Who to create it??

[Ricsy84]

I have the monunent and the vector to.How to cut with plotter to have the white black and the grey colours too.Thanks in advance..

 

[James Burke]

I have the monunent and the vector to.How to cut with plotter to have the white black and the grey colours too.Thanks in advance..

You'll cut the entire design in the stencil and remove the areas that need to be "frosted" (made white by sandblasting with a coarse abrasive or steel shot). The process of frosting the granite is also known as "flashing" or "steeling", depending on where you're from. The surface of the granite is fractured, thus removing the polish and revealing a surface that sparkles. If fine abrasive is used, the frosted areas appear dull and do not sparkle.

After the granite has been frosted, you'll apply the rest of the stencil and cut (sandblast) the areas that appear black. That is called "double process".

A quicker method called "single process" is when the entire design is sandblasted at once and painted. Stencil in the frosted areas is removed and the lettering and designs are packed with a fine textured mud or clay before the panels are frosted. Packing the deeply engraved lettering and designs with mud prevents the sandblasting from removing the paint.

If either of these processes are unfamiliar to you, then you may want to sub it out to a monument company.

Ron Clamp is the widely known here in the states for memorial training. He offers training for both basic and advanced sandblasting skills.

Here's his info:

https://www.memorialdesign.com/monumental-sandblast-shape-carve-training

 

[Ricsy84]

You'll cut the entire design in the stencil and remove the areas that need to be "frosted" (made white). After the granite has been frosted, you'll apply the rest of the stencil and cut the areas that appear black. That is called "double process".

A quicker method called "single process" is when the entire design is sandblasted at once and painted. Stencil in the frosted areas is removed and the lettering and designs are packed with a fine textured mud or clay before the panels are frosted. Packing the deeply engraved lettering and designs with mud prevents the sandblasting from removing the paint.

If either of these processes are unfamiliar to you, then you may want to sub it out to a monument company.

Ron Clamp is the widely known here in the states for memorial training. He offers training for both basic and advanced sandblasting skills.

Here's his info:

https://www.memorialdesign.com/monumental-sandblast-shape-carve-training

Thanks Man.Have to cut with contour cutting?Have a chinese plotter.

 

[Ricsy84]

How is work this double process??

 

[James Burke]

How is work this double process??

Have you ever sandblasted a monument before? If you haven't, you need to sub it out. Making a mistake on granite is a lot different than making a mistake on vinyl.

JB

 

[Ricsy84]

Yes.But with single process.Looks like this
But i want to use 3 colours.Help me??

 

[Ricsy84]

WHAT KIND OF VINYL HAVE TO USE??

 

[James Burke]

Yes.But with single process.Looks like this
But i want to use 3 colours.Help me??

I'd love to help but since you're not here in the states, it's a difficult process to explain via the forum. You really need to stand next to somebody and watch it done to understand it (double process).

You can still single process it fairly easily. You just need to be careful as not to blast the mud packing out of the letters. Keep a close eye on the mud and re apply more if that happens. If this is a pre-need monument (where the death date goes on later), the edges of the death date may look crisper since they will be engraved after the panel has been frosted.

JB

 

[James Burke]

WHAT KIND OF VINYL HAVE TO USE??

You need to use monument stencil. You mentioned you have a Chinese plotter, which is most likely friction-fed. I don't believe it will do a good job with monument stencil.

You need either a friction plotter specially designed for monument stencil such as an Anagraph, or a sprocket plotter like the Gerber GS/HS models.


JB

 

[Ricsy84]

What type of stencil?Have to cut in contour?Maybe can send a video of how to do it??Don t know how works the double process can help with some instruction.The trick is in cutting?

 

[Ricsy84]

You need to use monument stencil. You mentioned you have a Chinese plotter, which is most likely friction-fed. I don't believe it will do a good job with monument stencil.

You need either a friction plotter specially designed for monument stencil such as an Anagraph, or a sprocket plotter like the Gerber GS/HS models.


JB

I use coreldraw and artcut 2009 to cut

 

[James Burke]

Here's a really good video of the double process. It moves fast, so you may need to rewind it and watch it again. The term "double process" describes the manner in which the stencil is first applied, then removed, then re-applied at certain intervals of the engraving process....and yes, it is very time consuming, but worth it in my opinion.

Here's how it's done:

The entire stencil is applied to the stone. Selected areas of the stencil are removed where the frosting occurs. Once the frosting has taken place, the stencil is re-applied to the stone and then deep-cut sandblasting is done.

After the stone has been deep cut, it is painted with Lithichrome paint. Stencil is then removed and the stone is washed and ready to deliver.

This particular company also introduces another process called "honing". It is where you use a finer abrasive to etch some areas of the granite. Honing also removes the polish of the stone and produces a darker finish than frosting. And depending on the coarseness of abrasive used, several different shades of etching can be accomplished. When used correctly, it gives absolutely amazing results.

