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I want to bring Embroidery in house. Need Advice!

I run SWF machines for the past 12 years, I've had a couple break downs but nothing serious.
As for digitizing I sub all mine out to a couple different places, here is and art to it and for the it takes me to
do it I can make more working on something else.
I have Wilcom deco studio for monogramming and name drops..
 

WildWestDesigns

Active Member
Since this is also going on to digitizing, I'm going to go ahead and apologize for my lengthy post (I'm sure most are tired of it by now). Of course, it's probably nothing new in this thread.


As for digitizing I sub all mine out to a couple different places, here is and art to it and for the it takes me to
do it I can make more working on something else.

This is true. About when Rick started, I could get significantly more for a simple logo crest then I can now. Rather or not they charge by stitch count (traditional method) or flat rate, it doesn't matter if a design takes us 5 minutes or 5 hrs, we get paid the same. A lot of players in the digitizing game, which is good and bad for customers. There are a lot of hacks in the game as well, mainly due to cheap home software that is limited. Some are limited to nothing but auto conversions. It isn't auto-digitizing, computers don't digitize. Auto converting will always render mistakes, always. I can say that with the up most confidence, because no artwork, no matter how well a vector file is setup, is setup for good production embroidery, unless that file is going to suck big time for something like cut vinyl. Especially when it comes to connector stitches that we use to keep trim count down. Raster files don't yield good quality conversions out of the gate anyway, just due to the nature of what is a raster file.

Whatever you do, stay away from auto converting when your learning to digitizing. A lot of bad habits and especially bad embroidery comes of it (some may or may not even realize it).

Now, when you are looking for someone to digitize, don't focus so much on price, but quality and how well the production time is on the files. If you have a file with a flat rate of $5 no matter the size of the design (yes, I do know digitizers that do that), that one time fee of $5 might cost you more on the production floor. It could take you 40-50 minutes to stitch that out, but get a better quality file (albeit more expensive) might be able to knock that time down in half. Depending on how many you are doing, 20 extra minutes translates to a lot. Not all files are created equally.

Along the not all files being the same. If you get a customer that has a logo and embroidery already done on a garment, send both to your digitizer. Not all digitizer digitize the same. That doesn't mean that one is wrong or one is right, some might overlap here, but some overlap there or use a back stitch when others use a triple pass, that's were more of the artistry comes in when digitizing someone else design.

When people digitize, we have to worry about the interaction of thread, needle and fabric. Things like stitch type, density, pull compensation, underlay and especially the sequence that the needle(s) take all affect quality and this isn't necessary the same for all types of substrates. Some designs you can get away with stitching it on more substrates then you can others. Some designs really need to be specifically done for individual substrate. Problem here is, most customers don't think that and quality does suffer. I'm seen customers want a design that was at the time designed for shirts want it on structured hats. Stitch sequence is all wrong.

Know your stitch types and when to be able to identify to use a particular one and the angles that they should go in. Depending on what machine you get, you have min and max widths that are used on satin stitches (most popular and best looking stitch type in my opinion), these vary from machine to machine (some are the same, some are not), the smaller widths can be helped with using lighter weight thread and smaller needle and going slower.

Lettering, in of itself perhaps the most important digitizing aspect that all digitizers deal with. Learn to be able to spot which ones will or won't based on size. Size is what gets most designs. A lot of designers when they are creating their designs don't take physical production methods such as embroidery in mind (this applies to more then just lettering, but lettering is a big one). I'm in no way slighting their abilities as a designer, but they just don't know and you are going to deal with customers that want as is and sometimes that just doesn't work and still be quality. This is especially seen in lettering. Anything below .18", in height of the cap. letters, as a satin stitch isn't going to translate at all. I don't like seeing them below .20" and this is for a regular plain ole block font. Smallest simple scripts like to be around .25" min.

Now, I mentioned production as a key element. In most instances of what you are going to be doing, production is a key element, however, sometimes production does have to take a little bit of a back seat in order to achieve a quality end result. Puff, blends, even just regular structured hat embroidery, have special digitizing needs that are always great for time, but needed for quality.

I could go on and on about this, but the point being is that there is more knowledge that goes into this then the average person thinks about. This is what I think about when ever I do my own design work. Why my designs might be considered more "simple" then others.

Just be very careful about how you choose as a digitizer or when you learn this stuff to do yourself.


I have Wilcom deco studio for monogramming and name drops..

Check with your digitizers and see if they can digitize the ESA keyboard fonts for your DecoStudio. Some fonts it's nice to have different ones then what the other embroiderers have.
 

WildWestDesigns

Active Member
I wonder if someone can give me some advice please, My job is printing t-shirts, etc but I sometimes help out with the embroidery. I don't know anything about digitizing but I'm alright running the machines, (I know how to press a button :) Anyways, we have this logo that we run quite often and it causes a lot of problems. There is an 'I' in the logo and the thread breaks continuously on the dot, the dot is about 6mm.
That is actually starting to go below the minimum that a lot of shops have for embroidery. When one starts getting too small with lettering (even with the simple block san serif font, which is what should be used when starting to get sizes along what you are talking about, from a production standpoint), going to need to start thinking about other things. For "i" dots that are on the smaller size, I will actually use a 5 pointed star. Due to the physical nature of embroidery thread, this will actually look like a dot without having to pack in all those stitches of a satin stitch dot. That's what people need to start thinking about when going on the smaller side of things. Other things to think about, slower machine speed, lighter weight thread (this does depend on the color and thread type (rayon, polyneon etc) though, not all colors are available at thread weights outside of 40wt) and/or smaller needle.


