Limac laser VS big bands

[bigben]

I've contacted Limac that is a merchant member here. I understand that CNC routing is their specialty, but I'm looking for a laser.

I've been quoted for a 4ftX3ft table, 80w, industrial water chiller, red ray positioning, automatic focus, up/down clump table and rotary axis. The price is 5655$usd without the shipping.
If I go with a trotec machine with the same specifications/options, the price is more in the 20k$ range (I did not have an official quote yet).

This will be my first laser. I understand the ''parts quality'' statement, but what it really means? No one in either sides had a real answer about this.

thanks for the help.

Ben

 

[CES020]

I think you better go with the Limac if you are shopping on price. A 4' x 3' Trotec would be a Speedy 500 and they are more than $60,000, if I remember correctly.

You can't even buy the smallest one they make for that amount of money.

 

[CanuckSigns]

I think you better go with the Limac if you are shopping on price. A 4' x 3' Trotec would be a Speedy 500 and they are more than $60,000, if I remember correctly.

You can't even buy the smallest one they make for that amount of money.

Yeah I was going to say, I just bought 2 speedy 300's 2 years ago, they start at around $20,000 or so, for a 45 watt with a 28"x17" table.

however, the trotec does have a better warrantee, and there is a tech in Montreal, not sure how far that is from you.

 

[fixtureman]

I would check with G Weike and see what it would be. They have very good feed back and always willing to help If you need it to be setup and some training then Rabbit laser is the place to go.

 

[bigben]

Yeah I was going to say, I just bought 2 speedy 300's 2 years ago, they start at around $20,000 or so, for a 45 watt with a 28"x17" table.

however, the trotec does have a better warrantee, and there is a tech in Montreal, not sure how far that is from you.

I've never had a laser before and never operate one. I'm a total newbie in that department. I'm trying to figure out what would be the difference with the chinese laser and a big brand. If it was for a solvent printer, I know the print quality is not the same due that the most chinese manufacturer use old technologies (print head, ink, etc.). But I don't know what would be the difference in the laser system.

Also, what kind of problems I could have with laser? Is this why there is such a price difference? Does a laser is more like a vinyl cutter and you just need to change the tubes and mirrors at a certain moment? I always fixed my printers and other equipment myself. How hard does a laser could be to fix if there is a problem?

I am on the Montreal south shore, so having service from the big brands is not a problem.

 

[player]

I've never had a laser before and never operate one. I'm a total newbie in that department. I'm trying to figure out what would be the difference with the chinese laser and a big brand. If it was for a solvent printer, I know the print quality is not the same due that the most chinese manufacturer use old technologies (print head, ink, etc.). But I don't know what would be the difference in the laser system.

Also, what kind of problems I could have with laser? Is this why there is such a price difference? Does a laser is more like a vinyl cutter and you just need to change the tubes and mirrors at a certain moment? I always fixed my printers and other equipment myself. How hard does a laser could be to fix if there is a problem?

I am on the Montreal south shore, so having service from the big brands is not a problem.

Actually the Chinese printers use the latest Epson DX7 heads. The print qualities are reported by owners on this forum to be the same or better than their brand name printers.

 

[CES020]

There are huge differences in Chinese machines and name brand machines. The differences are great and it all depends on your budget and your use for it. If you're just getting started and are taking the risk, and don't know whether it'll take off or not, it might not be worth dropping $$$$ for a machine. However, if you're business depends on it, then it might make more sense to go with a name brand. You can fix something on them, some things you can't. Just depends on what's bad. For the most part, lasers just run, so it's like like a printer where you deal with ink related issues.

The main brands will produce higher quality on some ends of the spectrum, and other things, you won't be able to tell the difference. It's like photography. If you are showing people 4" x 6" prints, then there's probably no way anyone will be able to tell if the photo was taken with a $75 point and shoot camera or a $7,500 DSLR. However, if skin tone is important in the photo and you're making posters, then you'll see why one is better. Same thing here. If you're just cutting, then there's not going to be much difference. If you engrave a lot of things, you might see that gap get further apart on quality issues. The Chinese machines don't do well at the very low end of their power settings, and don't do well at the high end either. So if you are engraving small, delicate things, then you might have issues. If you are running at 100% power, then you'll burn your tube up on the Chinese machine. I think they run best above 15% power and below 80-85% power.

The answer is "it depends". I'm not sure I'd spent the $$$ on something I didn't know anything about. I'd probably pick up a main stream used machine and learn on that, then decide if the business warrants buying a more expensive machine.

Just my opinion, but I don't know you, your business, or your budget, so my opinion might not fit you at all.

 

[CanuckSigns]

I've never had a laser before and never operate one. I'm a total newbie in that department. I'm trying to figure out what would be the difference with the chinese laser and a big brand. If it was for a solvent printer, I know the print quality is not the same due that the most chinese manufacturer use old technologies (print head, ink, etc.). But I don't know what would be the difference in the laser system.

Also, what kind of problems I could have with laser? Is this why there is such a price difference? Does a laser is more like a vinyl cutter and you just need to change the tubes and mirrors at a certain moment? I always fixed my printers and other equipment myself. How hard does a laser could be to fix if there is a problem?

I am on the Montreal south shore, so having service from the big brands is not a problem.

