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Another Hi from Oz

A

AusAndy

New Member
Hi. My name is Andy. Currently I am a partner in a software consulting business. I have long had an interest in graphic design and signwriting. Over the last few years I have made a point of learning Adobe Illustrator, Inkscape and Signcut Pro. I bought a cheap Redsail RS720 plotter, and recently upgraded to a mimaki cg75. Currently I am running a small business after hours doing signwriting for local clubs and volunteer orgs that cant afford to engage the services of professional signwriter. I dont make a lot of cash out of it, but I am learning and enjoying doing it. For me its not about the money, or not yet anyway!

One of my really good friends is a signwriter but a bad businessman! I have learned a lot of signwriting skills from him, and I am currently trying to convince him to start a business with me in control of finances! I have offered to finance startup costs, so hopefully over the next couple of years I can step down from IT and step into signwriting!

Anyway, the forum is great. I will probably do more reading than posting. I dont have a lot to contribute as far as signwriting is concerned, but maybe from time to time I can help out with the computer questions!

Thanks guys and gals.

Andy.
 
F

Fitch

New Member
"Currently I am running a small business after hours doing signwriting for local clubs and volunteer orgs that cant afford to engage the services of professional signwriter. I dont make a lot of cash out of it, but I am learning and enjoying doing it."

This is NOT a personal thing against you. But it is that approach that is screwing the industry. Let the local clubs and volunteer orgs have someone "sponsor" your FULL price of the sign. Sell the sign for its full price and not a cent less

"For me its not about the money, or not yet anyway!"

With that approach you will dread the day you want to go full time and there is some critter taking work away from you, doing "local clubs and volunteer organistaions", and you are finding it hard to make a living out of something you have a passion for.

Go learn from someone qualified, or absorb the cost and donate it yourself, read boards like 101, read industry mags, or whatever it takes to learn.

You will resent the day when you are full time and people come to you looking for the "same price you did it last time". All they will do is go elsewhere and find some other sucker. End result - no business for you. Don't count on loyalty.

Like I say, nothing personal, just business 101.

That aside, a genuine and friendly welcome from Sydney.

G

PS: You said "doing signwriting for local clubs and volunteer orgs that cant afford to engage the services of professional signwriter"

Are you MAKING SIGNS or actually SIGNWRITING with a brush and all??? If so with a brush - congrats - it's a fine craft.
 
Dave Drane

Dave Drane

New Member
AusAndy said:
Hi. My name is Andy. Currently I am a partner in a software consulting business. I have long had an interest in graphic design and signwriting. Over the last few years I have made a point of learning Adobe Illustrator, Inkscape and Signcut Pro. I bought a cheap Redsail RS720 plotter, and recently upgraded to a mimaki cg75. Currently I am running a small business after hours doing signwriting for local clubs and volunteer orgs that cant afford to engage the services of professional signwriter. I dont make a lot of cash out of it, but I am learning and enjoying doing it. For me its not about the money, or not yet anyway!

One of my really good friends is a signwriter but a bad businessman! I have learned a lot of signwriting skills from him, and I am currently trying to convince him to start a business with me in control of finances! I have offered to finance startup costs, so hopefully over the next couple of years I can step down from IT and step into signwriting!
And the last time I had a "software consultant" in they sent a kid out that was at high school 3 months ago and charged him out at $100/hour. I may just take this up after hours forv fun!!
fAnyway, the forum is great. I will probably do more reading than posting. I dont have a lot to contribute as far as signwriting is concerned, but maybe from time to time I can help out with the computer questions!

Thanks guys and gals.

Andy.
Click to expand...

Well, I will say welcome from the Sunshine Coast, 1 hour drive away. I don't think you have the right to call yourself a signwriter. When was the last time you sat and "wrote a sign?. I think you meant to say "signmaker.
Clubs and orgs that can't afford proper advertising are affecting me very badly at the moment because of twerps like yourself.
I dont make a lot of cash out of it, but I am learning and enjoying doing it. For me its not about the money, or not yet anyway!
Click to expand...
Thank you very much, I have spent all my life in this "trade", or hobby as you would call it and you think it is fine to go out and just destroy it so you can have some fun at my expense.
So what are you doing at the moment to put bread on the table? I would love to know because I may go into the same industry to earn a few bucks on the side and maybe take it up as a new hobby.
Thanks Fitch for your comment, it was what I am trying to say. Every day this is getting worse here. just last week I lost a job to a computer repair shop who is douing a few signs on the side because it is such a "lucrative business".:wine-smi:
And may I say that the last time I had a "software consultant" in they sent a kid out who was at high school 3 months ago and charged him out at $100/hour. I may take this industry up to make a few bucks after hours!
 
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A

AusAndy

New Member
Wow, so many negative responses. I figured from reading other repsonses here I might get the same.

Fitch,

I am learning from a real signwriter who has about 20 years experience. I am not sure I am taking money away from anyone, as I said the clubs are places that couldn't afford a professional anyway. Even if I were full time in the industry, i would not be getting the work from them anyway. I subsidise the cost of the materials by flogging of the odd car sticker to mates and there mates (the type you find at flea markets). I do signs for my 3 local clubs that I also volunteer for. They are rescue orgs, not pokie funded clubs. I also do a lot of graphic design work for paper flyers and booklets for them, so its not all just about making a sign for them.

Fitch, thanks for the constuctive advice. I will take it on board and rethink the way I am approaching it.

Dave,

I am actaully a tradesman, I have spent around 15 years in the IT industry and I charge way more that $100/hour. I gave up my trade cause it was a dying industry. If you think you can crack in the IT industry, go for it. I may even hire you. You dont need a degree to get a job with me, you just need to be willing to learn and willing to work. I have no problem with other people making a career out of software even if you are doing it as a hobby. In fact, a few weeks ago I lost a job to a teacher who does programming on the side. Good for him, I just move on to the next contract.

