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Competition for the Versacamm

Discussion in 'Mutoh' started by Fred Weiss, Apr 29, 2004.

  1. Fred Weiss

    Fred Weiss Merchant Member

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    Competition for the 30" Versacamm is beginning to emerge.

    Mutoh will begin shipping the Mutoh Jr. 30" system in June according to a sales rep I talked to today who represents a distributor, not Mutoh. The system uses Ecosolvent inks and will be paired with a matching 30" Mutoh plotter with optical alignment for contour cutting for a suggested list of $14,995 (including the plotter).

    At $1,000 higher than the Versacamm but featuring a faster, separate plotter it may be a very viable entry into this fast growing market.

    The system will also work if paired with any newer Graphtec plotters that feature optical alignment.

    I would expect that Mimaki won't be far behind as well.

    :signs101:
     
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  2. Dennis Raap

    Dennis Raap Active Member

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    Fred, thanks for the update I got a sample print from a VersaCamm tried the alcohol wipe in front of the dealer print wiped right off just like you said. The dealer was suprised he had no idea it would wipe off that easy.
     
  3. Fred Weiss

    Fred Weiss Merchant Member

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    Correction to Previous Information

    I've just reviewed and posted the press release regarding the Mutoh Junior print and cut system and wanted to point out some corrections to the information told to me previously by a distributor sales rep.

    1. The printer can accomodate a 36 inch print height, not the 30 inch height previously reported.

    2. The plotter can accomodate the same 36 inch height as well.

    3. The plotter has a cut speed in the mid 30 inch per second range. The Versacamm is only 25% to 30% as fast.

    3. The price for the package according to the press release is $13,995 which is $1,000 less than the sales rep quoted.

    So comparing the Junior to the Versacamm we have the same list price, an extra 6 inches of image height and a separate plotter that runs considerably faster.
     
  4. Greg

    Greg Member

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    Dang it all to heck!!! (Change words to suit your temperment). Just when I thought I had come to a decision..............

    Now what..... :help:

    Thanks for the info!
     
  5. Dale Horn

    Dale Horn Member

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    I'm right there with you Greg, same dilemma - If I have to -I'll sub out the work until I have contracts/customer demand #'s pinned down. Speculating on a machine and hoping to produce products (and make a profit) the customers want makes me think twice before jumping on the 'monthly payment' tread wheel again :cool: .
     
  6. Ladypainter

    Ladypainter Member

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    If anyone gets any more info on this equipment...please post it. My request for a VersaCamm is almost at the top of the ladder & I may get to order within the next couple of months...perhaps soon. When they say GO...I have to be able to move.

    So comparing the Junior to the Versacamm we have the same list price, an extra 6 inches of image height and a separate plotter that runs considerably faster.

    Fred...doesn't this mean you go back to printing...unloading...reloading...registering...cutting...??

    LP
     
  7. Greg

    Greg Member

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    I'm not Fred but the answer is yes.

    Since most if not all output will be laminated does it matter really? You'll have to remove the vinyl, laminate, then cut. Same process with the Versacamm. The bonus for the Versacamm would be if you don't plan to laminate. I wonder how often that will be the case?

    I'm sure Fred will set me straight if I misunderstood.
     
  8. Barry

    Barry Active Member

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    The big question is when will it be avalible? I have heard probably 6 months to a year. I would rather be making money right now with the versacamm then waiting for another printer.
     
  9. geb

    geb Very Active Member

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    I don't know to much about the printing part of this business, but I've heard people talk about about laminating digital prints. Can prints from the versacamm, edge, roland pnc be laminated with clear coat or frog juice, or are they not compatible with with these prints? Thanks.

    George
     
  10. Greg

    Greg Member

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    Yes they can be laminated with any of these. Your mileage may vary......(according to everything I have read).
     
  11. Fred Weiss

    Fred Weiss Merchant Member

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    What we're talking about here folks is a not so wide format ecosolvent printer. And the throughput isn't particularly fast ..... 30 to 50 square feet an hour.

    The ecosolvent is much more resistant to sunfade than pigment and dye inks which makes it suitable for a lot more things, but at 29" or 36" these aren't aimed at the printed banner applications or large backlit tradeshow stuff. We're talking vehicles, windows, general indoor and outdoor signage.

