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Backroom Graphic Services

Would you use any of the services described in this thread?

  • Yes

    Votes: 5 55.6%
  • No

    Votes: 2 22.2%
  • Not sure

    Votes: 2 22.2%

  • Total voters
    9

Fred Weiss

Merchant Member
This thread is to inquire as to your interest and needs for a variety of graphic services we are considering offering to the trade. These services would be based on us having a number of programs, which you may not have, as well as the experience to use them. These programs include:

  • Adobe Photoshop
  • Adobe Illustrator
  • Gerber Omega
  • SAI Flexisign
  • Astute Graphics Plugins for Adobe Illustrator Including Vector First Aid Automated Vector Cleanup
  • Topaz AI Suite for Image Editing and Enhancement
  • Luminar for Image Editing and Enhancement
  • Topaz AI Gigapixel for Image Enlarging
  • On1 Resize for Image Enlarging
  • Topaz Mask AI
  • Vertus Fluid Mask
  • Filter Forge Seamless Texture Creation
  • Genetica Seamless Texture Creation
  • Find My Font Typeface Identification
  • A Huge Library of First Tier Commercial Fonts
If we proceed there will be a detailed list of specific services on our website. For now it is limited only by one's imagination and needs. Our focus would be on delivering professional quality results on a same or next day basis at very attractive prices and with no job being too small. A short list of services would include:

  • Image editing, improvement and enhancement.
  • File conversion from a format you can't use to one you can use.
  • Image enlargements using the latest technologies.
  • Ready to use layouts for print, cut or print-and-cut in EPS, PDF or Gerber PLT format as well as most other universal formats.
  • Typeface identification.
  • Typesetting.
  • Background removal (masking) of images as well as background replacements.
  • Creation of custom seamless texture tiles.
We will specifically NOT be offering any vector digitizing services for which we highly recommend The Vector Doctor who is also a Signs 101 merchant member.

Is this a service you might use? If so, what most interests you?
 

Val47

New Member
sometimes we do some of these things for each other. for free, just to be nice.
would that become frowned on?
 

GAC05

Quit buggin' me
Sounds interesting Fred. My mind being what it is, I read 'Bathroom Graphic Services' and clicked-in right away.
 

Fred Weiss

Merchant Member
Sounds interesting Fred. My mind being what it is, I read 'Bathroom Graphic Services' and clicked-in right away.

Being a decent multitasker, I might well do a job for you while taking taking care of my own needs. You can rest assured that there would not be any additional costs or surcharges should this occur.
 

Jburns

New Member
I think its a good idea Fred.

I think most shop owners enjoy selling, fabricating and getting paid versus a focus on the above services.

It would be good to anticipate:

1. How to respond when shop owner / manager has to ask for multiple revisions.
2. If your prepared file doesn't print the way the owner expected-- that's more on the hardware end.
3. limits for work- wraps, or primarily signs.
4. consider offering mock/ups or architectural renderings, so your customer can present professional proposal,
5. Form requesting everything you need explicitly- to limit the constant back an forth emails
6. I think shop owners have a time threshold for design, conversion and layout? If you know what that is, there is the dollar value.
7. If your process template is fast and easy- you will get more business.
 

Bobby H

Arial Sucks.
In one respect it's a strange kind of fun to fix graphics problems. On the other hand this idea feels like opening a great big can of worms. Putting it bluntly, no one wants to do any kind of freelance graphics work and/or graphics trouble-shooting services at the risk of getting ripped off by a client that you never meet in person who in the end refuses to pay.

Virtually all of the clients for whom I do graphics work reside here in the region where I live. They have an established identity and physical address where they can be reached. Clients typically sign contracts or at least purchase orders to lay down a legal paper trail for services rendered. If a client refuses to pay in "the real world" there are very real consequences. The same isn't as true on the 'net.

It would be great for Signs 101 to have an additional operation as a sort of crowd-source hub for graphics services, where forum participants here can earn a little extra money doing various graphics odd jobs. But, as I said before, protections need to be built-in for the talent doing the work. And, risking a little ire here, not all sign designers are in the same league in terms of design prowess. So that's another issue that opens an entirely different can of worms. Let's also not forget the possible conflicts of interest designers could have with their employers doing sign design work on the side.

Looking at the list of applications above brought up a number of obvious questions or observations. Most obviously there is no mention of CorelDRAW, regardless of the fact it is arguably the most prevalent vector drawing program in sign shops everywhere. I've used CorelDRAW for what seems like forever in terms of years. At the same time I'm a big Adobe fan and I could check off a couple or more of those list items, such as using Astute Graphics' amazing suite of plugins for Illustrator CC.

Regarding trendy commercial fonts people have on hand, not wanting to step on the Vector Doctor's services and some other issues, the whole proposal is a really complicated situation.
 

Fred Weiss

Merchant Member
I think its a good idea Fred.

I think most shop owners enjoy selling, fabricating and getting paid versus a focus on the above services.

It would be good to anticipate:

1. How to respond when shop owner / manager has to ask for multiple revisions.
2. If your prepared file doesn't print the way the owner expected-- that's more on the hardware end.
3. limits for work- wraps, or primarily signs.
4. consider offering mock/ups or architectural renderings, so your customer can present professional proposal,
5. Form requesting everything you need explicitly- to limit the constant back an forth emails
6. I think shop owners have a time threshold for design, conversion and layout? If you know what that is, there is the dollar value.
7. If your process template is fast and easy- you will get more business.

Great reply Jburns. It's appreciated.