Frosting and honing permanently alter the finish and color of the stone and it never fades over time. Eventually the black lithichrome paint will wear away, but since the paint is typically in the deep-cut areas of the stone, the natural shadow in the lettering will always keep it legible.

While single processing produces an "acceptible" result, it can not even begin to compare to the quality and elegance of a double processed stone. Typically, memorials at the bottom level of the price schedule are single processed, but some companies (including myself) avoid single processing altogether. A trained eye can easily tell the difference.

JB

 

[Ricsy84]

Here's a really good video of the double process. It moves fast, so you may need to rewind it and watch it again. The term "double process" describes the manner in which the stencil is first applied, then removed, then re-applied at certain intervals of the engraving process....and yes, it is very time consuming, but worth it in my opinion.

Here's how it's done:

The entire stencil is applied to the stone. Selected areas of the stencil are removed where the frosting occurs. Once the frosting has taken place, the stencil is re-applied to the stone and then deep-cut sandblasting is done.

After the stone has been deep cut, it is painted with Lithichrome paint. Stencil is then removed and the stone is washed and ready to deliver.

This particular company also introduces another process called "honing". It is where you use a finer abrasive to etch some areas of the granite. Honing also removes the polish of the stone and produces a darker finish than frosting. And depending on the coarseness of abrasive used, several different shades of etching can be accomplished. When used correctly, it gives absolutely amazing results.

Frosting and honing permanently alter the finish and color of the stone and it never fades over time. Eventually the black lithichrome paint will wear away, but since the paint is typically in the deep-cut areas of the stone, the natural shadow in the lettering will always keep it legible.

While single processing produces an "acceptible" result, it can not even begin to compare to the quality and elegance of a double processed stone. Typically, memorials at the bottom level of the price schedule are single processed, but some companies (including myself) avoid single processing altogether. A trained eye can easily tell the difference.

JB

Thanks .Have to watch the video.What type of glue is using?

 

[jimbug72]

Wow! Talk about going above and beyond, JB. Kudos to you my good man!

 

[James Burke]

What type of glue is using?

I'm not sure what they use, but I like 3M #2.

It's called "sandblast filler", but don't let the word filler distract you. It's essentially rubber cement. The 3M #2 filler is solvent based which means you'll need a solvent based cleaner to remove it from the stone when you're done. Many monument companies use environmentally friendly citrus based cleaners instead.

Aqueous-based stone fillers are also available, but I've never used them before.

JB

Learn about it here:

https://www.3m.com/3M/en_US/company-us/all-3m-products/~/?N=5002385+3293194311+3294857497&rt=rud

 

[Ricsy84]

Thanks for information.The video looks in black granite but in grey granite how can i clean the sandblasted are when the other is painted in black?

 

[James Burke]

Thanks for information.The video looks in black granite but in grey granite how can i clean the sandblasted are when the other is painted in black?

The process works for any color granite. The Lithichrome black shadow paint is extremely durable and is resistant to solvents other than Lithichrome solvent. DO NOT use Lithichrome solvent to clean the stone or it will dissolve the paint.

The citrus cleaner will not harm it. I always try to use the least volatile solvent as possible.

DO NOT use mineral spirits. It will discolor the stone. Lower VOC solvents contain just enough unrefined oils that do not evaporate, and thus get absorbed into the stone. Trust me....I've been there, and done that...and it's not good.


JB

 

[Ricsy84]

HAVE TO USE GLUE?Here is Europe ,Romania from where came from don t know what is here what you use it..YOU KNOW THE ORACAL STENCILS?WHICH HAVE TO USE FOR DOUBLE PROCESSING.

 

[James Burke]

HAVE TO USE GLUE?Here is Europe ,Romania from where came from don t know what is here what you use it..YOU KNOW THE ORACAL STENCILS?WHICH HAVE TO USE FOR DOUBLE PROCESSING.

It sounds like you're in need of more help than I can effectively give on a forum. You're going to need to look for a monument supply company in Europe who can get you the materials you need.

Oracal is NOT going to hold up for what you need it to do. You need monument stencil, which is approx. 1.0 mm to 1.2 mm thick. Oracal is nearly 0.1 mm thick.

I did a thread a while back about using sign vinyl for stone and brick engraving, but that required some equipment I specially built for the process using 600 grit abrasive. It isn't really suited for monument work which requires heavier blast pressures of 100 psi / 7 bar, and coarser abrasive (approx. 30 to 60 grit).


JB

 

[James Burke]

The Monument Builders of North America is a trade association we have here in the US. They may have a counterpart in Europe. Contact them to see if they might be able to help you get the information and materials you need.

You can contact them here:

https://monumentbuilders.org/