Welcome To Signs101.com: Largest Forum for Signmaking Professionals

Signs101.com: Largest Forum for Signmaking Professionals is the LARGEST online community & discussion forum for professional sign-makers and graphic designers.

 


  1. This site uses cookies. By continuing to use this site, you are agreeing to our use of cookies. Learn More.

Best way to deal with companies wanting to be listed on your Insurance?

Discussion in 'Sales, Marketing, Pricing Etc.' started by FatCat, Jan 9, 2019.

  1. FatCat

    FatCat Very Active Member

    1,856
    98
    48
    Feb 12, 2007
    Columbus, Ohio
    So, we get requests to do installs frequently throughout the year from shops outside our area and from other states. An issue we are running into (and one I am dealing with at the moment) is that we get request to do the work, we make a bid, company accepts bid, we do work and then send invoice for payment. However, it seems we then receive a notice about how we need to have them listed on our COI (Certificate of Insurance) in order for them to release the check for payment...

    Now, I don't have an issue doing this, as we do it all the time as long as a company asks up front I have no problem. The issue is that every time I ask my insurance company to send an updated COI with a new customer listed they charge me for it. (Can't remember if it's $25 or $35, but they charge me.) So then it winds up costing us money to do this just so we can get paid. I guess the easy thing to do is to build that cost in every job whether or not they ask for it, but it just seems like they almost do this intentionally to skirt the cost associated with doing this.

    Any thoughts?
     
    Tags:
  2. Gino

    Gino Major Contributor

    30,372
    1,366
    113
    Jun 7, 2006
    PA
    You have two separate problems here.

    First, get a new insurance company. They shouldn't be charging like that for something which takes 2 minutes to do. Ours doesn't charge a thing, regardless of how many times a year we get it done. Next, make sure your quote says all items need to be filled in before work is commenced, or you will not perform said tasks. You dictate the terms and have a YOUR questionnaire filled out from them asking specific questions. Also, determine if you wanna be paid upfront or at least get a deposit.

    No sense working for free, if these morons wanna play games. I'll go fishing or drinking, rather than pay outta pocket their costs.
     
    • Agree Agree x 2
  3. Johnny Best

    Johnny Best Very Active Member

    2,172
    1,201
    113
    Dec 9, 2015
    buffalo ny
    My problem was the insurance company would take their time sending one to me. So I scanned the paper, bought it into Photoshop, took off the old name of company and left it blank and save it as a .jpeg. Next time I needed one just put the new name where old one was and sent it that way.
     
    • Like Like x 2
  4. Billct2

    Billct2 Major Contributor

    6,780
    382
    83
    Mar 12, 2005
    New England
    My insurance company doesn't charge either. You can add a charge for Insurance Paperwork as part of the disclaimers on all contracts
     
  5. Texas_Signmaker

    Texas_Signmaker Very Active Member

    1,756
    657
    113
    Oct 21, 2016
    Frisco, TX
    I second finding a new insurance company. I use The Hartford and they usually get me one within 10-15 mins. at no cost. Maybe call your agent up and tell them most people don't charge for that service and you are going to jump ship...maybe they will waive it for you.

    But that's kind of abnormal for them to ask AFTER the job is done. Usually they ask before a PO is issued. Guess the project manager there is slackin'
     
    • Agree Agree x 1
  6. Reveal1

    Reveal1 Member

    60
    19
    8
    Nov 7, 2010
    Cape Girardeau, MO
    FYI some insurance companies have online apps that allow you to generate your own COI.
     
    • Like Like x 1
  7. Z SIGNS

    Z SIGNS Active Member

    904
    65
    28
    Feb 14, 2009
    Trenton NJ
    Here is what I do.......You want me to install a sign for you. Ok it will x amount of dollars. Send the check along with the sign. Tape it to the the sign face for safe keeping and we will get er done for you.
     
    • Like Like x 1
  8. Pat Whatley

    Pat Whatley Major Contributor

    8,558
    71
    48
    Sep 29, 2003
    Wetumpka, AL
    Put it on the quote that if they need it then it will be an additional $40 charge. The insurance company may not charge you but you're still stopping what you're doing and taking the time to get everything handled.
     
    • Like Like x 1
    • Agree Agree x 1
  9. Pat Whatley

    Pat Whatley Major Contributor

    8,558
    71
    48
    Sep 29, 2003
    Wetumpka, AL
    STORY TIME: I had a company call about sending me some acrylic lettering to install at a bank location. It wasn't much, it was literally a block from my shop, I gave them a price of $200 but told them I needed payment up front because I wasn't chasing down another sign broker for payment (even Google returned no results on their name). They agreed to send the check with the lettering. Lettering arrived, no check. Called them, they said they would issue a check 60 days after I submitted pictures of the completed job and an invoice. Reminded them we'd agreed on payment up front, they said they'd see what they could do. Two months later I get an email asking for pictures of the lettering so I emailed them a picture of the box still sitting on my floor. Immediately the **** hit the fan, I had calls from two different people there at the same time insisting that I go install the lettering by the end of the day. Offered to take a credit card payment, no, they insisted on 60 day terms. They told me they'd just get someone else to do it and have them come pick up the letters from me. Next morning I get a phone call asking for pictures of the installed lettering, I tell them it's sitting on the floor, nobody picked it up. Repeat the conversation from the day before. Day three I get the call from someone else wanting to know what it will take to get the lettering installed that day, I tell him I'll email an invoice, he can pay it online by credit card, and I'll run take care of it. At 3:00 it was finally paid. Go to install the lettering, they sent stud mounted lettering....the wall was frosted glass. Never heard from the sign broker again.
     
