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Protecting your artwork

x2chris7x

New Member
Just reading the thread on copywriting, and it got me thinking... What do you do to help protect the artwork you create? Keep a customer from going else where and having the same design/layout produced by another company?

Just curious b/c we had a customer just recently back out of a sign order, (2) 48"x96" prints with lam to be installed at customer location... Prints are done, just needed to install when order was cancelled. He was a good customer of ours, but not anymore I guess... But he took our design to another sign shop and had the same signs produced by another company.
 

Solventinkjet

DIY Printer Fixing Guide
Your proof should never be editable or useful in anyway. When I used to proof signs I would shrink everything down to fit on an 8.5"x11" sheet, rasterize all vectors to 72dpi and save the file as a non-editable PDF. This way if they try to blow it up to the correct size, it will look horrible but it shows up fine on their screen. Also, in your email or on the hard copy of the proof, always state that this is a confidential proof and that the design belongs to you unless specifically released by you to the customer (Copyright 2016 Your Company Name LLC.)

In your current case, you could send them a letter demanding they take the sign down. I recently had a customer go through the same thing but he was the sign shop that got the "customer provided" file. When he got the letter, he took the sign down and charged the customer.
 

x2chris7x

New Member
Your proof should never be editable or useful in anyway. When I used to proof signs I would shrink everything down to fit on an 8.5"x11" sheet, rasterize all vectors to 72dpi and save the file as a non-editable PDF. This way if they try to blow it up to the correct size, it will look horrible but it shows up fine on their screen.

Yea, our proofs are usually no larger than 800 pixels in either direction, .jpg... but I can't stop someone else from re-creating it.

Also, in your email or on the hard copy of the proof, always state that this is a confidential proof and that the design belongs to you unless specifically released by you to the customer (Copyright 2016 Your Company Name LLC.)

I could type that, but is it true? If I create original artwork, is it automatically copyrighted or is there some other process you would need to go through??
 

Solventinkjet

DIY Printer Fixing Guide
As soon as you create an original design, you have the copyright. All you have to prove is that you created it first.
 

Andy D

Active Member
So let assume someone did copy your design to
produce a sign, how is that handled? Can you just take the sign company to small claims court,
or is this strictly a federal issue and has to be handled differently?
 

Solventinkjet

DIY Printer Fixing Guide
As far as my knowledge goes, you first send the cease and desist letter and if it's not taken down, that's when the lawyers get involved. Most of the time it's not going to be worth your time but if you really want to prove a point, it will cost you.
 

WildWestDesigns

Active Member
So let assume someone did copy your design to
produce a sign, how is that handled? Can you just take the sign company to small claims court,
or is this strictly a federal issue and has to be handled differently?


Granted, this is all in my non-legal knowledge so take it for what it's worth. But I think first comes notification (as was already mentioned), then depending on how much damages you are going for will determine rather or not it's small claims. Sometimes, they will want you to go through arbitration first (not necessarily TV arbitration, but that's what Judge Judy etc is arbitration). Now if it's forced arbitration, you may be able to get a court to hear it and maybe overturn the decision. If it's voluntary (like Judge Judy) and not ruled by the court, then fat luck getting them to overturn it.

Or you can go forego everything and go for self help and in the middle of the night take down the sign (I personally wouldn't recommend that, but I know some that would).

Now, one thing I have noticed is that I get a lot of emails that tend to have something like "emergency repairs" when bills aren't paid in full. In TN, you actually have to call it what it is "repo", otherwise that clause doesn't give you any legal ground to stand on.
 

Andy D

Active Member
A million $$$ idea

There should be a company that specializes in copyright protection service for independent designers and small companies, they could pay a couple hundred dollars a year as a retainer,
and for the right to put their seal on all of your designs.. something like:

"*NOTICE* THIS DESIGN HAS BEEN REGISTERED WITH BLAH, BLAH & BLAH LAW FIRM 0N 06/16/16.
WE SPECIALIZE IN COPYRIGHT PROTECTION. ANY USE OF THIS DESIGN, IN WHOLE OR ANY PART,
IS IN VIOLATION OF COPYRIGHT LAW.

BLAH, BLAH & BLAH LAW FIRM WILL TAKE ALL LEGAL RECOURSE ON PART OF THEIR CLIENT, JOE BLOW DESIGNS,
IF NOTIFIED OF ANY COPYRIGHT VIOLATION.

