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Need Help Mimaki UCJV-300 vs Epson 80600

Discussion in 'Mimaki' started by Bobzo, Mar 2, 2018.

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  1. Bobzo

    Bobzo New Member

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    Mar 2, 2018
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    Hi all,

    we're looking for a new printer to replace our JV33 on 2x CMYK.

    After reading a lot en seeing a lot we came to the conclusion we go for the Epson 80600 because we're familair with eco-sol inks ...but our Mimaki dealer came back in interest with an proposal for the new UCJV300-160 led-UV printer. Sure I've read the post of the first Italian placed @ Decomurale & andre80 machines but someone else who can share his or here ideas about the 2 or share there opinions or can enlighten us?

    Our primarly market are posters, backlit en sticker for fast promotions.

    Thx in advance.

    Sorry for my bad English!
     
    Last edited: Mar 2, 2018
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  2. Modern Ink Signs

    Modern Ink Signs Member

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    Just an FYI............

    I tested some 3MIJ180cv3 printed on the Mimaki. I would NEVER buy it.

    In my testing I found that the vinyl takes on the characteristics of the ink. Brittle!!! I could not get an unlaminated piece off the backer without it tearing into small pieces. I then laminated with 8518 and did a stretch test. 15% stretch is the best I could get before failure of ink.

    No. No. No. Run from that machine the Mimaki UCJV300-160 led-UV printer (in my opinion).
     
    • Like Like x 1
  3. CanuckSigns

    CanuckSigns Very Active Member

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    I have no experience with the Mimaki, but I have run an Epson 80600 for the past 8 months, it's been amazing for us so far!
     
  4. Bobzo

    Bobzo New Member

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  5. CanuckSigns

    CanuckSigns Very Active Member

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    With the orange and red inks in the Epson, you will end up with a much better looking final product than from a UV printer, ours is photo quality and its very fast.

    I'm not super familiar with UV roll to roll printers, but can they even print on poster paper? I would have thought the ink was too brittle
     
  6. Bobzo

    Bobzo New Member

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    @CanuckSigns Thx for your reply!

    Like mentioned above our primarly taget is really fast production of posters, backlit en sticker for fast promotions.
    If you don't mind I have some questions;
    -when you print a poster, sticker etc, after how many time all the inks are dry to cut or cutcontour espially when a client use 100% CMYK in their files?
    -are the white inks really stable and not clogging the inks head regurly?
    -is the Epson callcenter/yourexperience with Epson technicians good?
    -I'm sure all printer have their pro's and con's but I'm/we really like the dry/ready to take off the printer and cut/work/apply (mimaki UJCV)!

     
  7. Bobzo

    Bobzo New Member

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    Oww, yes they can!
    Today I saw an print on normal 80grams (EU) office paper = looks good but the paper itself.... grrrr
     
  8. CanuckSigns

    CanuckSigns Very Active Member

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    We have noticed the inks are pretty much dry as soon as they clear the dryer on the printer, I have been known to print full bleed decals and cut them straight away, it does cause edge curling on some vinyl, but that is true on any eco sol machine. We started using a 6 mil vinyl from general formulations for these types of decals and it avoids the edge curling completely.

    I have never used white ink in any of my printers so I can't answer anything about that.

    We havnt had any issues that require a tech visit yet, but we deal with the dealer here, not epson directly
     
    • Informative Informative x 1
  9. Snydo

    Snydo Member

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    -when you print a poster, sticker etc, after how many time all the inks are dry to cut or cutcontour espially when a client use 100% CMYK in their files?
    If you wait an hour or two before cutting you will be fine, solid black maybe wait 3 hours.

    -is the Epson callcenter/yourexperience with Epson technicians good?
    Epson will set up a service call with a third-party company called Decision One. Our experience with them has been excellent, usually prompt, next day repair on warrantied machines, and less than a week on out-of-warranty machines.

    -I'm sure all printer have their pro's and con's but I'm/we really like the dry/ready to take off the printer and cut/work/apply (mimaki UJCV)!
    You may want to consider sticking with a 4 color machine. I did alot of research last year on white ink and you will need a pretty special situation for it to be profitable with either the Mimaki or the Epson.
    We have a SureColor 60600 and have been extremely pleased in the first year. High quality prints at staggering speed and you can laminate immediately if needed but I would highly suggest giving some dry time on heavy coverage jobs.
     
    • Informative Informative x 1
  10. Signvinyl

    Signvinyl New Member

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    Just wondering if you can share more concrete details why do you advise to stay away from UCJV machine and where did you found the problems? Do you own UCJV300 or did you work with it?
    I saw some full car wrapping jobs at exhibition in Germany, done with UCJV300 and LUS-170 printed on Avery 1105 and laminated with DOL1460. I must say the result is amazing. The car wrapping was done by Avery certified car wrapping company. No ink cracks at stretching and high temperature, and the colors are brilliant.

    So just curious if you can share some more concreted details about your bad experience with UCJV300.
     
    • Informative Informative x 1
  11. Signvinyl

    Signvinyl New Member

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    I highly recommend you to have a demo at Mimaki office in Diemen. They do a great demo presentation and look with you into your application needs.

