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Need Help Switching from HP Latex 360 to Epson S80600??

daenterpri

daenterpri

New Member
90% of the products that we print at our company are small vehicle stickers that we ship out all over the place. We've had some struggle with the HP Latex 360 having good up-close clarity and also some struggles with printing light greys and such. There is an issue because of the limited LM channel or something like that... things are not as pretty as they could be as a result.

Anyways, the Epson videos I've been watching look impressive. So here's some questions for those of you that have them:

1. Is it worth making the switch to Epson S80600? Why?

2. Are you able to get really smooth, non-grainy colors, especially when you look up close?

3. One of the reasons we went to Latex was I originally had a 20 year old eco-solvent printer that put nasty fumes in my shop. Is there any issue with that in the new Epson S80600? I do care about my employee's work environment. We do have a air purifier running around the clock, but still...

4. I was told that we need to wait 6 hours before laminating our prints. Is this true? Granted, it's better than the 24hrs of most eco-solvent printers, but we've gotten spoiled with our latex printers not having to wait to laminate. Do you think that this rule is as important with printing smaller 4" - 6" stickers?

5. How is maintenance? How often do you have to change print heads and how much do they cost? Currently with Latex we just pop them in and out.

Thanks for the help! Any other information I'd really appreciate!!!
 
ChrisN

ChrisN

New Member
We have two S80600 printers. I would call the prints near photo quality. It puts out very smooth, colorful prints due to the small droplet sizes and light inks as well as red and orange inks.

There is definitely a solvent odor, especially when printing full coverage with high ink densities.

For small decals, I'm not sure you'd have to wait long to laminate. We mainly see the effects of not quite cured ink on wraps where it causes weird stretching and other assorted oddities. With decals, we send them out to our customers so it is usually a while before they actually go to use them. By that time the ink is fully cured. Of course, it depends on the ink coverage as well. A decal with a black background will take longer to cure than a white background.
 
dypinc

dypinc

New Member
One of the problem you may be having with the HP Latex 360 having good up-close clarity and also some struggles with printing light grey is the lack of proper media presets and profiles. Higher passes, 12 to 20 are a must, plus correct optimizer setting and correct black generation in your profile. Most canned media presets and profile are hopeless in this area.
 
ProColorGraphics

ProColorGraphics

New Member
I went from having the first 3 generations of the HP latex, over the past 4 years or so, to purchasing an Epson S70 and now added a S80 this year. So here are my answers to your questions:
1) My top priority is print quality. My last HP was the 360 and the samples I got from the S70 were WAY better! I also have loved having the white/silver inks. I don't use them as much as I would like, but I am still glad I have them.
2) Yes, you can get really smooth/neutral gradients and grays. The lt. black and smaller dot size helps with that.
3) There is a smell, but I don't think it's that bad. This also depends on the size of your work area.
4) The waiting to laminate depends too on how it is cut out. If you are cutting on a bleed, I highly recommend waiting or the edges can still curl on you. A proper profile is key for this as well.
5) I will honestly admit that the maintenance on the S80 is about the same as my 360. Now that it has a fabric wiper, you really don't have to do much. Once a month clean around the heads and your good to go. Unless you have a major head strike or running the wheels off of the thing, you probably won't have to change heads. There are pros/cons to user replaceable heads. I will also say, since I had both, that the head setup on the HP probably more expensive. You're just getting hit $100 at a time, so it doesn't seem as bad as replacing an Epson head.

I absolutely love the Epson printers!! I would buy them again in a heartbeat!
 
3

31legen

New Member
Great Info. I just ordered one and am awaiting install.

ProColorGraphics said:
I went from having the first 3 generations of the HP latex, over the past 4 years or so, to purchasing an Epson S70 and now added a S80 this year. So here are my answers to your questions:
1) My top priority is print quality. My last HP was the 360 and the samples I got from the S70 were WAY better! I also have loved having the white/silver inks. I don't use them as much as I would like, but I am still glad I have them.
2) Yes, you can get really smooth/neutral gradients and grays. The lt. black and smaller dot size helps with that.
3) There is a smell, but I don't think it's that bad. This also depends on the size of your work area.
4) The waiting to laminate depends too on how it is cut out. If you are cutting on a bleed, I highly recommend waiting or the edges can still curl on you. A proper profile is key for this as well.
5) I will honestly admit that the maintenance on the S80 is about the same as my 360. Now that it has a fabric wiper, you really don't have to do much. Once a month clean around the heads and your good to go. Unless you have a major head strike or running the wheels off of the thing, you probably won't have to change heads. There are pros/cons to user replaceable heads. I will also say, since I had both, that the head setup on the HP probably more expensive. You're just getting hit $100 at a time, so it doesn't seem as bad as replacing an Epson head.