    What they don't tell you is that abrasion resistance is a concern and solvent resistance is virtually non-existent. The need for lamination is obvious, at least to me and also provides an opportunity to separate yourself from your competition who buys into the ad hype and doesn't invest in a laminator.

    Striking, eye catching work is what it does well and doing it right is what will get you the high return and referrals that make getting one of these babies all about. Working with sprays and liquids is cumbersome at best and fairly pricy as well. Laminating film, IMHO, is the way to go ..... and it would, in my business end up on probably 50% to 75% of what I would be outputting.
     
  12. Greg

    Greg Member

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    The Mutoh Junior's are apparently available now. Least that is what I was told by SSK.
     
  13. george3005

    george3005 New Member

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    I dont know much about the other machines but i did look at service and parts
    which here in montreal are not a problem we have 2 roland dealerships one beside each other LOL almost neighbours i found it important to have whoevers
    machine i bought to be close by
    My 2 cents :peace!:
     
  14. Greg

    Greg Member

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    Guess I've been remiss in posting lately.

    I took delivery of a Versacamm June 20th. Laminator (Daige) came but it was trashed in the box. I await the replacement. The dealer is about 10 miles away. They also carry media, inks, etc. Been spending the last few weeks trying to learn all about it.

    :)
     
  15. PureSportsDesigns

    PureSportsDesigns Member

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    Hey guys,

    I bought a VersaCamm about 3 months ago and have never looked back. I took out a small business loan and bought a laminator at the same time. Ink cost are only .22 sq/ft and last a long time. My justification was if I could not produce an extra $300 a month to cover the payment, it would only be because of not trying. Last week alone we printed 57 signs with our printer. Do you think I made an extra $300 to cover the payment?????? We live in a small town with only 3 stop lights. If we can do it, you can too. What are you waiting for??
     
  16. Mike Paul

    Mike Paul Major Contributor

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    GEB,
    Frog juice works great for me on thermal resin Edge prints, but I have read that some inkjet users are having problems with most brands of liquid clear pulling up with the transfer tape.
    Mike
     
  17. Baz

    Baz Very Active Member

    I own an SC-500, had it for over 2 and a half years now. I only used liquid laminates since i cant afford a proper sized laminator for it and my shop space is limited.

    I have had lifting problems with water based liquid laminates but they werent lifting the inks .. just the laminate would lift

    Never had a problem with One Shot UV clear, it works great ...

    Clear Jet works great to but appart from the spray cans, the liquid form (from a gallon) i find hard to apply over large surfaces ..

    I used Frog Juice once but eventually i got little spider weblike cracks over the finish.

    Krylon works good but is verry agressive on the inks ... so if you have to cut and weed your print .. do it after your clear is dry.

    Home brands of laquer based clears have worked also for me.

    The one i use most is water based Clear Shield. I love it .. just dont premask over it. 90% of my prints are for billboards. Family lifestyle photos, architectural renderings for new residential/commercial housing projects. They are large and dont require premasking.

    The smell is great compared to solvent based clearcoats. I'll only use those for vehicle graphics.

    Next week my SC-500 will get the conversion kit from Roland .. Turning it into a SC-500 EX, using eco sol inks. I hope i get the same results with the clearcoats since my media will also be changing to "non-coated" ... Woohoo!!! My media costs will be cut in half, or more on certain kinds!!

    If theres any difference i'll posts results.
     
  18. Steve C.

    Steve C. Very Active Member

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    We have been kicking around the idea of a small printer for our shop. The Versacamm or the Mutoh Jr. sounds like what we have been looking for. About how much can we expect to pay for a laminator? I already use a lot of the OneShot UV Clear for my airbrush work. I don't know about the printed vinyl, but if you get too heavy on painted vinyl it will lift with the ap. tape.

    Steve C.
     
  19. Greg

    Greg Member

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    $1000 and up, new.
     
  20. Steve C.

    Steve C. Very Active Member

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    What about design software? Will we need a special program for the machine? Can you print from Corel Draw?

    Steve C.
     
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