Nissan NV material recommendation

[Zakk]

We have been having considerable difficulty finding a good vinyl for the deep channels on a Nissan NV cargo van. We are doing a full wrap (roof and all) have tried Avery 1005 (with pre and post heating exactly per Avery's specs), Arlon 6000, and Oracal 3751. So far, the Oracal seems the best, but still has some bubbles starting to form after just one day. I am trying to avoid using 3M due to their decision to compete with their customers via their Original Wraps project. We have not used any primer (any options other than the 3M primer worth trying, if you recommend this?)

I am hoping to get some feedback from those who have had first hand experience with wrapping a Nissan NV, but certainly welcome all input. If you have a different vinyl or specific technique that you have used on an NV or similar vehicle (maybe a Sprinter), please share exact details.

Thank you!

 

[SightLine]

First do not use primer with Oracal.... not compatable with their adhesive.

Use Oracal 3951, Avery 1005, or the best 3M option for that bit is the IJ380 but 180 will stay down fine as well with primer. Pair the base vinyl with one of the thinner 1 to 1.5 mil laminates. If not going with an ultr-thin combo you may have to cut/drop into the channel. If you or your client object the the marginal visible paint then you can print a few narrow crops of the design to lay in first then cut and drop.

 

[jfiscus]

We did two with regular 180c and they have had no problems. I'm not sure how experienced your installer is, but these do take an installer who is experienced with applying wraps into the deep grooves correctly.

 

[Zakk]

First do not use primer with Oracal.... not compatable with their adhesive.

Use Oracal 3951, Avery 1005, or the best 3M option for that bit is the IJ380 but 180 will stay down fine as well with primer. Pair the base vinyl with one of the thinner 1 to 1.5 mil laminates. If not going with an ultr-thin combo you may have to cut/drop into the channel. If you or your client object the the marginal visible paint then you can print a few narrow crops of the design to lay in first then cut and drop.

Thanks for your input. We have tested 3751 and Avery 1005, but never 3951. I gather there is a big difference between the 3751 and 3951, is that right? Just today, we tried the IJ180 without primer and it seemed to confirm and hold pretty well (only checked for about an hour indoors) though I have read that this material will not hold contours too well without the primer. The 380 is a bit too pricey for my likings so I am hoping another option will work plus I have read that it is a bit too soft to wrap a whole vehicle with (not sure if there is any truth to that). Also, I try to avoid 3M wrap due to their business practices.

 

[mudmedia]

Thanks for your input. We have tested 3751 and Avery 1005, but never 3951. I gather there is a big difference between the 3751 and 3951, is that right? Just today, we tried the IJ180 without primer and it seemed to confirm and hold pretty well (only checked for about an hour indoors) though I have read that this material will not hold contours too well without the primer. The 380 is a bit too pricey for my likings so I am hoping another option will work plus I have read that it is a bit too soft to wrap a whole vehicle with (not sure if there is any truth to that). Also, I try to avoid 3M wrap due to their business practices.

If you think 380 is expensive...Do not even try to look into 480. It is twice as much as 180...Outrageous

 

[Zakk]

We did two with regular 180c and they have had no problems. I'm not sure how experienced your installer is, but these do take an installer who is experienced with applying wraps into the deep grooves correctly.

Did you use any adhesive promoter? Any chance you could show some close up photos of the deep contours, especially in the corners? My installer is pretty experienced, but everyone has room to increase their knowledge. Can you describe your technique that worked for you (temp, stretching/tenting, etc...?) Thanks so much.

 

[Zakk]

If you think 380 is expensive...Do not even try to look into 480. It is twice as much as 180...Outrageous

Yeah, tell me about it. I am not opposed to spending money if it is worth it, I just really hope that there is a way to do this without have to buy the most expensive material out there or it will be very hard to compete (price-wise) with the hacks that will use anything. Particularly on the Nissan NV since Nissan has 3m selling wraps directly for less than it costs me to make it.

 

[Wraptrick]

Might want to check your numbers again, IJ480 is definitely not 2x as expensive as IJ180.. and it's cheaper than IJ380. Plus they claim 'no lifting'. Whether or not that's true is another debate.