Or something like that......... Maybe there already is a company that does this.....
 

earplug

New Member
Just curious b/c we had a customer just recently back out of a sign order, (2) 48"x96" prints with lam to be installed at customer location... Prints are done, just needed to install when order was cancelled. He was a good customer of ours, but not anymore I guess... But he took our design to another sign shop and had the same signs produced by another company.

Here is your first problem! If you have gotten to the point that the job was done you should have already received a deposit of at least 50%. A document with a signature agreeing on price, art, scope of work etc. Had this been done the odds of them canceling would have gone way down!
 

signbrad

New Member
Your proof should never be editable or useful in anyway. When I used to proof signs I would shrink everything down to fit on an 8.5"x11" sheet, rasterize all vectors to 72dpi and save the file as a non-editable PDF. This way if they try to blow it up to the correct size, it will look horrible but it shows up fine on their screen. Also, in your email or on the hard copy of the proof, always state that this is a confidential proof and that the design belongs to you unless specifically released by you to the customer

I think this is a good policy.
Make it difficult for people to pirate your work. If it's time-consuming to pirate, many will not bother.

Does anyone use watermarks? The clipart companies do.
Of course, nothing is foolproof, or pirate-proof.

I remember a shop that had a note on their sketches similar to this:

This design and drawing remains the property of XYZ Sign Company and may not be duplicated in any form whatsoever without written permission.
This design and the rights to reproduce it may be purchased separately in consideration of $____________.00

...........

For a work of authorship to have copyright protection, it simply needs to be in some tangible form. It doesn't have to be printed, but it must be in a fixed form. It can be a digital file.
But before you can sue for copyright infringement, the work has to be registered with the US Copyright Office. It's not enough just to send in the 45 dollars and the paperwork. You actually must have the registration before you can file an infringement lawsuit. And it must be in federal court. If the infringement takes place before you file for registration, you can file within three months of the infringement. Here's a link: http://copyright.gov/fls/sl09.pdf

That is assuming, of course, that a sign design or layout will qualify for copyright registration. There's no guarantee that it will.
That does not mean I can't claim copyright protection when trying to collect, even if I don't know whether registration would be granted.

What about small claims court?
Well, if someone stiffs you for work that they were supposed to pay for, do you not have the right to take them before a judge? You don't need a lawyer for small claims court. You will use up a day or a half day and have a learning experience.
When I used small claims in Illinois, I was careful to document everything, dating it all.
I used small claims to get paid for sign work, not design work. But I would take the same steps in trying to get paid for design work. When did the client contact me? When did I produce the design on approval? Was it clear to the client that the design was mine till they bought it? When did they hire someone else to use my design? When did I bill them for the design work? When did I send past due notices? When did I try to make a collection, either by phone or in person? When did I send a final notice threatening to take them to court? I would have all this written down to show the judge.
In Illinois, I paid a filing fee and a sheriff's fee (to serve the summons).
Of course, to sue someone to get paid for design work is not an "infringement lawsuit." It is suing someone to get paid for your labor or your product. Tradesmen and store owners do this. I knew a store owner that filed more than one at a time to make his effort more worth it.

Brad
 

Z SIGNS

New Member
You shot yourself in the foot

How could you do design work and fabricate a sign with no deposit ?
Yes it hurts when this happens but you allowed it to happen.
They did not steal your work you gave it to them.
What was the design like?
Was it a masterpiece worth a lot of money and worth fighting about?
Can you show a picture of the theft?

Brad has some good points but come on.
Is losing a day of work trying to collect on 2 4x8 pieces of plastic with some ink on it really worth it.
In the time it takes to squabble you could make 10 4x8's.
To me the math in fighting something like this does not make sense.

I would chalk it up as learning experience and move on.
It only cost you some design and fabrication time to get this education.
 

rossmosh

New Member
One of the more simple ways of handling this situation is to send them a bill. I'd send them two separate bills. One for the printed artwork. The other a release for using your artwork by another vendor. Then you give them 90+ days to pay you. If they don't, you can either take them to small claims court or send a collections agency after them.
 

ams

New Member
I have a template that I put my artwork in when I email it. It states if the artwork is used by anyone other than our company, there is a $99 fee. It also says other things like if you don't pay in full for your signs within 90 days, my company is legally allowed to reprocess the signs. Which my state allows, I can legally go on their property and remove my signs.
 