Your point #1 is frankly my main concern. Image quality is certainly very subjective and will undoubtedly produce some percentage of wasted time and lost sales. Limits on revisions and a good customer work order form should keep the issue manageable. My attitude towards lost business is, I think a prevalent one for most business owners and corporate executives. That being, you're going to get some failures, but they should be a small amount and profits are what one's focus needs to be on.

I recall as a teenager my father, who owned four unattended 24 hours a day coin laundries, said this to me regarding the vandalism and attempted break-ins to coin boxes he experienced on a regular basis.

"The cost of parts and labor to make repairs is about 10% of sales. The cost of employing attendants and modifying our hours is far greater."

So as long as I've done what I can to be a first swing hitter I will accept the occasional hard or impossible to please client. I think my batting average will be good enough to stay profitable.
 

Fred Weiss

Merchant Member
In one respect it's a strange kind of fun to fix graphics problems. On the other hand this idea feels like opening a great big can of worms. Putting it bluntly, no one wants to do any kind of freelance graphics work and/or graphics trouble-shooting services at the risk of getting ripped off by a client that you never meet in person who in the end refuses to pay.

I agree on the can of worms and more or less addressed it in my post just above. I may simply present an image enhancement service as simply an artificial intelligence process with two or three proofs presented as a alternate of choice. I might even add a satisfaction guarantee. The presentation, limitation policies and the work itself will certainly be monitored and modified as it evolves.

Virtually all of the clients for whom I do graphics work reside here in the region where I live. They have an established identity and physical address where they can be reached. Clients typically sign contracts or at least purchase orders to lay down a legal paper trail for services rendered. If a client refuses to pay in "the real world" there are very real consequences. The same isn't as true on the 'net.

True. The only consequences are that we lose a sale and the client still doesn't have what they want. Since this would be a pay up before receipt of the final product, we are working on spec. Keep in mind though, the average invoice in this business model is likely less than $50.00. So a long haul policy might be weeding out those who stiff you by refusing any future jobs from them.

It would be great for Signs 101 to have an additional operation as a sort of crowd-source hub for graphics services, where forum participants here can earn a little extra money doing various graphics odd jobs. But, as I said before, protections need to be built-in for the talent doing the work. And, risking a little ire here, not all sign designers are in the same league in terms of design prowess. So that's another issue that opens an entirely different can of worms. Let's also not forget the possible conflicts of interest designers could have with their employers doing sign design work on the side.

1. I've always thought it was something that could work but the logistics and administration of it would probably be a nightmare.
2. In my situation the quality and acceptance of any service offered is just based on my skills ... not the mixed results that might be the case you mention in your example.
3. When that happens it isn't the fault of the crowd-source hub.

Looking at the list of applications above brought up a number of obvious questions or observations. Most obviously there is no mention of CorelDRAW, regardless of the fact it is arguably the most prevalent vector drawing program in sign shops everywhere. I've used CorelDRAW for what seems like forever in terms of years. At the same time I'm a big Adobe fan and I could check off a couple or more of those list items, such as using Astute Graphics' amazing suite of plugins for Illustrator CC.

I would probably offer file conversions for CorelDraw also, but not much else. With PDF, EPS or other universal formats being offered for delivery on some other services, I am not experienced enough in CorelDRAW to do layouts in it comfortably, correctly and efficiently. We all have our preferences and for vector setups or editing, I like Flexisign best and Illustrator because it produces no-problem EPS and PDF files.

Astute Graphics' Vector First Aid plug-in does a far superior job of node and vector cleanup than does Illustrator's or Flexisign's global cleanup routines. Given a choice, it is the only cleanup routine I've found that I would choose to use.

Regarding trendy commercial fonts people have on hand, not wanting to step on the Vector Doctor's services and some other issues, the whole proposal is a really complicated situation.

Yes and it would be monitored and modified as part of a normal evolution. The only conflicts I can envision would be whether or not I would run Vector First Aid on an auto traced image from a client or whether I would perform a high resolution auto trace on a photograph or other image a client submitted. Current thinking would be probably yes. Especially since Illustrator does such a phenomenal job at auto tracing a photo. Because Illustrator posterizes a photo there is some loss of quality, but you end up with a scalable vector that can be enlarged to any size with no further loss of quality and is generally acceptable when viewed from a reasonable distance. So you can take a photo that is 6 inches tall and scale it up to 6 feet tall with much greater acceptable quality than if you tried the same scaling with a bitmap image enlargement application.
 
Last edited:

Stacey K

I like making signs
I would use this for photos. Removing backgrounds, touching up a face, general quality. Had a stupid photo from a customer and it was a png so transparent. I needed a gray shadow on the bottom, the background opaque without losing the color, the edges cleaned up. I'm guessing this is child's play for most but it was a nightmare for me. That's the kind of stuff I need help with.

I do enjoy monkeying around with photos but I only have Corel and LXI. Corel is pretty new to me so it's a slow process having to google everything lol

Keep up posted
 

Johnny Best

Active Member
So you got two photo enlargements and three cans of worms, cash or credit?
freds.jpg
 

Billct2

Active Member
I think it would be useful to me. Especially when I get files done on the newer versions of Adobe that I can't import into Corel.
 

Fred Weiss

Merchant Member
We have decided to proceed with offering our services to the trade and are officially open for business. These services will be individually described and shown with before and after images on our website with pages being added as quickly as possible. If interested, please follow our progress by clicking into our Graphic Services Main Page.

Questions, comments, suggestions or orders are welcome and best given through our website Contact Us section.
 
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