Windows 8 is doomed.

[Techman]

Finally some real truth. Maybe????

Windows 8 is doomed. Behind the scenes the software coders developing apps for win 8 a not working on win 8 any more. They are rewriting apps meant to be used with METRO back to win 7. It seems they anticipate M$ will greatly extend win 7 just as they did with XP when vista turned into the flop it was. That leaves no one with time to write apps for win 8. M$ released 5,000 API's for developers but that is too little and too late after the damage done caused by the huge fees they wanted for those API's. And win 9 is supposed to be released next year. Are the whisperings true that beta testers will get their hand on it before the end of this year?

What is going on? Well coders get to keep 80% of the revenue once their app reaches $25 grand in sales. That is a good payment plan except for one thing. No one is buying the win 8 apps because they are buggy. People are buying Ios and Android apps.

 

[visual800]

I have never understood why people bust a nut to have the lastest and greatest. They continuously do it over and over again. When ford came out with 6.0 deisel, people ran to it and it was a POS! And was discontinued. Windows vista same way. XP was the last best OS IMO. I prefer to sit back and watch others dreams get shot to hell as the "test" these untested items.

 

[WildWestDesigns]

I'm not surprised Windows 7 is going to be the new XP. There was just too much of a leap for people in usability between 7 and 8. You had businesses that were even having a hard time making the switch from XP to 7, I can't imagine what it would be like trying to make the switch to 8.

I When ford came out with 6.0 deisel, people ran to it and it was a POS! And was discontinued.

Not exactly true. 6.0 was discontinued the same way that the 7.3 PSD (not all 7.3s were PSDs as a PSD is a ford truck that has a turbocharger and is direct injected) was discontinued. Emissions requirements, although 6.0 was still used until 2009 with the E Series vans.

Those that had issues with the 6.0, the vast majority of them didn't know how to handle a diesel with an EGR system (ironically the EGR system isn't the root cause of issues, it's just the one symptom that everyone can easily identify and it doesn't help that also is an EPA mandated piece of equipment). They treated it like a 7.3 or one of the older diesels. The put the same modules on there for power, let it idle long times without a high idle circuit. I could go on and on on this, but that would really take this thread off track. Oh and I do own a 6.0 (a DRW with over 500 HP at all four rear wheels, so that ole girl gets put through the motions), so don't think this is just coming from an outsider looking in.

 

[OldPaint]

FORD DIESELS....are not FORDS.... they are INTERNATIONAL DIESELS.
http://www.dieselpowermag.com/tech/ford/0810dp_ford_power_stroke_diesel/viewall.html

 

[WildWestDesigns]

FORD DIESELS....are not FORDS.... they are INTERNATIONAL DIESELS.
http://www.dieselpowermag.com/tech/ford/0810dp_ford_power_stroke_diesel/viewall.html

Yes that is true up until the 6.7. Those are done "in house". You are correct Old Paint.

However, the average consumer will go to Ford for warranty work and as far as the average consumer goes, it is Ford's engine. I do know some that will get their fuel/oil filters from International stores (and they will ask for the International part numbers) as they are cheaper, but the majority of people will go to Ford first. Also bare in mind that I mentioned Ford truck as part of the Powerstroke Diesel (PSD) monikar, that is a title for Ford trucks. International has their own labeling system. Powerstroke is reserved for Ford trucks.

 

[particleman]

Finally some real truth. Maybe????

Windows 8 is doomed. Behind the scenes the software coders developing apps for win 8 a not working on win 8 any more. They are rewriting apps meant to be used with METRO back to win 7. It seems they anticipate M$ will greatly extend win 7 just as they did with XP when vista turned into the flop it was. That leaves no one with time to write apps for win 8. M$ released 5,000 API's for developers but that is too little and too late after the damage done caused by the huge fees they wanted for those API's. And win 9 is supposed to be released next year. Are the whisperings true that beta testers will get their hand on it before the end of this year?

hmm... Do you have any links to back what you just said? Some of it appears to be based on what was mentioned at build, which I follow closely since I develop with Microsoft products. Build was the opposite of what you mentioned however, Microsoft is still pushing WinRT hard, and releasing 5,000 new API methods for 8.1 illustrates that.

huge fees? it cost $19 to develop windows phone apps (registration) Visual Studio express is free. It cost at most $99 to develop windows 8 apps.
http://msdn.microsoft.com/library/windows/apps/jj863494.aspx

Windows 8 already IS an extension of windows 7, the big issue is the metro interface/ui issues.

What is going on? Well coders get to keep 80% of the revenue once their app reaches $25 grand in sales. That is a good payment plan except for one thing. No one is buying the win 8 apps because they are buggy. People are buying Ios and Android apps.

Again, a source for this? If it appears people aren't buying apps it is because the amount of Microsoft devices is nothing compared to android and iOS. If you have an iPhone or Android device you can't buy Microsoft apps anyway. Microsoft provides some of the best tools to write software there is including WinRT and .net both of which can produce win 8 apps so not sure what the buggy comment means. As a developer or small team of developers would you develop your app on a huge install base such as android or iOS or start with Windows Phone/ Windows 8? Pretty obvious Microsoft is the 3rd option at the moment, I write primarily in c# and .net, but if I was going to dump a bunch of time into an app I'd target android or iOS first then port to Windows if it was a success. You see this all the time with android/iOS apps coming to Microsoft after they are proven. In fact Microsoft even pays developers to port their apps if that tells you anything.