 

[jkdbjj]

Avery has 3 types of lam, and I believe they have one specifically for this application. Don't know the number off hand.
Then there is the technique. Some simple inlay separate pieces, and are happy with that, they explain to the customers the pros and cons, and then go from there.

If you or the customer are insistent about no inlays, you simply have to use the correct laminate. You need a heat gun, not a torch, and preferably a wrap glove or something you can get wet with soapy water.
You'll need to poke a hole on one of the corners of the channels, top right most area. Start heating and pressing from the center and move all air towards the hole.

This may sound elementary, but it is an excellent way to approach these areas.

Is this what you are already doing? If not, explain the approach you are doing.

 

[Zakk]

Thanks for the detailed response. I hate inlays and have never/will never do them unless a client really wants it. I just think they look awful. We are using the 1360 which is the 1.3 mil lam. We are also using a heat gun and a digital thermometer to carefully monitor the heat (pre heating and post heating twice per Avery specs). We are using a lubed cloth (glove) to press into the corners and have tried this with and without creating an egress hole. The hole does not work as it expands and basically tears when heated (does not remain a pinhole). We are using as little tenting and stretching as possible, but it is not possible to avoid it altogether, unfortunately. We have made some progress since my last post by trying a different role of 1005 and being very careful to use as little stretching as possible and also reducing the heat a little from the recommended values. I just reprinted the wrap and will try again after letting it out-gas over night and then laminating.

Avery has 3 types of lam, and I believe they have one specifically for this application. Don't know the number off hand.
Then there is the technique. Some simple inlay separate pieces, and are happy with that, they explain to the customers the pros and cons, and then go from there.

If you or the customer are insistent about no inlays, you simply have to use the correct laminate. You need a heat gun, not a torch, and preferably a wrap glove or something you can get wet with soapy water.
You'll need to poke a hole on one of the corners of the channels, top right most area. Start heating and pressing from the center and move all air towards the hole.

This may sound elementary, but it is an excellent way to approach these areas.

Is this what you are already doing? If not, explain the approach you are doing.

 

[Wraptrick]

If you have to stretch, try to stretch a larger area at a time. If the stretch happens inside of a flat panel, you'll be less likely to see a failure.

 

[Zakk]

Yes, this is one of the areas we have been working on and also pushing down the convex edge first. Thanks for your input.

If you have to stretch, try to stretch a larger area at a time. If the stretch happens inside of a flat panel, you'll be less likely to see a failure.

 

[Wraptrick]

And when sticking a hole in it to release the air, try to do so after you've heated. That way the vinyl doesn't shrink back and leave you with an awful hole.

 

[jfiscus]

Did you use any adhesive promoter? Any chance you could show some close up photos of the deep contours, especially in the corners? My installer is pretty experienced, but everyone has room to increase their knowledge. Can you describe your technique that worked for you (temp, stretching/tenting, etc...?) Thanks so much.

I did not install it personally, my installer did, and I have no idea exactly how his process went; I just watched for a bit... I know he did not use that much of the primer94, just a few swipes. I just know that being an installer part of the time myself with no "official" training, I was quite surprised once I did eventually attend training that a few of my standard "worked well so far" practices were incorrect.

 

[jkdbjj]

Thanks for the detailed response. I hate inlays and have never/will never do them unless a client really wants it. I just think they look awful. We are using the 1360 which is the 1.3 mil lam. We are also using a heat gun and a digital thermometer to carefully monitor the heat (pre heating and post heating twice per Avery specs). We are using a lubed cloth (glove) to press into the corners and have tried this with and without creating an egress hole. The hole does not work as it expands and basically tears when heated (does not remain a pinhole). We are using as little tenting and stretching as possible, but it is not possible to avoid it altogether, unfortunately. We have made some progress since my last post by trying a different role of 1005 and being very careful to use as little stretching as possible and also reducing the heat a little from the recommended values. I just reprinted the wrap and will try again after letting it out-gas over night and then laminating.

You have to use 1460... Different world.