I absolutely love the Epson printers!! I would buy them again in a heartbeat!
Click to expand...
 
daenterpri

daenterpri

New Member
So what do you guys do about the Solvent odor? Is it harmful? The last thing I want is for my guys to start having health issues because of running an eco-solvent machine. I ran an old old horrible eco-solvent 6 years ago in an 800sq/ft operation without much ventilation and I want to say that I got sick from it.

We are currently in a 1200sq/ft operation (2 HP 360's, 2 Roll Cutters, 2 Laminators, Flatbed Cutter). We do have an air purifier constantly cleaning the air, but the odor removing filters are expensive to use so we don't use those ones.

I just don't want people getting sick...that's why I moved to Latex in the first place. What do I do?

In the industries we serve, being able to offer metallics would be a big deal.
 
ProColorGraphics

ProColorGraphics

New Member
I have both of my Epson's running in a room about 1100 square feet. This is where I have my computer design area, work tables, etc. I rarely notice a smell. The smell from my S70 is actually a little stronger than from my S80. I would have to have both of them run-in with some heavy inks coverage to small anything.
 
daenterpri

daenterpri

New Member
ProColorGraphics said:
I have both of my Epson's running in a room about 1100 square feet. This is where I have my computer design area, work tables, etc. I rarely notice a smell. The smell from my S70 is actually a little stronger than from my S80. I would have to have both of them run-in with some heavy inks coverage to small anything.
Click to expand...

Gotcha, that's helpful. When you say heavy ink coverage, do you mean for backlit? We would want fair detail in our stickers that we make. Does that mean heavy ink coverage? I'm imagining that we would be able to get what we want from like an 8 pass quality with that machine.
 
ProColorGraphics

ProColorGraphics

New Member
2CT Media said:
Hopefully all of their ink issues are figured out. I know many people with GS and early S printers that have yellow ink fading issues.
Click to expand...

I did hear of those as well, and glad I waited to get one. I know on the GS they also had where the green wouldn't get used, so it would clog up. Talking with some Epson people, in between the SX0670 and SX675, they hired a team of chemists to totally go through the ink makeup and get it all fixed. I got my first one after that happened. I haven't had any issues at all.
 
Christian @ 2CT Media

Christian @ 2CT Media

Active Member
That is good to hear... of the solvent machines I have always been impressed with the epson, the ink cost is what detracts us and the convenience of Latex
 
daenterpri

daenterpri

New Member
2CT Media said:
That is good to hear... of the solvent machines I have always been impressed with the epson, the ink cost is what detracts us and the convenience of Latex
Click to expand...

What do you mean by ink cost? I thought that ink cost is lower, around $0.18/sqft with Epson and I thought it was around $0.23/sqft with latex?

Also, with the ink rewards program, it sounds like we'd never have to pay for a warranty (at least within 5 years), which would even cover print heads when they need replaced. Right?
 
daenterpri

daenterpri

New Member
I did the math and in the last 2 years we've averaged about 12,000 sq/ft a month think. This last year though we are probably doing more like 15,000/mo.
 
Christian @ 2CT Media

Christian @ 2CT Media

Active Member
My ink costs on my latex are rarely over $0.175 on 10 pass with 110%... We also run 4C for most of our wraps which reduces ink usage. If you use every color on the epson your ink costs will be higher due to more ink cartridges.

We are averaging 13,000 sqft / month on our 360 so I don't think its alot.
 
daenterpri

daenterpri

New Member
2CT Media said:
My ink costs on my latex are rarely over $0.175 on 10 pass with 110%... We also run 4C for most of our wraps which reduces ink usage. If you use every color on the epson your ink costs will be higher due to more ink cartridges.

We are averaging 13,000 sqft / month on our 360 so I don't think its alot.
Click to expand...

How are you printing 4C? I've looked for how to do that with our latex printers and I can't figure it out. We use Caldera if that's any help.
 
daenterpri

daenterpri

New Member
dypinc said:
When you create a media set you choose CMYKcm or CMYK.
Click to expand...

Oh right. I thought I did that once but I didn't think it was doing anything. I'll have to mess with that again. Does it save ink and provide better color in the lower passes?
 
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