Deposit, deposit....

[Deaton Design]

Been working on a job with a "committee" for a few months now, and after a ton of revisions and changes they seem to be ready to go ahead with the job.
So I tell them I need a deposit of x amount to start the job. They have known this for awhile now. Today I get a call that they cant do a deposit, as the work is being paid for by the county. This
is a really nice sign, all carved and painted, and alot into it. Gonna take a good chunk for materials and router work, paint, etc. I told them I cant start the work
or get the materials unless I get a deposit. Tried to explain that if I get so many jobs like this, and no deposit, Im stuck with an empty bank account and waiting to get
paid, which will be 30 to 60 days. Im gonna hold fast on this one. If they cant come up with the deposit, they may have to go another route. I hate dealing with committees, especially
those that are mostly all women, no offense girls...

 

[OldPaint]

dont let em bullschit you..........they have MONEY to do this exact thing with!!!! think about when they buy other ESSENTIAL PRODUCTS, oil, fuel, big expenses on equipment.........THEY DONT GET EM.........unless paid for!!!

 

[TheSnowman]

I haven't ever understood this. Every single organization has access to a credit card these days, and/or they have access to the person writing the check, they just don't ask. There's no way that they go to buy office supplies and tell Walmart or Staples that they'll be 30-60 days before they see the money. In some extreme government cases I've told them to get on it, and I ride them until I have my money within a few days, but generally, they all have a credit card worst case scenario. You just gotta talk to the right person.

 

[neil_se]

Just let them know that if their purchasing system doesn't allow them to pay deposits that they're welcome to pay the full amount now. Alternatively for national clients with rigid systems I'll do 2 invoices - eg one for design and materials for 1/2 the total amount, another for manufacture and installation for 1/2 the total amount. That way the accounts department is just paying one full invoice each time.

I wouldn't have started anything without a deposit though...

 

[John Butto]

I will front you some money that you need for 20% interest due 30 days.

 

[Marlene]

if they can't come up with the deposit, how are they coming up with the money for the sign? if the county is paying for it, they should submit the deposit cost to the county or ask for the country to pay the entire amount if they don't do deposits. you are not a bank and you don't finance jobs for people.

 

[stickerman12]

We get that on a weekly basis from large manufacturing plants. We usually set them up on a net 30 account which is customary for doing that type of work. We also do work for utility companies, the city, the county (including the schools0 and the state and do the same for them. It is necessary for doing that type work here. Go for it. You will get your money

 

[fresh]

I hate it too...
The entire reason for NET terms is for manufacturing/resale. I need your widget to make my gadget, so you give me 30 days to produce and sell my gadget before you collect from me.

The majority of our clients are the end users. There is no reason for them to be on any more then Net 5 terms. And I'll be generous in giving Net 5... Someone is always around to write a check.

 

[Rick]

If it's a county government, and it's over a certain amount,
is usually has to go out to competitive bid.

Usually a county government is good for it, but I bet you're
thinking it would have been nice to have known that before
going into all that design work.

I hope you got paid for all the design legwork.

 

[OADesign]

Here we are again.

No deposit, no work. We have to stop letting "them" tell us how we are going to get paid. I hope this works out for you.

I have been using the word "retainer" in place of deposit for the design and research part of jobs and seems to loosen up the wallets a bit.

 

[Signsforwhile]

I used to, ages ago, let this go and let them dictate how it went. Then the doomsday, empty bank account, tons of work scenario struck. Since then I've called the shots and have NEVER lost a job because of this policy. Stick to it. And if for some reason they pass on you because of this policy, chances are you would be waiting far longer than 30-60 for your payment, considering they can't fork over half up front!

 

[Jillbeans]

I feel your pain.
Lately I have been having great luck with deposits via PayPal.
Usually they just pay in advance!
It works well for me, without the bother of dealing with a credit card machine..
Love....Jill

 

[Billct2]

I guess I'm the odd one out. I do lots of government jobs with no deposit, but do get a PO.

 

[Vital Designs]

I used to do proofs, work etc. without a deposit and it doesn't work, especially to scale. I do nothing without a deposit and have our gatekeeper (admin) enforce it. It has not lost me any business and has actually enhanced it. The good customers understand it and have no problem. I get 50% down payment on all jobs. As mentioned most departments have a CC.

One exception is schools which we do nothing for without a PO. We do a lot of work for schools and it is just how they operate. We have had good luck for the most part occasionally having to followup.

We even get payed a deposit for city work.

Each member of a committee has to justify their position at the expense of your time. They need to come to a consensus prior to you being engaged. This is something you have to position up front.

