Cement Truck Vinyl Type and Pricing

[ALgal]

We are just getting started with vehicle graphics and are looking for some guidance. We are quoting putting letters on the barrell of a cement truck.

Pricing: We are looking for a good pricing strategy for vehicle graphics. This is not a full vehicle wrap. I am not sure if quoting based on square foot of vinyl is the best way.

Vinyl: If there is a color the customer likes, I know a cut vinyl would be better than printing. OraCal 651 was mentioned as well as 3M IJ180cv3 with a laminate. The OraCal is a calendared vinyl and much cheaper. The OraCal is 2.5 mil vs 4 mil (IJ180cv3 + laminate). I am not sure which is a better option for this application. Will the OraCal work, but just have a shorter lifespan?

Thanks,

 

[unclebun]

Printing and cutting is a dumb way to put cut lettering on a truck, unless there is something absolutely necessary like gradient colors or photos in the logo.
There are two types of cut-vinyl that you can consider for lettering a job like this. The best is a cast vinyl, which will give a 7-9 year life, but of course costs a lot more. The other choice is a high quality intermediate (calendared) vinyl. For mostly flat or only slightly curved surfaces, like this job, this can work. However you have to make sure you are getting vinyl that will last 4-5 years, not the ones that will only last 1-2 years. Even then, you have to make a judgment as to which is the appropriate vinyl to use. We usually default to the cast vinyl, but we do have customers who turn their vehicles over fast enough (in 2-3 years) that they prefer to use the less expensive option.

Pricing-wise, I learned several decades ago to price it about the same as you would a sign of the same size and complexity. The reasoning was that it was a sign on a vehicle, and you spent just as long designing and preparing the vinyl for it as you would a sign, and even though you didn't have to buy the substrate, you had to have a bigger space to apply the vinyl or had to travel to apply it, and the application on a vehicle was more hassle than working on a table in the shop. This has worked out well over the years.

 

[Gino]

Lettering the barrel as you call it, the mixer is not fun to letter. Try not to print and apply..... it just won't last long. Use the best cast you can get. These trucks are literally abused and washed with high pressure constantly in all kinds of extreme conditions.

 

[Notarealsignguy]

All of the concrete trucks that we do have print/cut logos. I haven't seen any standard vinyl used. We use IJ40C with 8518 laminate, not a cast vinyl but works fine.
As gino said, they are a PITA, at least for me they are. Been doing them for about 10 years and everyone seems like the first.

 

[signheremd]

These trucks are washed frequently with a pressure washer in our area. We would use a 9yr cast vinyl. For printed logos, we would use a cast as well - either Arlon SLX Cast Wrap with Arlon 3270 laminate or Oracal 3951RA (rapid air) with Oraguard 290 gloss laminate (make sure your vinyl and laminate are good for your ink type - we use ecosilvent inks, Roland printer). The round shape makes them fun to letter - we charge a bit more than for a similar sized graphic on a box truck. You may also need to rotate mixer...

 

[Billct2]

We use the best cast vinyl for these jobs and print cut only if absolutely necessary. Sometimes we use the Gerber Edge for these with a liquid laminate and it holds up pretty well.
Like others have said, they are a PITA to work on, if you haven't done them before add 50% to the time you think it will take.

 

[Notarealsignguy]

It's more like a funnel than a tank

 

[Stacey K]

Get a subscription to Signcraft and they have a nice pricing book (and an online version). Of course you need to adjust things but it gives you a good idea of what things to consider when pricing. Adding a 3' logo on a trailer is less time than the logo and a 12' tag line. These things are broken down for you in the book and give you a starting point. Track your time for these types of jobs and make a note in the book. The next time you have a similar job, you have a solid idea of the price. There are 4 pricing groups according to shop rate and jobs are broken down by basic, intermediate, complex. It's a good model to start with. Also, if there's no obvious level line, it will take a little longer because you have to make your own. Lots of rivets or screws...much longer than smooth panels. A 12' trailer could be considered similar to a cement truck, plus extra time because of the shape - again, it's a starting point, add/subtract labor/materials per the job.

