Theirs or Mine?

[rydods]

Ok, so we require 50% down on "most" orders over $500 but some slip through the cracks. I know, I shouldn't let this happen. Now I have a handful of customers, 1 over $800 and a few around $200, who are delinquent on paying their bills..."dodging" me at every turn. Today I decided to call each of them and leave a message (like usual) stating you have 24 hours to return my call and provide payment or we will remove the materials (signs, window lettering and in some cases...bulbs and ballasts) we have provided. So far the bulbs and ballasts guy paid so it seems to be working. My question is, can I do this legally? I know it's still my stuff and there was no contract and no payment so I assume this is ok but is there a loophole for them to take action against me if I have basically taken them out of business?

 

[CanuckSigns]

this topic has been beaten to death on here, some say go for it, some say you will end up on America's most wanted for even considering it.

 

[Gino]

You're gonna get both sides of the aisle on this question.

You're best off asking a local attorney.


Around here, it works that once a sign is on a building or whatever, it now belongs to them. Collecting money is your problem. Re-poing a sign was never discussed most likely.

You could be arrested for trespassing and also vandalism. Some people take the chance and don't get caught, but I'd check with your local laws on the book and see who actually owns a sign, you didn't collect for.

 

[GAC05]

You need to call the powers that be in your area to see what the local statues are.
In general it is hard to recover something once it has been delivered/installed without some kind of court action.

wayne k
guam usa

 

[rydods]

Sorry for giving this topic another round in the ring. Wasn't really sure what to punch into the search box. Gino, collecting could mean for the remaining 50% balance as well in which payment could just as easily be neglected by the customer. In this case 100% down is the only option. I guess what your saying is I need to hire a few "tough guys" to make sure all transactions are complete and all money is "Collected".

 

[401Graphics]

I get 50% down, and I dont leave the install until i get paid. Or I leave with the sign.

 

[Z SIGNS]

I've found the best way to avoid this is to make sure the customer is very clear as to what the terms are.If it's 50% down and the bal cod make sure they know it.This can be a very touchy area you don't want to sound to tough in the beginning that could make them think you don't trust them.I usually bring this up with the customer when they are handing over the deposit.I remind them again what the terms are and tell them we will give you a heads up when the sign will be delivered so they can have the balance due ready.If they balk about payment we just say fine let us know when you will have the bal due and we will deliver the signs and we move on to the next install.

In most places once the sign is installed it's their property but if you did everything you were supposed to do and lived up to your end of the deal and the customer just refused to pay cause he's a deadbeat I don't think you could get into any trouble if you repo your work.What's he going to tell the judge if it goes to court "He took back the sign I didn't pay for"
Never had to do this.Threatening usually works and is a lot of fun.

 

[Mosh]

I repo and smash...done it several times and never gotten into any trouble, serious trouble.... I always smash just for spite just in case they want to pay, that is not the point... BTWa few times for trespassing from this, only $100 fine or so...just a heads up, it is worth it....now the assault charges are a different thing and that one is still pending.
he is a scum broker and I am still going to get him sooner or later, He has propery up for public ausction...another story....

 

[ova]

I just pay them a visit. Did it to the guy next door today. Lettered his truck and made a sign advertising his snow plow business this past Oct. Sent an invoice notice every month.

Today I walked over with the invoice and ask for my money. After I get my money, I make it know the no longer have credit at my place. This isn't the first time I've done it. Worked everytime so far.

Hard for the person to say no when you're looking them in the face. On the phone you get all kinds of excuses.

I try to give all businesses the same as I would want. Most are true blue. It's only a few that are d!ck heads.


Dave

 

[Mosh]

sometimes you need actions not just words! I could care less about the money i am not letting anyone think they are getting the better of me and i have and will resort to confrontations! and like i say i have been in trouble for it it but i will have the last word. They might laugh when i am in trouble but when i ended up owning the property in that tax sale i had the last laugh. and you know who you are cause you come on here C.H.!!!!

 

[BigfishDM]

Can't you put something on your orders moving forward about having your signage repo'd for not paying in full, if they only paid half go pull half his sign down lol.

 

[JgS]

I have always collected the money before or during the install so I haven't run into this problem. But, remembering my law classes in school, once the sign is in their hands it belongs to them. The only thing you can do is get a collection agency to get the money for you.

