Welcome To Signs101.com: Largest Forum for Signmaking Professionals

Signs101.com: Largest Forum for Signmaking Professionals is the LARGEST online community & discussion forum for professional sign-makers and graphic designers.


  1. This site uses cookies. By continuing to use this site, you are agreeing to our use of cookies. Learn More.

Bright Long Lasting Channel Letters, and What It Takes

Discussion in 'Electric Signs & Channel Letters' started by Westcoast Sign Guy, Sep 24, 2015.

  1. Westcoast Sign Guy

    Westcoast Sign Guy Very Active Member

    Jan 3, 2005
    San Diego, CA

    As some of you may already know The Sign Syndicate has been testing NC LEDs since 2010 in Project Tighty Whitey, The Red Light District, & Blue Light Special and after the first 8,000 hours I was pretty impressed in "PTW" that even at that short about of time we saw no light degradation. So I was always interested to see how they progressed, err....regressed in light as time went on.

    As many of you know, I don't use LEDs as a primary light source for channel letters unless I have too.

    When I have had to use LEDs over the years I've always been real careful about what LED manufacturer I use, and there is a VERY, VERY short list of who I use/used because I'm one of the few electric sign manufacturers that offers my clients a 5 year electrical "Worry Free" warranty that INCLUDES labor to change any electrical component out and I stress....."I"...chose to use for their sign.

    Most sign shops stick to the 1 year state mandatory (contractors licensing law) warranty, and "optional" or limited component warranty that does NOT include labor for up to 5 years. So should some component YOU chose crap out on your client then I guess they call you, you get a free replacement from the manufacturer and YOU end up charging YOUR client to replace something YOU specified out.....oh real nice!!!

    With my clients I put my money where my mouth is, so that's why my list of who to use is short, if it goes bad because of what I specified out I eat it, NOT my client!!!

    5 years is a long time, and those who pay attentions to the 3rd party testing that The Sign Syndicate has been doing since 2008 knows most LEDs don't last as long as claimed, at least when it comes to "usable" light.

    I've been using NC LED for a particular program for a few years now where I have to use LEDs because the use of electrical component clearance is impossible for Neon. Over the years the results have been awesome using NC LED, and of course happy clients.

    The main reason why I choose to use NC LED for my program before we even started selling it here which is obviously recent, is because from the testing we have been doing here namely Project Tighty Whitey as it applies here.....there are a few things in common the brighter white LEDs in the comparison that last longer than others have in common.

    1st....Their made in Korea, very tight quality control, think "Japan"!.......NOT China where they have quality control issues. Don't let anyone tell you different, there is too much of a track record and case history for INCONSISTENCY and manufacturers have to constantly hold the hand of the Chinese to make sure they're getting consistency and this is why American companies play musical chairs with Chinese plants who make their products.

    2nd....Their constant current, or current regulated on each module...NOT constant voltage aka "Eco". So if you're not familiar with that term Constant Current just know each module is 12 volts from the first to the last on a string. A LED module that is ...NOT CC is constant voltage, aka "Eco"! Those are unregulated and the first LED module on a string is different than the LED on the last, or middle. It also means the first LED on the string could be taking a big hit from the power supply because it's not regulated and you'll get faster degradation as well as uneven lighting.

    This is not to say others that aren't with similar characteristics will last nearly as long (there have been exceptions), but degradation over 15,000 hours or 5 sign years is left on 8 hours a day has been about 0 to 3% of the original illumination, that's something that should interest you and the end user.

    NC LED some with different three diode manufacturers, SOL, LG, & Samsung. I took a personal hand for us to use SAMSUNG, their white is brighter than the other configurations, it's more of a true 6500 white, and you need bright! The LED colors that we stock are SOL chip.

    Every LED manufacturer has their marketing claims on Lumens, Viewing Angle, Lens..no lens, etc etc etc. From the Neon & LED testing we have been doing here on the Sign Syndicate they can throw all that out the window because it doesn't translate into anywhere when it comes to the sign industry, how we use them, and how it makes them last over time. 90% of the time it's just a sales pitch to throw at you on why you should buy their over another one. Who cares about Lumens when it comes to signs...we light up a sign face and only care about surface light! Viewing angle??? Don't get me started!

    What do we care about being in the sign industry? That it's bright, and most importantly it lasts over time....well...at least the client does more so than the sign sign shop because it's them who will have to pay to re-retrofit to something else.

    So, we're very happy to offer the NC LED light source product to Signs 101 members that we know works as an option for your sign projects. It's nice to add another High Brightness LED to our line up on The Sign Syndicate!

    If you're the type of shop that just likes to stick to big name LED manufacturers because you think you're playing it safe and you're also not too familiar with the testing The Sign Syndicate has been doing since 2008 let me just say this. From all the testing we have been doing with out benchmark testing, and we've talked about it a lot in the past. You pay a lot of money to big name LED manufacturers and the product itself is most of the time is average and most a lot of times sub par compared to what's out there from a few small select LED manufacturers. You pay a lot and you get very little. What I mean by that is, you don't get a whole lot of light in return and you could pay significantly less and get a brighter light output and a product that will even last longer. Not all big names, but you'll have to download the quarterly results that we have in the Board forum and judge for yourself. Like I said, VERY good results from a FEW select companies and NC LED is one of those, and that's why I'm very proud to offer it to our members.

    Why leave money on the table and why not have a more satisfied client?

    Basic NC LED Specs

    • IP68
    • 5 Year, 50,000 Hour Warranty
    • Constant Current (Regulated) - NOT Constant Current
    • Made in Korea.....NOT made in China
    • High Brightness LEDs
    • Samsung Diodes for white
    • Sol Diodes for color

    As I stated above, we're offering 100 of the most versatile NC LED Module which is the two diode module, the HLCS2 powered by Samsung for only $99.99
    I'm still working on our online shopping cart for the next few days on this product but you can purchase these LEDs by phone (858) 880-1400, emailing us orders@thesignsyndicate.com or using this LINK

    Attached Files:

  2. visual800

    visual800 Very Active Member

    Aug 4, 2010
    montgomery, alabama
    thank you sir!
  3. visualeyez

    visualeyez Member

    Jan 23, 2007
    How do these compare to the Aurora G2G Gen III modules? They run 300 lumens/ft. which blinds me at .96 watts per module.
  4. player

    player Major Contributor

    Apr 24, 2006
    This is the longest sales pitch I have seen here on Ssigns101.
  5. Westcoast Sign Guy

    Westcoast Sign Guy Very Active Member

    Jan 3, 2005
    San Diego, CA

    I've never heard of those and had to Google them, never tested them either.

    Just looking at them I'm going to have to say their Chinese, their constant voltage not constant current and probably even patent infringing against Permlight, maybe why their newest ones are PVC.

    At what rate they degrade over time I can't say, but constant voltage does degrade much faster and i'd be curious to know who makes their diodes. You should ask.

    @ player - That's because I'm also a electric sign manufacturer like yourself so I have a little more to say about the product that I believe in and sell.

    I could market them how most distributors and suppliers do and just say the typical marketing statements and mislead customers "buy them, their the best...they last forever" and have no idea about that I'm selling. Instead I would like everyone to know that we've been testing their light output and light degradation over time and in comparison to the many others their top tier, and that's why their one of the few that I would ever use, and I don't even use LEDs a lot for channel letters and cabinets unless I have to.

    I suggest trying them out on a job, I think anyone who does would be really happy, and most of VERY happy clients who's signs will last over time.

Share This Page