Copyright Quandary

[Gino]

If 2 parties enter into a waiver agreement, it is far different than a waiver that does not involve the third party......

A "hold harmless" agreement is a contractual obligation by 1 party to cover another parties costs if there is a problem....But there is nothing stopping the Third Party from going after anyone they can....Generally if they win, the damages will be "joint & several" meaning both 1st parties lose and the Third Party can recover from either 1st party.....If you pay out, then you can use the "hold harmless" to attempt to recover from the other Third Party.....However, if they do not have a "pot to **** in" you will be out of luck....

Understood, but by what the customer is saying, the designer no longer exists. Does this not then involve only rjs and his customer ?? How can a person who supposedly already gave the rights to this customer and doesn't exist anymore..... have the ability to come back and make a claim ?? With a signed & dated waiver, you are getting the cusomter to put in writing what he claims to be true and if something does go afoul, you have his signed statement in which he lied. You cannot be held liable if you were lied to about this.

Anyway, that would be my thoughts.

 

[WildWestDesigns]

Understood, but by what the customer is saying, the designer no longer exists. Does this not then involve only rjs and his customer ?? How can a person who supposedly already gave the rights to this customer and doesn't exist anymore..... have the ability to come back and make a claim ??

Those two are dangerous assumptions to be making. Especially the second one as there is no indication that the designer gave up rights based on anything that I've read in this thread so far.

The fact that the customer is on a "shoe string" budget (aren't they all), usually means that if they can't produce better then a proof quality low res file, they didn't buy the rights to that file. Not always the case, but I sure wouldn't take their word for it.

Ask for the designer's contact info and go straight to them and then see where that takes you.

 

[royster13]

Despite anything your client tells you or any agreement you have, if you violate the right of a Third Party, the Third Party can come after you.....As I have already said, the waiver is not worth the paper it is written on so long as the Third Party is not a party to it....Gino you need to sit down with your insurance broker and have them explain how "hold harmless agreements" work.....

 

[HulkSmash]

over thinking it, i believe.

this times 100.
do the job, get it over with.

 

[rjssigns]

Holy Cow! Look at all the responses. Methinks I have started a firestorm. Anywhooo....We sent an e-mail to the pub owner asking for the designers name. If she can't give us a simple name then I'll know something is rotten in Denmark.

 

[Billct2]

Yup.

 

[threeputt]

Ok RJS, now you're onto it! Do your own "due diligence".

It's a non-sequitor. ie: the simple fact that the designer may be "out of business" doesn't necessarily mean he waives all rights to ownership of stuff he's created).

I'm pretty sure something went down between the designer and his client that resulted in some sort of problem. Doubt that he/she will release the rights to the art or the art itself for that matter. (unless he or she gets payment from either you or the client) But you can try.

Just my kibbitzing two cents.