I ALWAYS use cut vinyl when possible.

 

[signage]

Signcraft is now only online subscription.

 

[mfatty500]

Don't forget the muriatic acid that these trucks get washed with occasionally..

 

[ALgal]

Thanks everyone for the responses. It looks like the 3M 7125 would be a good cast cut vinyl for this application. One person said they take the cost of the vinyl x2, then add labor cost. Another person charges $8-$10 per sq ft to cover cost and labor.

Thanks!

 

[unclebun]

You gotta charge way more than twice the vinyl cost. You have to include cutting, weeding, application tape, mistakes...

 

[Gino]

Hahahaaaa........ no, you don't gotta do anything of the sorts. The only thing you gotta do is pay taxes and die.

When lettering a truck, a sign or decorating a window treatment all ya need to consider are :

• Time spent with the customer.
• Design/creation time on computer.
• Time converting files into cut files.
• Materials and supplies needed to furnish said job.
• Fabrication/production time.
• Overhead and insurances.
• Your time invested from start to finish, including prep and removal.
• Waste factor.
• Profit

There are probably more that I might've missed, but it's gonna add up to a lot more than just doubling your material cost and going off half-cocked.

 

[wildside]

Thanks everyone for the responses. It looks like the 3M 7125 would be a good cast cut vinyl for this application. One person said they take the cost of the vinyl x2, then add labor cost. Another person charges $8-$10 per sq ft to cover cost and labor.

Thanks!

What someone else charges wil not pay your bills, only theirs.

What is your overhead?
What do you have to get at a minimum to turn a profit?
What are your material costs? Remember people get it for different rates.

We do a lot of mixers and like already said the acid they use will attack vinyl quick. Even high quality materials aren't going to last like they say, but still longer than the cheap stuff.

Since you sound new in the business, make sure you know what you are charging and why. Going for a cheaper material to save a buck will always cost more in the long run. Vehicles are always and only cast material.

 

[Stacey K]

Finally found this post! Just had a call for a quote for 8 concrete trucks. Like the OP I have not done these before but have plenty of experience to see the mixer will add plenty of time and I'll need a helper.

Will be solid cut vinyl on the mixer, blue and red. I want to make sure I'm using the right vinyl as they do clean these with acid. Is the general consensus here to use the 3m 7125? Is anyone adding a liquid protectant like Frog Juice? Thank you!

 

[Gino]

Honestly, I think using any vinyl will work, but just use it as a mask and use a good grade of paint and paint it on. Remove the template/mask and you got yourself a pretty reliable job. At least for 4 or 5 years. You can clear over top, but I wouldn't waste time. money or effort in that step. Just tell them it'll last 3 to 4 years under their conditions.

 

[Johnny Best]

That Frog Juice will start breaking down and look bad before the cast vinyl will.

 

[rjssigns]

My two cents. I make door graphics for a fleet of dump trucks, semis, mixers you name it. I print then cut. No laminate. Graphics get applied then buried in high solids clear specific to heavy equipment. Client says it's the only thing that tolerates the abuse and constant pressure washing. Looks like a million bucks with the clear coat too.

 

[Stacey K]

My two cents. I make door graphics for a fleet of dump trucks, semis, mixers you name it. I print then cut. No laminate. Graphics get applied then buried in high solids clear specific to heavy equipment. Client says it's the only thing that tolerates the abuse and constant pressure washing. Looks like a million bucks with the clear coat too.

It's interesting you say this. They called and he's about an hour away so I only saw a photo but when I googled online I found one photo that looked very, very glossy. I wonder if this is what they did. I plan to visit with them in-person Friday so I'll see it if they did. Thank you!

 

[rjssigns]

It's interesting you say this. They called and he's about an hour away so I only saw a photo but when I googled online I found one photo that looked very, very glossy. I wonder if this is what they did. I plan to visit with them in-person Friday so I'll see it if they did. Thank you!

Let me know what you find out and end up doing. I think this may be a go to for high abuse rigs. More money to be sure but you won't worry about a call back in two months.
BTW If you go with clear test some prints to make sure the materials are compatible.