WildWestDesigns

Active Member
It also says other things like if you don't pay in full for your signs within 90 days, my company is legally allowed to reprocess the signs. Which my state allows, I can legally go on their property and remove my signs.

Here, they allow for a "repo clause", some states though require that you state it as a "repo" and not something more colorful, say "emergency repair". That's what tends to get people.
 

Billct2

Active Member
I can copyright, watermark, pixelate, handcuff...whatever I want to do.
If I give someone a design without getting paid I am accepting the chance that they could steal it.
If I want to spend the time and money (including lost time and money) to chase them for it I can.
But it's happened so few times and with designs that weren't worth much to begin with that I have never bothered.
Maybe my 6th sense on what jobs are worth a little extra effort (and clients are trustworthy) on a sketch has been honed by the years of dealing
with people and maybe I'm just lucky.
As for repo, it's not an option in this state, once the client has the design, sign, truck lettering , whatever, it's theirs until a court says different.
 

Billct2

Active Member
Interesting read, but if the city has any paper trail that they were thinking of something like that prior to his presentation than I think he is out of luck.
I mean, big block illuminated letters is not exactly an original concept. I hope they follow up with the results.
 

x2chris7x

New Member
Here is your first problem! If you have gotten to the point that the job was done you should have already received a deposit of at least 50%. A document with a signature agreeing on price, art, scope of work etc. Had this been done the odds of them canceling would have gone way down!


How could you do design work and fabricate a sign with no deposit ?
Yes it hurts when this happens but you allowed it to happen.

This has been a customer of ours for years, and has never caused any problems... The customer is even friends with the shop owner here, well at least not anymore. So this isn't your Joe Blow walk-in customer.

Not really worried about getting payment for the signs, was really just interested in knowing the legal side of it. Like is he wrong for reproducing our artwork without our permission, if legal action could be taken, copyrighting, etc.

It's not like the design was anything "special" basically just some text with a little icon, but he was using this to "re-brand" his business after moving to a new location.

The problem all stemmed from us not getting his signs installed soon enough... We are in Louisiana and if you've seen the weather, we had some heavy rain and serious flooding for a good week to week and a half a few weeks back... Roads wee flooded so bad we couldnt even drive in to work. This is the time when he wanted his signs installed. It doesnt take a genius to know that wasn't happening...

Once we got back to work, instead of him calling to check on status, he just sent an email cancelling all sign orders... His reason for not calling to check status was "he didnt want to bother us" "he felt like he was begging us to install his signs" (isn't this what customers do when they need something ASAP?!)

Funny thing is, he got another sign company to produce the signs, and it took about 3 weeks before it was installed. Thats the same amount of time he was complaining to us about not being fast enough (and a week and a half of the 3 was serious rain and flooding! lol)

Some actually it took him 6 weeks to get his signs lol
 

Gino

Premium Subscriber
Sometimes, a customer just needs a flimsy excuse as to why they are gonna leave. It happens, and you're left scratching your head, trying to make sense of something you probably saw coming, but did nothing to prevent. It's called the 'Ostrich Syndrome'. You see the writing on the wall, and as long as no one pulls the plug, you keep on believing you are doing the right thing and keep your head buried in the sand, waiting for it to happen. Then, you say, now whadafug did I do wrong ??

Giving potential, good, or bad customers any artwork in hopes they won't shop around is a chance on your part. Nothing to do with whose property is it, if you just give it to them regardless of the pixel size or dirtiness of the output proof. You gave it to them, so who wouldn't believe it was theirs ??

Again, if you didn't explain the rules upfront, it's a risk of doing business with that mindset.
 

x2chris7x

New Member
Well then there is really no way around it then... Your customer must see a proof before proceeding, and when you email it to them, you are "giving it to them" so sounds like the only way to really protect the artwork is force customers to come into your shop and view their proof printed on an 8 1/2 x 11 (and not let them take the paper either)

But once a sign is printed/installed, all the customer needs is a quick pic on a cell phone camera of the sign... Email to another sign shop saying "Make me this"
 
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