I've only ever owned Trotec lasers, so i can't comment on any other brands. But from what i've read about the cheap chinese machines, the quality is like night and day, i've seen pictures on engraving forums where people bought chinese lasers for $2000 and some of the picture they posted were pretty bad, one of them used hot melt glue on all the electrical connections, just imagine what happens after running the machine for 4-5 hours...

we just recently had an issue with one of our trotec machines, the tech figured out it was a bad power supply, checked his stock and all he had in Canada was from the same lot #, so instead of installing one they had and couldn't guarantee would work, they overnighted us 2 new power supplies FROM AUSTRIA (where the machines are made) and come by to install them 2 days later, all of this was completly covered under the 3 year warantee, not a penny out of my pocket. Will the chinese company do that?

Edit: I should mention that our 2 lasers run pretty much all say every day, they are our bread and butter, so to us, minimal downtime is the most important factor, and we have found Trotec to be the best for that. If that is not your top priority, you may be perfectly fine with a lower end machine.

 

[bigben]

wow thanks guys for the last 2 post. Very good information.

With that been said, I will mostly use the laser to cut and engrave on acrylic sheets for dimensional sign and office plaque. I also make my own LED backlit snap frame and I will use the laser to engrave my acrylic sheet for light diffusion. I don't think I will use it to engrave any kind of pictures. It never cross my mind I could do this with a laser. So my cutting and engraving will be fairly simple I think.

 

[CanuckSigns]

wow thanks guys for the last 2 post. Very good information.

With that been said, I will mostly use the laser to cut and engrave on acrylic sheets for dimensional sign and office plaque. I also make my own LED backlit snap frame and I will use the laser to engrave my acrylic sheet for light diffusion. I don't think I will use it to engrave any kind of pictures. It never cross my mind I could do this with a laser. So my cutting and engraving will be fairly simple I think.

What thickness of acrylic would you be cutting? with an 80 watt machine, I doubt you could cut much more than 3/8" thick, we have a 100 watt and it will do 0.5" thick in a pinch, but the edges are less than perfect, but it will but 3/8" all day long

 

[bigben]

What thickness of acrylic would you be cutting? with an 80 watt machine, I doubt you could cut much more than 3/8" thick, we have a 100 watt and it will do 0.5" thick in a pinch, but the edges are less than perfect, but it will but 3/8" all day long

I will mainly cut 1/4 and 1/8 acrylic. For the engraving part, it will be mostly text and simple vector design. Does 80watt will be enough and have a reasonable speed?

 

[CES020]

Depends on whether it's Chinese or not. Remember what I said, Chinese tell you not to run their machines at 100% power, so you have to come down to 85% or something like that or you're cause the tube to prematurely fail. So you'd have to knock 15% (or whatever their magic number is, might be 80%, might be 90%, I guessed at 85%), so you won't be getting 80W of cutting power with a 80W Chinese laser. Probably closer to 65W. 65W will cut 1/8" all day, 1/4" decent, 3/8" slowly, 1/2" very slowly.

 

[fixtureman]

I have a 60 watt LG 500 and I cut 3/8 very easy with it. A big name won't cut any faster either.

 

[CES020]

I have a 60 watt LG 500 and I cut 3/8 very easy with it. A big name won't cut any faster either.

Yes and no, as per the information I listed above. If you are running 80W on any machine, then cutting is going to be about the same speed. However, if the Chinese 80W tells you not to run it at 100% power, but to run it at 80% power, then yes, the 80W non Chinese machine is going to cut faster than the machine that's been cut back to 80% of 80W. In theory, yes, they will all cut about the same speed (engraving times is the benefit of a faster machine), but in reality once you have to stay below the recommended power setting, then yes, a non Chinese machine will cut slightly faster than the Chinese machine.

 

[fixtureman]

Depending on the job. If you have a job cutting 200 parts consistently then 2 Chinese lasers would be a lot faster and far less money than 1 big name laser. Most of my jobs are in the 100 to 200 piece range

 

[CES020]

Depending on the job. If you have a job cutting 200 parts consistently then 2 Chinese lasers would be a lot faster and far less money than 1 big name laser. Most of my jobs are in the 100 to 200 piece range

I'm not debating the value of 1,2, or 50 machines vs. 1. I'm simply stating the facts about actual cutting when comparing the two.

I think a Chinese machine is the best value for the OP, so don't try and paint me into a debate about one vs. the other.

 

[bigben]

Depending on the job. If you have a job cutting 200 parts consistently then 2 Chinese lasers would be a lot faster and far less money than 1 big name laser. Most of my jobs are in the 100 to 200 piece range

Do you own a chinese laser? I'm trying to find someone in north america to have some feedback.

 

[SignManiac]

Last year I looked into the Chinese lasers. I called a sign shop that bought a Rabbit Laser and asked them about the unit they bought. They had nothing but good things to say about it and they had been running it for three years. I'm sure there are a few other shops out there running them. Keep asking and make some calls to real end users. I've done a ton of research on them and there are pros and cons. Price is great, quality may not be 100% good as some other name brands. It's a tool, if it does the job then that's good enough for me. I see so many shops with top of the line tools doing awful work. Garbage in, garbage out. Give me a good jig saw and I'll make a beautiful sign with it! But I still prefer using the CNC router

 

[artbot]

you can see many different models on youtube. there's the occasional horror story. but, generally they look like they are very simple machines that are ready to do work.

https://www.youtube.com/results?search_query=chinese+laser+review

 

[CES020]

Rabbits are known to be one of the companies that has a guy in the USA running it that is on top of things. He's known for being a stand up guy and standing behind his products. I've never dealt with him, but I've never seen a single unhappy customer of his. On the contrary, I've seen a large number of posts praising him.