DTF PNG vs Vector?

[JerryLZ]

Hi, I've been making T shirts on a Roland VG-540 for 5 years now as it was the most sensible option at the time. I am about to buy a XPD-724 to handle the T shirts from now on.

I've only been hands on with a VJ628D once and wasn't fully prepared to try everything I would have liked to. My main question is, since most of MY artwork and logos are vectors, is it really necessary to export to a PNG first before it goes to the DTF? Its not a deal breaker but I'd much rather work from one .EPS per job with color variations vs doubling my files up if I don't have to. I'm just curious if it matters.

Can you print from eps/pdf etc. is there a difference? I know the draw to png is no background but vectors don't have a background either obviously.

On the customer side I can understand the PNG since nobody ever has a vector, let alone knows what a vector file is.

 

[Fred Weiss]

The main difference is that a vector can be enlarged with no loss of quality.

 

[JerryLZ]

The main difference is that a vector can be enlarged with no loss of quality.

Correct, the vector is superior but all of the advertisements for DTF are pushing for PNG. I'm saying, there shouldn't be a issue just printing with the vectors right? exporting a separate png file seems tedious if you don't have to.

 

[Fred Weiss]

An educated guess is that if they're pushing for PNG they are having issues with reading EPS files. A PNG is dedicated pixels and will probably provide the most reliable results as compared to the original while the EPS may not.

 

[IvanVasquez]

coming from a sign printing and processing environment I understand your point but DTF is a very specialized branch, you'll have to create your own files to the desired size at 300dpi (TIFF or PNG) and to have transparency and to have the W1 Channel (photoshop), which is White under base so the powder can melt and adhere to the garment.

 

[electricfly]

I’d look at what file formats the rip can handle and do comparison tests

 

[somcalmetim]

We have a Texjet Echo 2 DTG with Digital Factory Apparel Version RIP/Print software...
It takes eps, pdf, tiff, png, bmp, svg, jpg and a few others...
I send pdf files to my Roland but still flatten most of my complicated artwork for more reliable/faithful reproduction of transparencies...some layered transparency and lens components in eps and pdf can be interpreted differently by some rips and print weird.
Vector artwork allows scaling artwork without loss of detail but once sent to RIP its all converted to a large full size tiff file at res for printing anyway...if converted to the correct resolution, rasterized artwork will output indistinguishable from vector.

 

[hybriddesign]

my understanding is that most of the native dtf rips work best with png files. It’s same thing is you run any dtg system, nearly everything is png which weird coming from sign background. We convert everything from vector to png for our dtf orders.

How are the reviews on the 724? We were looking at a 628 but it didn’t seem that well planned out

 

[hybriddesign]

Btw dtf is awesome but make sure you order and sample a lot of transfers first. It’s hand feel isn’t much better than a solvent transfer in a lot of cases so it’s mainly the elimination of weeding that you save on. And a big design on a shirt with dtf isn’t nearly as soft as most people want it. When dtf came out we thought that our brand new $300k kornit might become a doorstop but in reality sometimes dtf is just way too plastic feeling. Love it for left chests and small logos though. We do a ton of dtf nowadays

 

[JerryLZ]

my understanding is that most of the native dtf rips work best with png files. It’s same thing is you run any dtg system, nearly everything is png which weird coming from sign background. We convert everything from vector to png for our dtf orders.

How are the reviews on the 724? We were looking at a 628 but it didn’t seem that well planned out

My brother has the 628 so I got to play with that for a bit when I visited and I've been grabbing transfers from him here and there for jobs where weeding isn't a reasonable option, Which now feels like everything. The 724 essentially has the upgrades that people were buying extra built in, like ink circulation for example.

 

[unclebun]

They use png because then you don't have to tell people how to define the white areas in the print. Besides, file size isn't an issue because the final printed size is never bigger than the size of a heat press.

 

[JerryLZ]

They use png because then you don't have to tell people how to define the white areas in the print. Besides, file size isn't an issue because the final printed size is never bigger than the size of a heat press.

