I have a new client that was previously using another company for a fleet of ambulances. They were using printed and contour cut 3MIJ5100R (printed on a Mimaki JV33) and laminated with 3M 8518 gloss lam for all of the graphics on these. I will be using a Roland 640 with built in cutter for producing these over here. The client stated that recently they have been having issues with the 5100R. They use it specifically because of the fact that it is removable (because sometimes they have to lift it and move it around during installation). The issue is that lately when they lift it, the reflective layer is separating immediately. Is this a common issue or maybe just the particular batch? (They said it never happened until recently) They are also trying to keep the cost down as well. Has anyone used anything comparable to this product that you could recommend? Another brand that is maybe more cost effective? The previous company was laminating the product after printing (which I thought was common practice). My current employer says they never laminate anything reflective even if it's been printed on. Thoughts?
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Printable Reflective for Fleet Suggestions / Advice
- Thread starter MagicMike
- Start date
SightLine
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Your current employer is an idiot if he thinks printed reflective should not be laminated. Unlaminated, printed reflective will last about as long as any other unlaminated vinyl on a vehicle. In general, it will actually last even less long since the far majority of ambulance services clean their units weekly. If you have to lift it and move it around during install then you are doing it wrong or you need to go with a very expensive air release reflective. 3M 680CR is fabulous to work with but of course at two grand a roll it's not very cost effective.
We use Nikkalite. No it is not easily removable but almost no reflective is easily removable except the 3M 680. You are not wrapping the ambulance with it, tape hinge it and make sure you are applying it in the right place to begin with. There is no reason to try and move it around, also much of any bending, sharp pulling, etc is going to bruise reflective anyways.
We use Nikkalite. No it is not easily removable but almost no reflective is easily removable except the 3M 680. You are not wrapping the ambulance with it, tape hinge it and make sure you are applying it in the right place to begin with. There is no reason to try and move it around, also much of any bending, sharp pulling, etc is going to bruise reflective anyways.
The fact that they do not laminate printed reflective, I admit, came as a shock as they have been in business for 25+ years. I don't know the reason but I don't own the business so it's not really my call. I'm sure I can talk them into it since that is what the end user is expecting. The 680 was already discussed and is out of the question. This is funded by the city so cost is the main issue. I was wanting to see if anyone had used the Oracal reflective or anything less costly in the same sort of application. Bottom line, we want to save them money and still make a little profit on this and still be able to deliver a quality product.
SightLine
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Yep - many of us have done this when we know we will be removing the material within a couple of years....
jfiscus
Rap Master
Everything printed on an Edge, especially specialty materials like reflective need laminated also.
Printing on an Edge is usually more expensive per SF than printing on a solvent printer.
Either the customer is BSing you, or the last company didn't price the job correctly. (if all of your pricing or costs are accurate)
Also, some companies purchase more materials than others and get it at a discounted rate, but that shouldn't effect the price too much.
Printing on an Edge is usually more expensive per SF than printing on a solvent printer.
Either the customer is BSing you, or the last company didn't price the job correctly. (if all of your pricing or costs are accurate)
Also, some companies purchase more materials than others and get it at a discounted rate, but that shouldn't effect the price too much.
I worked for the previous printer and this customer followed me when I left. He was doing these at $6 per square for printing on reflective, laminating and contour cut with transfer tape. He was a moron so if I had to guess, he probably just under priced it and then hung the customer out to dry when his business partner questioned it. He was printing them on a Mimaki JV33.
jfiscus
Rap Master
My suggestion - If the customer is really a halfway decent friend, and the price is really an issue with him and you want to keep him as a customer but don't want to lose money on the jobs:
Take him out to lunch (corporate expense) and let him know your base materials cost per sf of 680, lam & mask. Show him a friggin Fellers catalog if you have to.
Tell him the previous owner was not pricing jobs correctly, hence why you left and why he will be going out of business soon.
If they can't understand that you have to make money to pay your overhead, bills, feed your kids, etc - then they are only a bottom-dollar customer with no real loyalty.
So, you either do the jobs and lose money or lose the customer. I would suggest losing the customer in this instance.
$6/sf probably doesn't cover your base cost of materials (without labor figured in!)
Take him out to lunch (corporate expense) and let him know your base materials cost per sf of 680, lam & mask. Show him a friggin Fellers catalog if you have to.
Tell him the previous owner was not pricing jobs correctly, hence why you left and why he will be going out of business soon.
If they can't understand that you have to make money to pay your overhead, bills, feed your kids, etc - then they are only a bottom-dollar customer with no real loyalty.
So, you either do the jobs and lose money or lose the customer. I would suggest losing the customer in this instance.
$6/sf probably doesn't cover your base cost of materials (without labor figured in!)
Excellent advice jfiscus! Thank you!