We have the digitizing done outside and this particular logo has been re-digitized a few times because of the problems, but the company that does it says that it runs perfectly on its machines.
Just says or do they actually show a picture or something visual (of course, even though with that, one has the magic of Ps to clean things up as well). Saying that it runs fine leads one to believe that they took the time to do a stitch out, so it shouldn't be out of the question to provide something in the way of visual that shows that it did indeed stitch out correctly on their machine.

Now, it is vary possible for it to stitch out better on their machine compared to y'alls. Some machines (even within brands) handle smaller lettering or just finer detail better compared to others. Also, did they do anything else differently. Lighter weight thread, slower machine speed, smaller needle etc. All of these things, I start thinking about doing when sizes of embroidery objects get smaller. Not a lot of shops want to deal with that, so they usually make a minimum limit on embroidery size. Which is right about where you are at. .25" or 6.35mm if my conversion is correct, tends to be the minimum that most shops do.


I was running this logo today, we have five machines and it was running fine on one of the machines, no breakages at all but on the others, it was really bad. All of the settings are the same, and the logo is the same. I've tried changing needles, checked the bobbins, checked the settings, material thickness, etc. I put a different color thread on the worst machine just to see if it would run and it was perfect. The thread I am using is Madeira, which I am told is one of the best. The person who normally does the embroidery seems to accept all of these breakages, he has the patience of a saint. On Saturday according to the analysis on the computer, I ran 185 polo shirts and had 172 breakages :( Please can anyone give me some advice before all my hair goes grey?
Thread breakages are not good from a production standpoint. Being patient and accepting of them is not good in the long run. Now, rather it is due to the pattern or due to the machine(s) and how they can handle said pattern, that could be something else. Just depends on the situation.

While digitizing is an important part of the process, certainly moreso compared to what people want to pay for it in today's world, there are outside factors that still do play a part in how the machine is able to handle the file.


Also, can you tell me if the digitizing would need to be done differently for polo shirts and suit shirts?
This actually depends. A lot of people in trying to be cheap, will try to do a one size fits all digitized file. If the fabric types aren't widely different from one another, one can usually get away with that. Or at worst, maybe add a layer or two of light weight tear away stabilizer (sometimes may need a layer or two more) to give it that little extra umph to help it stitch out better. But it also does depend on the design itself. Some fabrics, embroidery objects may need to be a little thicker/denser compared to other fabrics. A lot of trial and error to find out what works and what doesn't on what fabric that are being embroidered on your machine.
 
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Ronda

New Member
All awesome advise. But I would also look at the Melco machines. I've run brothers for 20 years, a single head, 3 head and a 4 head. They are all still running but 2 years ago I added 3 Melco machines. The brothers are workhorses. But if I lose a motherboard I'll be outta luck and dead in the water. The Melco Emt16x is what I got, I can run them individual or together. It's nice because if a thread breaks they don't all stop.

Always a learning curve to any new machines. But mine have served me well and I enjoy it.

Good luck
 

Craig Keller

New Member
Barudan and Tajima are maybe neck to neck as far as the quality.
I have Tajimas and I can not say that they are much better than Barudan, but at the same time, I would not say that the Barudan is way superior to Tajima.

If you are looking at the single head machines, consider a Toyota brand to. The only bad thing about them, they are not made any more (they were made by Tajima too, use most of the same parts).

Stay away from Chinese brands. Another few good ones, but not as good as above mentioned ones, SWF, HAPPY, BROTHER

A very steep learning curve. Be prepared for that. Outsource all the digitizing at first (Or forever). It is not worth the headache. But try to learn it as much as you can. It helps down the road, if nothing more, you will understand your machine better if you know digitizing.

Good luck
100%!!!
 

Guerilla Grafix

New Member
Brothers are very good. A lot more so then most people give them credit for. I think what hurt's them the most is how Brother goes about marketing them. SWFs are very good. You do have quite a few no name (or rather new to the game) machines that haven't really quite proven themselves out there yet. Those I would stay away for a few yrs still. Let someone else be a guinea pig. To add to the list of smaller items above, I would also keep around lighter weight thread and a couple of specialty needles (one that is smaller in size and one for metallics (larger eyelet)). Other then that I use a 75/11 for everything else. Not that bad of a pain for your single head, but for your multi-heads you are going to have a lot of fun swapping them out, but it's something that not everyone does and it helps with quality.

Also extra empty bobbins to spool your own. Being able to match upper/lower thread colors on certain projects (Christmas tree example), that adds a nice touch. Plus, if you run out of the pre-wound stuff, you can still wind your own in an emergency.



Can't emphasis that enough. A screen on the machine is very, very helpful.



I appreciate the kind words. Thank you.
What's up, WildWest! Can you shoot me a DM? I haver my Happy embroidery machine bring delivered within the hour and will need to outsource digitizing.

People in the comments have recommended you for that service. Thanks!
 

Craig Keller

New Member
I would like to start with a single head and a 4 head machine. What brands would you all recommend for:
The best training and support.
What machine is going to allow me to embroider a pretty big design on the fronts of caps?

Thanks!!
Sherry
Call me 2544592009
 
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