 

[mudmedia]

sometimes you need actions not just words! I could care less about the money i am not letting anyone think they are getting the better of me and i have and will resort to confrontations! and like i say i have been in trouble for it it but i will have the last word. They might laugh when i am in trouble but when i ended up owning the property in that tax sale i had the last laugh. and you know who you are cause you come on here C.H.!!!!

I am with Mosh on this one. When it gets so far it is not about the money. It is about the pure thought of trying to get over on someone. When you got to the grocery store you pay before you leave what makes a sign any different?

I told someone I would come by his house and strip his door decals because he never paid his $175 remaining on his bill (Yes even over a couple hundred dollars I still would strip the truck).

 

[Marlene]

did they sign off on a clearly stated contract that spells out that you own all materials until paid in full and if not paid in full you will reclaim the all materials? something close to that? check with your lawyer as stated but if you clearly stated all the terms and they signed off and agreed to all, you should be OK to go get the stuff. if you didn't state what would happen and they didn't agree to it, you could run into issues.

 

[WildWestDesigns]

Can't you put something on your orders moving forward about having your signage repo'd for not paying in full, if they only paid half go pull half his sign down lol.

Make sure you specify that it is a repo and don't try to cutesy it up by saying "emergency repairs" or something like that. I know TN and AL both have laws that stipulate to that very thing. Now that may or may not be an issue, but I would make sure.

Also to the fines, just on the municipality, those widely very. It's significantly more then $100 dollars here and they like to make an example of those that try "self help". Not all are like that, even if there is law on the books about it, but there are some that do. Here you have the fine, plus "damages" to the person you tried to repo the sign (and/or landlord depending on the situation) and your case gets thrown out plus you owe whatever money you have received thus far for the job.

 

[ChicagoGraphics]

I have done this a few times, make a vinyl decal on floresent orange with big black letters stating COVER UP for non payment, and apply it on the middle of the sign so just parts of the sign is showing. Now If you know for a fact your not going to get paid do the same thing but slash the decal into little peices then mask and apply

 

[rydods]

Thanks everyone! I agree with Mosh. I wouldn't want to make it a physical confrontation however but even if it's $150 I'll be banging on their door till they go out of business and if they do I'll find out where they live and bang on that door. I have one customer left that owes about $250 and she rents out of a downtown plaza. I suppose I could ask the manager of the building what they think of me removing her stuff but f**k it...this might be fun...and I'm not tap dancing around anymore.

 

[visual800]

IM a repo ho! I will take down and snatch down whatever it takes to get money. So far so good. No atotrnreys no law enforcement, no BS! if its lighted slide the face out. if its individual letteres snatch just a few off the wall. I do NOT tolerate non payment.

 

[Gino]

Sorry for giving this topic another round in the ring. Wasn't really sure what to punch into the search box. Gino, collecting could mean for the remaining 50% balance as well in which payment could just as easily be neglected by the customer. In this case 100% down is the only option. I guess what your saying is I need to hire a few "tough guys" to make sure all transactions are complete and all money is "Collected".

Yes and no.

Not many people get terms anymore from us. I've taken all the precautions to not get burned, but on occasion, still do.... to as certain extent.

The days of threats and muscle are gone. In fact, I did do that from time to time, but that was years ago. You can't afford to do silly things anymore. It all needs a paper trail and everything needs to be documented. I document with my recorder and then write in down in their folder when I get back to my desk. write down every discussion, the date and even what time. The more you can add into a letter at your time of need will scare the sh!t out of them.

Most of our jobs are 50% deposit with the balance upon delivery or completion of said job.... and I'm there with my hand in their face. I used to think it looked stoopid to do that, but you know what ?? Everyone else does it, so it's kinda become the norm. We have companies spending $65,000 and more on a single transcation and they pay immediately. We give them the invoice on a Tuesday and we're paid Thursday. One day to go through their books and clear the bank and 24 to 48 hours later, we're all good.

We haven't gotten stuck on anything in years. Some have tried, but they all eventually failed and then have to pay the penalties in addition.

 

[Angela]

I always get a cc and if they do not pick up in a timely fashion, I call them and let them know I just ran their card for the remaining balance. Problem solved.