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Anybody deliberately buy 2 different brand / model printers?
- Thread starter milchad
- Start date
Oh sure,
It all depends on your needs you know. I wouldn't say that it has a lot to do with brand though. Our first printer was a Roland VS-640 and it really is a fine printer, quality is fenomenal and it's insanely reliable.
We soon realized that for the needs of our market don't really require very high quality print. They require low-medium quality and low prices. Then of course we got ourselves a production printer that runs on cheap mild-solvent and is durable outside.
So of course it depends on your needs. Brand loyalty isn't one of the important things for me, I personally think that all 3 of the big guys (Roland, Mimaki, Mutoh) produce printers on about the same level as far as quality and reliability goes.
May I ask why you're asking that ?
It all depends on your needs you know. I wouldn't say that it has a lot to do with brand though. Our first printer was a Roland VS-640 and it really is a fine printer, quality is fenomenal and it's insanely reliable.
We soon realized that for the needs of our market don't really require very high quality print. They require low-medium quality and low prices. Then of course we got ourselves a production printer that runs on cheap mild-solvent and is durable outside.
So of course it depends on your needs. Brand loyalty isn't one of the important things for me, I personally think that all 3 of the big guys (Roland, Mimaki, Mutoh) produce printers on about the same level as far as quality and reliability goes.
May I ask why you're asking that ?
Quality is a must in the application I am looking at. I guess we might be interested in the benefits of latex when it comes to drying time. I talked to a HP latex user a couple weeks ago and he said that his HP has a hard time holding consistent color which concerns me quite a bit.
ProColorGraphics
New Member
Never had a color issue with either my L25 or L26. I made test prints from my Roland to my HP and the quality of the HP was WAY better. I think the HP works better if you can fine tune it to your location, use, etc. whereas the Roland is more of a plug it in and go. If I was to add a printer now that I have my HP, I would probably look at an Epson S70 to offer the white and silver ink.
I first want to point out that most of these are my own, very subjective options and thoughts.
The first thing I want to touch upon is drying time. A lot of people here are on and about it all the time but personally for me it has never been an issue. Most of the time I'll just take what comes from the printer, do the post-production, if any and if it has to go out right away...of it goes. Never had a problem with it so I'm not sure why so many people are obsessing about solvent drying time here. Even when it comes to car wraps deadlines tend to be tight so it goes almost instantly from the printer to the laminator, also never had a problem. We have half a dozen or so vehicles on the road for almost 2 years now and none of the clients ever complained. As a matter of fact yesterday I saw one of them and it looks like on day 1.
As far as latex goes, or more specifically HP. Well...that depends on a lot on the dealer to be honest, that's the case with pretty much anything really. We have the worst dealer in the world with our Roland but the Roland itself is a fine machine. I don't have much personal experience with latex printer, in the sense that I never owned one. We had a huge scitex in a company I was a partner in a few years back and it was a huge pain in the ***. Your experience might vary with this but three things that really put me off with latex printers is: more expensive ink, being locked in to HP ink and HP itself.
My current technician worked for HP back in the day and he says that the machines themselves tend to be fine, with some exceptions, but it's the HP people that are ***holes. You are basically forces to use their inks (at least in our market) as well as their support cause nobody else knows how to support these machines and even if they did HP's supply chain is airtight so you can't any spare parts out of it...
All of the problems that I'm mentioning here are mostly related to price and the attitude of the HP people. From a high production perspective I personally can't see how someone can justify the enormous price tag of a HP or Vutek when you can these days get a printer that does 70-80% of what these can do for 1/10th the price tag, but maybe that's just me.
As far as quality goes I am incredibly satisfied with the quality our VS-640 outputs and I wish we would do more with it. It's also incredibly reliable, we have it for 2 years and it has only given us any trouble once. You can basically leave it overnight to print and you won't have any trouble, I've only done this once or twice because there is no need and the possibility of some unforeseen problems is always there, my main concern is the media freaking out and damaging the head in some way.
Hope this helps you.
The first thing I want to touch upon is drying time. A lot of people here are on and about it all the time but personally for me it has never been an issue. Most of the time I'll just take what comes from the printer, do the post-production, if any and if it has to go out right away...of it goes. Never had a problem with it so I'm not sure why so many people are obsessing about solvent drying time here. Even when it comes to car wraps deadlines tend to be tight so it goes almost instantly from the printer to the laminator, also never had a problem. We have half a dozen or so vehicles on the road for almost 2 years now and none of the clients ever complained. As a matter of fact yesterday I saw one of them and it looks like on day 1.
