol it leaves an oily film like you said, the only way i have found to remove that film is to give it a thorough rub down with a dry cloth. This is the Isoprpyl Alcohol we use http://www.viponds.com.au/digital-print-prep-products.

Are there better options out there that do not leave this film? This doesn't happen on every window i clean with this Alcohol tho.

The haze isn't the alcohols fault, it's the process. You just loosened all the dirt and spread it in a nice even but streaky film all over the window. By using a clean dry towel or the clean backside of your towel you end up polishing off the rest of the dirt. This will happen on large dirty windows or if your not getting clean rags often enough. Your also doing the same thing when you clean any other substrate, its just not noticeable. I was taught to clean with one rag dipped in a bucket of alcohol and rung out so it is damp, not dripping in one hand. I use a second dry rag to pick up the contaminants in the other hand. Think wax on wax off if you're old enough to remember the Karate Kid.

As far 99% alcohol, we always used 70% in the Midwest. 70% is cheaper and it doesn't flash of as quick in the heat. Down here in Florida when it's humid I have to use 90% to get it to dry.