 

[Jackpine]

50% down or I don't start "Ifeel your pain."

I do work for a city with City Management form of government. City manager is hired by the council. They are so slow in paying since the city council has to approve the final payment. I won't do work for them without 50% down. The last sign was a $750.00 2 side one color on Dibond 3'w x 8'h. It took 4 months to get $375.00. This was just gave gave a quote. A committee of librarians with the children's librarian the boss. The final layout was
Arial Bold, their choice, navy cast vinyl on white panel. Five layouts with color and wording changes. I just take it in stride.

 

[Marlene]

I guess I'm the odd one out. I do lots of government jobs with no deposit, but do get a PO.​

a PO is as good as a deposit as it will get paid. it is when there's nothing that it gets hairy

 

[weaselboogie]

$1000 with 50% deposit or $2000 with no deposit.

 

[Gino]

As mentioned, the wait is usually brutal, but it will eventually get there.

We just did a job for "Homeland Security' in our area. Actually finished it yesterday afternoon. Nothing big, but in the beginning I told them...... if I can't get a deposit, then I will give you an invoice for the whole amount and when it goes through, let me know and I'll be over to do the job.

It took less than two weeks for them to call me telling me they had my check in hand.

Over certain amounts it does have to go out for three to five bids. I'm surprised they didn't tell you that upfront. Sounds like they just got some free consultation from you in addition.

Stand your ground or tell them if they want you to finance their job, you'll have to add in the finance costs in addition.

Then, ask them if tax payers money is well spent by holding onto it thus making a job cost more by doing business the abnormal route ??
​

 

[Colin]

How timely. I recently nearly got burned by not demanding a deposit.

I do lots of boat lettering, and the process is wrought with potentially uncompensated time. So I’ve devised a system where if the customer wants me to come and do a site visit to the marina to measure, color match and assess the whole scope of the job, I charge $40.00 to do so. That way, if they don’t proceed with the job, at least my time is covered (albeit at a reduced rate).

If any customer (boat lettering or otherwise) wants me to proceed with design and emailing proofs, I require a deposit with C/C. As the old adage goes: “Design time ain’t free”.

So last week some woman calls me for some boat lettering. I explain my $40.00 fee for the site visit, and she says: “Does that include the name & installation & everything?” I should have known right there who I was dealing with. I explained that no, it just covers the site visit. She agreed and I went to the marina. She paid me the $40.00, and in my mind, I figure that if someone pays the $40.00, they’re going to proceed with going through with the job, so I didn’t bother with insisting on getting a C/C number. After all, it can appear a little overly officious on these relatively small jobs. She asked roughly how much it would cost, and I suggested about $200.00

So I proceeded (Thurs.) to draw up the transom and all details in my computer, and chose a nice font for the boat name and port name. Over the course of Friday, Saturday, Sunday and Monday, I went back & forth with her via email with multiple changes. In terms of making changes and “trying things”, she turned out to be the nightmare psycho woman customer we all dread, but I continued, ignoring the alarm bells that were ringing in the back of my mind. So on Tuesday, she finally called and said that she was happy with that, and how much would it be. I said that I had spent a lot more time on the design than anticipated, but said that $225.00 would be fine.

She replied with: “Hmmm, that’s more than I wanted to spend; I’ll think about it and let you know.” I just about spat my coffee. I said that I had spent a lot of time on this and that this is an inherent part of doing the job. Her reply was: “Ya, but it’s just computer graphics right? It’s not like you’re laying it all out by hand.” My mind was reeling on just how to reply to such a stupid statement. But what could I do? I didn’t have a deposit. She had me.

After the call ended, my level of anger reached an unhealthy level; mainly at her narcissistic level of disrespect for other people’s time, but also at myself for not getting a deposit.

Fortunately she has elected to go ahead with the lettering, but I sure learned a lesson.




BTW: Demand not only the deposit on your larger job, but also the "balance due upon completion".

 

[Deaton Design]

I talked to one of them this morning again. This money is coming from a grant that they applied for. I know I will be paid, and I know how the county works. Right now though, our county
is having money problems, and even with a grant coming, you never know what will go on. Getting the deposit is the only way I will do this job, which I explained to the woman this
morning. It was hard to make her understand , but I think she finally got it. My business here has been very, very slow, and if I dont get deposits, then my bank account is empty and Im waiting
on payments. If I lose the job over it, then that will be their choice, but the design is mine. They would have to start over with another designer or signmaker to get it done, as I would stress that
it would look nothing like what I designed. Ive always got deposits, and I see no reason to change this now.I appreciate the feedback from everyone.