As far as latex goes, or more specifically HP. Well...that depends on a lot on the dealer to be honest, that's the case with pretty much anything really. We have the worst dealer in the world with our Roland but the Roland itself is a fine machine. I don't have much personal experience with latex printer, in the sense that I never owned one. We had a huge scitex in a company I was a partner in a few years back and it was a huge pain in the ***. Your experience might vary with this but three things that really put me off with latex printers is: more expensive ink, being locked in to HP ink and HP itself.
My current technician worked for HP back in the day and he says that the machines themselves tend to be fine, with some exceptions, but it's the HP people that are ***holes. You are basically forces to use their inks (at least in our market) as well as their support cause nobody else knows how to support these machines and even if they did HP's supply chain is airtight so you can't any spare parts out of it...
All of the problems that I'm mentioning here are mostly related to price and the attitude of the HP people. From a high production perspective I personally can't see how someone can justify the enormous price tag of a HP or Vutek when you can these days get a printer that does 70-80% of what these can do for 1/10th the price tag, but maybe that's just me.
As far as quality goes I am incredibly satisfied with the quality our VS-640 outputs and I wish we would do more with it. It's also incredibly reliable, we have it for 2 years and it has only given us any trouble once. You can basically leave it overnight to print and you won't have any trouble, I've only done this once or twice because there is no need and the possibility of some unforeseen problems is always there, my main concern is the media freaking out and damaging the head in some way.
Hope this helps you.
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2B
Active Member
Running two machines has to have twice the supplies / knowledge / support plus there is the point of having/knowing multiple RIP programs
there are plenty of users here whom swear by latex and who have had both machines types.
Since Latex is a "newer" ink type the range of media is not as wide as solvent / Eco-solvent
we run VS 640s and have yet to to have an issue with poor print quality, it really always comes down to having a good media / substrate and correct profiles.
there are plenty of users here whom swear by latex and who have had both machines types.
Since Latex is a "newer" ink type the range of media is not as wide as solvent / Eco-solvent
we run VS 640s and have yet to to have an issue with poor print quality, it really always comes down to having a good media / substrate and correct profiles.
mark in tx
New Member
Boils down to what the application is.
Banners? 99% of them are fine with a 4 color machine.
Vehicle wraps, mdo signs? same thing.
Posters, display pieces, tradeshow graphics? 4-6 color machine.
Giclee? 8-12 color machine.
Of course it all depends on the print modes, speeds, and profiles used with each machine.
I have seen 4 color machines properly profiled and tuned that produce spectacular output.
Also seen 4 color machines that print like crap.
Same for every type of printer out there.
Banners? 99% of them are fine with a 4 color machine.
Vehicle wraps, mdo signs? same thing.
Posters, display pieces, tradeshow graphics? 4-6 color machine.
Giclee? 8-12 color machine.
Of course it all depends on the print modes, speeds, and profiles used with each machine.
I have seen 4 color machines properly profiled and tuned that produce spectacular output.
Also seen 4 color machines that print like crap.
Same for every type of printer out there.
Bah, I admit I'm tech savvy but the issue of another RIP should never deter you from a good machine, you'll usually learn it in a few days as long as you know to use some other rip properly.
I'm not saying Latex is bad, quite the contrary. I'm saying that HP seems to be run by ***holes around here and the even bigger ***holes running print companies around here drove the prices so far down that latex is expensive compared to solvent. I'm pretty sure that latex is a perfectly fine option in the U.S...though I find it insane that the high production machines run for 200k+, same goes for Vutek, which is solvent in case you're not familiar with it.
Yea..as far as the 640 goes...great little machine, I am yet to see a machine that has better print quality than it to be honest. Good media, personally I prefer avery cause of the higher gloss it has compared to Oracal, and properly profiled and you're golden.
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I get the same feeling when I talk to HP sales reps, especially the ones I met at SGIA a few years back. As far as the comment about learning multiple RIPs, with Caldera, that shouldn't be a problem. I'm seriously considering a Seiko ColorPainter W-64s. The local sales rep is very knowledgeable and carry all the equipment / software I want under one roof. (Minus the cutter because I want a Zund). They also have full time technicians that can service the equipment in case there is a problem. If Seiko isn't the answer, they also sell Rolands.
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