    • Hilarious! Hilarious! x 6
    • Like Like x 2
    • OMG / Wow! OMG / Wow! x 1
  10. Texas_Signmaker

    Texas_Signmaker Very Active Member

    1,756
    657
    113
    Oct 21, 2016
    Frisco, TX
    :roflmao:
     
  11. visual800

    visual800 Very Active Member

    3,604
    170
    63
    Aug 4, 2010
    montgomery, alabama
    love it!
     
  12. Gino

    Gino Major Contributor

    30,372
    1,366
    113
    Jun 7, 2006
    PA
    Had one about a month ago, almost the same. Wanted a banner on a wall installed on a building..... coming soon. Also a 4 x 5 sign on an interior wall. Asked for payment upfront and they said, as soon as you get the stuff up and show us pictures, we'll release the payment. They sent the packages to our shop and then I said, I drove by the place. There's no place to hang the banner as in your drawing. It's a complete glass front, unless I anchor into the mullions. No don't do that. Okay, should I use some of those glass screws I just got at Home Depot ?? Yeah, use them. Okay. Oh, by the way, there's no interior wall to hang the other sign. Yeah, we know, just put it anywhere.

    Ahh, come and get your signs, I don't wanna do work for you guys any longer. You don't have any clue as to what you're doing and I ain't gonna be the fall guy when the sh!t hits the fan.
     
    • Hilarious! Hilarious! x 1
  13. GB2

    GB2 Very Active Member

    1,818
    58
    48
    Nov 15, 2005
    Connecticut, USA
    So, standard practice dictates that every company you do sub-contract installations for should require a COI, whether they remember to ask for it up front or not, so you should just insure that you have a current COI filed with them as part of your own routine. Your insurance company should not be charging you for them but if they are then you should just work that minimal cost into every estimate you do for sub-contract installations as you suggested. I agree that we should all hold a hard line on getting a 50% deposit before any work begins or getting paid in full up front. Many of these national companies are reliable but I'm starting to find more and more that will try to get away with not paying at all after the job is complete.
     
  14. Jean Shimp

    Jean Shimp Member

    178
    22
    18
    Oct 26, 2012
    jacksonville, fl
    The only time we get a charge from our insurance company is when we have to add a new company as an "additional insured" with some legaleze clauses behind it. They charge around $25 for this. Otherwise they send a COI out whenever we need them to pretty quickly.
     
    • Agree Agree x 1
  15. FatCat

    FatCat Very Active Member

    1,856
    98
    48
    Feb 12, 2007
    Columbus, Ohio
    Yes, I was mistaken - they don't charge for a COI, but additional insured, my bad. But still, just one of those headache things where I think "Hey, job is done, pay me!" Lol.
     
  16. Either you didn't comply with the terms of the contract from the sign forwarding company or they forgot to include the terms in their contract. People make mistakes, and if you want to be a good guy just send them the COI. If the terms were not in the original contract, I would consider writing a change order and billing for any additional expense.

    Unless you violated the terms of the contract by not supplying the COI, you have every right to demand payment on the original terms and are under no obligation to supply anything additional as a condition of being payed. It is illegal for them to add additional conditions after the fact. Like I said, it is often best practice to talk it over and comply with their request, especially if there is no additional cost involved and you want to continue the relationship. In some cases, however, complying with the request after the fact may be expensive or inconvenient, especially if they are asking to be named as additional insured.

    In any case, if the work is done and you are off the property, the sign is now part of the property, and any liability going forward is the responsibility of the property owner. Producing a COI after the work is done has no legal consequences.

    Note: I am not a lawyer, but this is my understanding or how this works. As always, consult an attorney for legal advice.
     
  17. FireSprint

    FireSprint Merchant Member

    We have pretty much always complied with the customer's request. Just part of doing business with a larger company that crosses their i's and dots their t's....... :confused:
     
  18. Jester1167

    Jester1167 Very Active Member

    Most agents wouldn't tell you but you could ask for a once a year payment of $150 for unlimited additions. It was something you had to ask for.

    My new insurance company does it for free.
     
  19. Adding additional insured entities onto a policy will expand coverage and comes at a cost. If your agent is endorsing additional insureds without underwriting the insurance company could deny the claim and the insured party (you) may need to file suit for damages from the agent. This will only happen if there is a claim, so many agents will look the other way if they feel the liability is minimal.

    My insurance company will endorse additional insureds for a fee. The policy will need a rider detailing the scope and duration of the additional coverage, and that comes at both a underwriting and administrative cost to the insurance company. It is reasonable to expect them to charge for it.

    A Certificate of Insurance only has administrative costs attached to it. Many agents will draw these up for free or at a nominal administrative cost. If the client is requesting a COI comes directly from the insurance company (many will), then a small fee is not unreasonable. Otherwise, you can just make a copy of what you already have on file. A COI only proves the insured has the necessary coverage to comply with the clients requirements. There is no additional responsibility or liability to the insurance company.
     
Loading...

Share This Page

 


Loading...