3M 8518 lam issue

[strypguy]

Last week I printed and contour cut some trailer decals with 3MIJ180 and 8518 lam. long story short, after I installed the decals I noticed that the lam looked like it had been contaminated like if you would have spilled a chemical on it or something? sort of like looking at a surface that has had water spots on it might be a better explaination. These were masked and rolled up for storage for about a week in climate controlled office. Is this a no no with 8518 lam? The prints were hung and outgassed for several days before they were laminated and cut. Since they were rolled up and masked did some kind of reaction occur between the lam and mask?
Just wondering if anyone else has seen this?

John

 

[NHuckaby]

IF you let masking tape stay on the laminate to long it will start to leave some adhesive behind on the decal so it kind of gives it a dirty look

 

[ucmj22]

pics?

 

[Malkin]

Are you sure it wasn't like that right out of the laminator?
Sometimes the end of the rolls get kind of mottled looking.

Also, If I have to roll any kind of digital print that has been masked, it has to be a really loose roll, like 18" diameter or you risk wrinkling/tunneling

 

[ucmj22]

Are you sure it wasn't like that right out of the laminator?
Sometimes the end of the rolls get kind of mottled looking.

Also, If I have to roll any kind of digital print that has been masked, it has to be a really loose roll, like 18" diameter or you risk wrinkling/tunneling

This^^^ was a big problem I always had with 8518 and 8580
last 5 yards or more was usually unusable.

 

[strypguy]

Sorry no pics. I installed it and I think the customer is happy so I'm not going to worry too much. It looked perfect out of the laminator Malkin. Maybe I had it wound too tight. Definitely not adhesive residue as it looks like it's etched into the lam and you can't feel any imperfections.
I think I'll just leave everything hanging or laid out flat until I install next time. Lesson learned....

Thanks,

John

 

[jfiscus]

I've seen it a few times, the torch usually took it right out after/during installation. (if this is the same issue)
I've also seen similar on 3M cut vinyl, came out with torch also.

 

[Patentagosse]

I had the last 5 yards of an Oracal 290GF laminate roll with matte spots everywhere (usually fully gloss). I just run the heatgun over it and all came back shinny as expected. Yes, it's a waste of time but it happens with ALL brands, computer-cut color vinyls & laminates. Some are worst than others.

 

[thewood]

This^^^ was a big problem I always had with 8518 and 8580
last 5 yards or more was usually unusable.

Same here. We stopped using the 3M lam and switched back to Oracal 290. I never had the mottling issue on the 290.

I also can't stand the clear backing on the 8518.

 

[MikePro]

old roll?
i've seen this on my near-spent roll collection, of the 85__ that's 3+ yrs old, that I keep around for samples/tests (and because i'm a pack-rat)

 

[AdamLarson]

Sorry to hear you're having problems with 8518! The problem may be that the pre-mask you put on the 8518 is affecting the surface gloss. We do not recommend pre-masking on any of our gloss materials for that reason. The other cause could be surface impressions. Those usually show up right out of the box and can be removed by running a heat gun over the installed graphic. Since you mentioned it looked good on the laminator, that's probably not the cause, but it's a good tip to remember in case you run into that problem again.

I'd like to get some more information from you and see if there is any other way we can help you. What's the best way to contact you?

Adam Larson
3M Commercial Graphics- Marketing
651.733.9259

 

[Malkin]

Same here. We stopped using the 3M lam and switched back to Oracal 290. I never had the mottling issue on the 290.

I also can't stand the clear backing on the 8518.

On a semi-related note, 3M seems to have recently made the backing thinner, so the rolls are 10 lbs lighter and the roll appears smaller, though it's actually now 54 yards instead 50.

 

[datoshway]

I posted a forum post about 3m's lam appearing cloudy. It seems to be the same issue. I order multiple rolls a week and it's the same story on every roll. This week I tried Arlons kit and there is no cloudy effect. Definitely something with their lam.

 

[Brands Imaging]

we had this happen a few times....
just post heat

 

[WestcoastSigns]

This^^^ was a big problem I always had with 8518 and 8580
last 5 yards or more was usually unusable.

Yep! We usually have issues with 3m 8518 being spotty/blotchy near the end of the roll so don't think it's you. Not good but haven't found alternative yet.

 

[Stuckup]

The problem usually will go away, with heat and or time it goes away. Its good Vinyl not Chrome Mylar, many factors may change the GLOSS effect upon install, BUT most will come back to full gloss in short time. Same way felt squeegee scratches on vinyl dissipate with a heat gun.

 

[strypguy]

The 3M reps I talked to were very nice and helpful. I was just concerned that they recommend you don't pre-mask this stuff?? Especially for long periods of time. I have some customers that like to order decals and have them on hand. Those may sit around for weeks to months. I do very few wraps and mostly contour cut vehicle lettering.
What are you guys using for your vehicle lettering if it's printed? How about oracal 290?? Are their any issues with it being pre-masked for an extended period of time and causing problems?
Just seems odd to have an expensive cast material do this. And why does it do it?

John

 

[HulkSmash]

Sorry to hear you're having problems with 8518! The problem may be that the pre-mask you put on the 8518 is affecting the surface gloss. We do not recommend pre-masking on any of our gloss materials for that reason. The other cause could be surface impressions. Those usually show up right out of the box and can be removed by running a heat gun over the installed graphic. Since you mentioned it looked good on the laminator, that's probably not the cause, but it's a good tip to remember in case you run into that problem again.

I'd like to get some more information from you and see if there is any other way we can help you. What's the best way to contact you?

Adam Larson
3M Commercial Graphics- Marketing
651.733.9259

Not to mask 8518? How would you advise us to then apply dicut wraps or graphics...that doesn't make sense to me.

 

[strypguy]

I've been masking everything the day of installation just to be safe. Not sure what else to do but switch lams.

John

 

[eahicks]

Yeah.... Not masking laminated graphics is about the dumbest thing I have ever heard. I do it all the time! How else could you apply print and cut graphics and lettering? I love how 3M always has stupid solutions to their manufacturing issues to make the end user look dumb. I have had so many issues with all 3M laminates I nearly refuse to use them. Oracal seems the most consistent with their products.