    UCJV300 pros:
    - UV curing = print is instantly dry and ready for processing on unlimited materials, either coated or uncoated.
    - Fully automated print and cut machine in one = compact, no interruption from operator for changing the pinch rollers position between print and cut, etc.
    - UV-LED = possible to print on uncoated (read = cheap) media w/o loosing the print quality. Try to print on SC80600 on e.g. uncoated poster paper.
    - UV white ink has better density coverage compared to solvent = great for transparent applications
    - Outdoor durability of UV is better than solvent = no need for lamination for outdoor applications
    - Great application of printing 4- and 5-layers for backlit and windows advertisement applications
    - RIP and Cut software is free of charge and includded with machine
    - RUNNING COSTS = Mimaki LUS-170 ink is much cheaper compared to EPSON GS3 ink. Moreover, you do not need heaters for drying the ink, therefore energy costs is much lower.
    - Great technical support coverage in BNLX by certified service partners
    - Full 2-year warranty, including heads

    SC80600 pros:
    - Slightly faster, but you loose this advantage because of drying time needed for solvent before lamination or cutting the stickers.
    - Color gamut is slightly better because of spot colors
     
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  12. jfiscus

    jfiscus Adobe Shinobi

    The 60600 has the best (warranted) inks. In my opinion, do NOT get the 80600 as those extra inks have no warranty and will fade. We looked at all 3M MCS warranted printers prior to our latest printer purchase (Epson 60600) and although the UV printers have certain nice points to them, they really aren't made for printing wraps or going over compound curves, it just doesn't stretch.
     
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  13. CanuckSigns

    CanuckSigns Very Active Member

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    The 2 printers use the same ink, with the exception of the Orange & Red in the S80600, which are by far the least used inks in the machine (I change out 2-4 CMYK carts to every 1 orange) Do you have any specs or anything showing the orange & red inks are less durable?
     
  14. jfiscus

    jfiscus Adobe Shinobi

    They are not covered under the MCS warranty, and therefore are not warranteed to last ANY amount of time. I've seen orange fade in as little as 6 months outdoors from previous generation Epson printers.
     
    • Informative Informative x 1
  15. Decomurale

    Decomurale Custom wallpaper shop

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    Hi

    I know you have read my posts about the UCJV but I have updated it as of yesterday.
    Our machine is now running top notch. Mimaki has found the problem and resolved our issues. It was a feed belt adjustment.

    I would like to tell you that we had an Epson Sure Color S60600 CMYK and had to return it for one specific reason - the inks are very very fragile. If you want to deliver prints without lamination this is not the right machine for you. I have another post about this on this forum. I have even uploaded videos showing the printed results and how they scuff so easily. I must say and will repeat however that the print quality and print speed of the s60 is next to none in its category. We were printing great quality at 380sq feet per hour (4 pass). The print technology is the best I have ever seen. The colours were better than our latex 560. The actual build quality and take up system, material roll feed system, structure and functionality is also the best I have ever seen. And of course the price is increadibly low. This printer could easily sell for much more considering what you get. However for anyone doing wall murals, window graphics etc and that need to apply pressure on the finished print during installation it is impossible to do so without scratching the inks. I was so disappointed. I was expecting ink technology to be much better than the Roland Eco sol max 2 that we were used to given the advertising that is used “solvent printing solved” and ready in 4 hours. We thought for sure the solidity of the inks would be somewhere between Roland and latex inks but that was not the case. We still love the Epson S60 but unfortunately everything that comes off this printer needs lamination. Even the canvas prints we did scratched after 2 weeks of drying. So I guess if you want to do vehicle wraps and other things that require lamination the Epson would be the best thing out there right now. But if you need print and cut, posters and instant delivery without lamination the UCJV is your best option, hands down. The quality is great and the inks are virtually indestructible.
     
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  16. Modern Ink Signs

    Modern Ink Signs Member

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    Waukesha, WI
    Hey SignVinyl....

    I only tested a few pieces provided to me by my vendor. AS mentioned it was 3MIJ180cv3

    I was NOT IMPRESSED by what I saw and as I mentioned, in doing my tests I personally would not purchase such a machine
     
  17. Signvinyl

    Signvinyl New Member

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    Feb 15, 2018
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    I'm not sure who provided you with the printed samples, but I'm pretty sure you've got a very bad prepared/dried samples :).

    If you seriously would like test it, contact one of Mimaki dealers who can send you a good qualitative samples printed on 3MIJ180. I'm pretty sure you would change your mind :)
     
  18. Bly

    Bly Very Active Member

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    So what's the white ink like in these Epsons?
    Is it opaque enough for window stickers on clear vinyl?
     
  19. Bobzo

    Bobzo New Member

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    Mar 2, 2018
    Netherlands
    About clogging and maintenance I can not tell.
    About opaque sure its is with less than 1.8m production per hour. So if you produce a lot with white ink I think the're better solutions (also at a higher cost).
     
    • Agree Agree x 1
  20. ProColorGraphics

    ProColorGraphics Very Active Member

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    I have white in my Epson S70. It works well enough for doing decals on clear vinyl. It's not super opaque, that's for sure. I do have a few jobs that I consistently use for and don't have any complaints. I have silver in my S80, but have heard the white is a little better in the new ones.
     
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