I do agree the idea of WinRT apps on Windows 8 desktop is dumb (it always has been). Especially since you can't run them windowed (the OS is called windows), I believe 8.1 allows this now. 8.1 is a step in the right direction and will be much more business friendly in general. I've used 8 since it came out on my laptop, it isn't doomsday horrible, but I'm looking forward to putting 8.1 on it and removing some of the annoyances.

 

[WildWestDesigns]

Windows 8 already IS an extension of windows 7, the big issue is the metro interface/ui issues.

That is a huge issue and one that really keeps me from going to Win 8 any time in the future and most of the people that I talk to. That really should have been reserved for more of the mobile devices.

 

[Techman]

If you build M$ apps then you know where every one else is spending their time.

The fact is that those who were deep in .NET apps are suddenly having to learn a new system. They are back to Square one. That is costing a ton of time for them. That is expensive. Yes? Did you NOT have to change from .NET and learn the ARM cpu's and the Win/rt system? Have you NOT had big problems porting you older apps to win 8 with its closed access systems?? Are you having any problems with the new win 8 appstore development and approval.

As for listing sources. There is no need to site a specific source. Just look up the sales volume of win 8 verses Vista. Win 8 is well behind the the sales curves of vista. If fact the slide of win 8 is accelerating. That report in itself says volumes and backs what I say more than any other source of info bar none. For every source that praises win8 there is an equal number of sources that post negative reports. However, the proof is in the sales numbers. When win 8 fell behind the sales curve of Vista then astute developers saw the light dimming. Unfortunately some who are deeply committed to their apps and M$ have a hard time accepting that. It was the same with vista.

And then, We have win 8 tablet sales that is slowly but surely falling. So much so that M$ lowered the price for the win 8 tablet OS, win 8 RT and is giving away the tablet office suit. Too late. in fact HP has no plans to develop an RT device and Acer said RT is not mature. It is too expensive especially that Android is FREE and Office 365 ($99) is a yearly paid subscription..

If it appears people aren't buying apps it is because the amount of Microsoft devices is nothing compared to android and iOS.

You make my point. As I posted above there is no return of time and investment developing apps for win 8. Thus the expense is not worth the investment. Releasing those 5000 API's is too late.


M$ has a history of pushing the latest and greatest. Then suddenly change course and stop supporting the latest and greatest. Can we say ZUNE? Can way say Silverlight? That leaves those who spent a ton of time and life energy developing skills withering away with nothing.

 

[particleman]

If you build M$ apps then you know where every one else is spending their time.

The fact is that those who were deep in .NET apps are suddenly having to learn a new system. They are back to Square one. That is costing a ton of time for them. That is expensive. Yes? Did you NOT have to change from .NET and learn the ARM cpu's and the Win/rt system? Have you NOT had big problems porting you older apps to win 8 with its closed access systems?? Are you having any problems with the new win 8 appstore development and approval.

No this isn't correct. Generally any windows application that worked on 7 works on 8 the same. I personally have applications that work on both with no changes at all. IF you want to move your app to a Windows Store App then you are going to be porting it some way or another. And no you don't have to use WinRT, Microsoft still supports .net for Windows Store apps. Read this.
http://msdn.microsoft.com/en-GB/library/windows/apps/br230302.aspx

The very first paragraph reads... "The .NET Framework provides a subset of managed types that you can use to create Windows Store apps using C# or Visual Basic. This subset of managed types is called the .NET for Windows Store apps and enables .NET Framework developers to create Windows Store apps within a familiar programming framework."

M$ has a history of pushing the latest and greatest. Then suddenly change course and stop supporting the latest and greatest. Can we say ZUNE? Can way say Silverlight? That leaves those who spent a ton of time and life energy developing skills withering away with nothing.

Silverlight simply isn't the latest and greatest anymore. With HTML 5 silverlight has been made redundant. Open standards typically prevail. Tech changes fast and often business doesn't, so Microsoft is constantly trying to keep up as are many other companies. WCF, WPF are examples, you can still use them but they are actively being replaced for open standards and newer more modern ways of developing such as restful web services (replaces WCF) and javascript/html based development (WinRT).

As for ZUNE and inevitably the Surface Microsoft has tried to break into new markets but failed for various reasons. I don't believe it was for a lack of good developer tools though.

 

[Techman]

Silver light. They came up with it and its constant morphings because html 5 was not ready to do what they wanted done with rich media.. Silver light is the example of what M$ does to its products. They did not give a positive or a negative heads up for future intentions. They just let things wither away.
Adobe on the other hand announced plans for flash mobile and html5 which gives developers time to make changes.

ZUNE>>>

I don't believe it was for a lack of good developer tools though.

You're right

ZUNE was junk from the beginning. Ever try to use ZUNE let alone program for it?
I hated it from the very first second it was installed on my lab test computer. I instantly knew it was doomed and refused any assignments for it. And no that is not violating any NDA's .

But the point is that M$ dead ends projects and has a profile that is readable. That leaves developers without an answer for future intentions. So now many developers are back working on win 7 apps as I mentioned above..