I am not doing any advertising signs, merely doing things like no parking signs, and maybe the odd window sign. You are correct, sign maker is probably a better term. I have done painted signs too, but not for a while.

If you think that someone like me can destroy the industry you are very wrong. I am no competition for a professional signshop. It is my intention to eventually start a business with 'real' signwriters, maybe then I will be competition, but for now rest assured, i wont be taking any work from you.

You said: Clubs and orgs that can't afford proper advertising are affecting me very badly at the moment because of twerps like yourself.

Perhaps you need to sit back and take a look at your business model then?
 
F

Fitch

New Member
LOL..."Wow, so many negative responses".

Actually there were only two "negative" responses. Dave and myself. Dave was a little harsher but that's between him and you. But I do agree with him.

Once again, it is not personal, and I do respect the fact that you might "rethink" your approach.

Dave has probably double my experience, and I respect him and the efforts and the road he has had to travel in the non digital age. That's craftsmanship in MY eyes. Others may differ but that's another topic.

One thing to remember is this... you said "I dont make a lot of cash out of it". That means you are making SOME money out of it which means you are undermining the guys that are in this full time as their only means of survival. Their superannuation (401k). For every job you do, you are taking away from the industry that you want to join and ideally... prosper.

Many parts make a whole and if we get a sh!t load of people in an area combining with the attitude of "If you think that someone like me can destroy the industry you are very wrong" well... you sound intelligent so I am sure you know what I mean. Basically there have been a lot of newcomers , so maybe you are newcomer newcomer that have spoilt a great vocation.

Unless you say something that gets my goat, I probably will end it here.

But... if you have a passion, if you have the drive, if you want to learn, if you want to make a good income with a great lifestyle, mixing with some phenominal people, in a world where every day is magic and you get to be who you want to be, without care, hassle, stress, strain, and the restrictions of being told what to do in a box, in a way you dont want to.........escaping into your own world where time slows down........ then resign from your job, put you a$$ on the line and go pretty the world with some fantastic signs.

The catalyst when I was younger was this.... ( I was a Bank Manager) if I died tomorrow there was nothing to say I was ever here. Well I am still alive with thousands of signs: static, mobile, one dimensional, three dimensional, digital, hand painted all over Australia. If I die tomorrow, no matter how the memory of others will fade, I know my signs will still be standing....and I've genuinely left something behind for others to admire.... even though they never knew me.

Cheers - G
 
Mosh

Mosh

New Member
Welcome. If you are doing something for the money you are in the wrong biz. Don't be a slave to the dollar, do something you love.
 
Bly

Bly

New Member
I remember when I started doing vinyl signs many years ago I also did jobs too cheap. It's amazing how those cheapskates manage to track you down years later to get something else at a giveaway price.
I think people here are trying tell you don't undervalue your work Andy, or it may come back to haunt you when you're trying to make a living from this.

Good luck mate.
 
A

AusAndy

New Member
Fitch said:
LOL..."Wow, so many negative responses".

Actually there were only two "negative" responses. Dave and myself. Dave was a little harsher but that's between him and you. But I do agree with him.
Click to expand...

This is true. Thanks to everyone who was welcoming.

Fitch said:
Once again, it is not personal, and I do respect the fact that you might "rethink" your approach.

Dave has probably double my experience, and I respect him and the efforts and the road he has had to travel in the non digital age. That's craftsmanship in MY eyes. Others may differ but that's another topic.

One thing to remember is this... you said "I dont make a lot of cash out of it". That means you are making SOME money out of it which means you are undermining the guys that are in this full time as their only means of survival. Their superannuation (401k). For every job you do, you are taking away from the industry that you want to join and ideally... prosper.

Many parts make a whole and if we get a sh!t load of people in an area combining with the attitude of "If you think that someone like me can destroy the industry you are very wrong" well... you sound intelligent so I am sure you know what I mean. Basically there have been a lot of newcomers , so maybe you are newcomer newcomer that have spoilt a great vocation.

Unless you say something that gets my goat, I probably will end it here.

But... if you have a passion, if you have the drive, if you want to learn, if you want to make a good income with a great lifestyle, mixing with some phenominal people, in a world where every day is magic and you get to be who you want to be, without care, hassle, stress, strain, and the restrictions of being told what to do in a box, in a way you dont want to.........escaping into your own world where time slows down........ then resign from your job, put you a$$ on the line and go pretty the world with some fantastic signs.

The catalyst when I was younger was this.... ( I was a Bank Manager) if I died tomorrow there was nothing to say I was ever here. Well I am still alive with thousands of signs: static, mobile, one dimensional, three dimensional, digital, hand painted all over Australia. If I die tomorrow, no matter how the memory of others will fade, I know my signs will still be standing....and I've genuinely left something behind for others to admire.... even though they never knew me.

Cheers - G
Click to expand...

So I have since spent a bit of time researching price (I was actually planning to go and by the price guide that a lot of sign suppliers sell prior to signing up here) and turns out that may actually be charging above industry rates. For the clubs in particular i tend just to charge material cost, but I do make a point of saying what they would be paying for it. I will change this approach now, and thell them the cost up front.

But, I do intend to forge on with my plans. I enjoy doing it, frustrating as it is at times. Times are changing, and for business to survive they have to grow and change with the times. Today, the craftsmen still exist and survive in the digital world, however their paintbrush is now a mouse or tablet. Any idiot can put text on to a screen and cut it out, but only a true craftsman can make it look good. That is where I am planning to go.
 
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