Do you do DTF? Because I have been just printing from my vectors but I can't get white to print. Real life example, I have a photo of a man wearing white pants and the printer does not want to lay down the white for his pants. Or if I were to just go and pull the pepsi logo, the red and blue will print fine but not the white. The work around I have been using is to set the white from C0 M0 Y0 K0 to C0 M0 Y1 K0. I cant do that with pngs or bitmaps though. I am using FlexiDTF for the rip software.
So " you don't have to tell people how to define the white areas in the print" is troubling to me because theres been several times already where the white in a logo has caused me issues and I can't figure out why.

 

[netsol]

Do you do DTF? Because I have been just printing from my vectors but I can't get white to print. Real life example, I have a photo of a man wearing white pants and the printer does not want to lay down the white for his pants. Or if I were to just go and pull the pepsi logo, the red and blue will print fine but not the white. The work around I have been using is to set the white from C0 M0 Y0 K0 to C0 M0 Y1 K0. I cant do that with pngs or bitmaps though. I am using FlexiDTF for the rip software.
So " you don't have to tell people how to define the white areas in the print" is troubling to me because theres been several times already where the white in a logo has caused me issues and I can't figure out why.

I SUPPOSE you have to define that your background is clear, not white
or, as you say create a white layer (even if it is just the internals of your logo (the part you would "throw away" if you were cutting and weeding

 

[somcalmetim]

Do you do DTF? Because I have been just printing from my vectors but I can't get white to print. Real life example, I have a photo of a man wearing white pants and the printer does not want to lay down the white for his pants. Or if I were to just go and pull the pepsi logo, the red and blue will print fine but not the white. The work around I have been using is to set the white from C0 M0 Y0 K0 to C0 M0 Y1 K0. I cant do that with pngs or bitmaps though. I am using FlexiDTF for the rip software.
So " you don't have to tell people how to define the white areas in the print" is troubling to me because theres been several times already where the white in a logo has caused me issues and I can't figure out why.

Working in vector is fine to a point but by the time you get a few transparent layers or shadows in there I generally convert everything to a bitmap for printing anyway...that way it comes out like I want without letting the DTG RIP interpret a complicated vector file with transparency...you can work in vector but the RIP is converting the whole thing into some sort of bitmap for printing anyway, if you rasterize the artwork yourself you can see what it will look like without depending on low res rip preview...our DTG software looks like it rasterizes any type of file you give it first thing and then just works with the pixel color data rasterized at size to work its magic.

 

[JerryLZ]

After much playing around, the fix ended up being that I figured out I could set a custom color in the flexi rip software. So I just told it that when it sees a pure white, to think of it as C0 M0 Y1 K0 and it now recognizes the white in designs instead of ignoring it. Don't know if its a Band-Aid or the real fix but its working as expected now.

 

[unclebun]

I don't print DTF myself, but I order it and apply it to garments. So my statement about using transparent png files for printing has to do with print providers who are taking automatic orders on the internet, mostly from screenprint t-shirt shops or others who are usually somewhat computer and service bureau illiterate.

That said, when I look at the transfers I received as samples from the provider and also at the ones I have purchased, they are printing the white as a flood layer on top of all the colors. This, of course, makes the transfers useful on colored and dark garments. They may or may not be also printing white as a spot color, but I doubt that, knowing how RIPs work.

 

[JerryLZ]

I don't print DTF myself, but I order it and apply it to garments. So my statement about using transparent png files for printing has to do with print providers who are taking automatic orders on the internet, mostly from screenprint t-shirt shops or others who are usually somewhat computer and service bureau illiterate.

That said, when I look at the transfers I received as samples from the provider and also at the ones I have purchased, they are printing the white as a flood layer on top of all the colors. This, of course, makes the transfers useful on colored and dark garments. They may or may not be also printing white as a spot color, but I doubt that, knowing how RIPs work.

That was the part I found weird about my issue, is that I was printing the white overlay onto my colors but then it would skip any actual white in the design and skip both the design itself and no overlay so I was left with a transparent area that should have been white. In the rip software there's a tab that will show me where each color is going to be firing so I could see which part was going to be skipped without wasting a ton of material.

Everything works now though. Learning curve error I guess

 

[bb3559a]

That was the part I found weird about my issue, is that I was printing the white overlay onto my colors but then it would skip any actual white in the design and skip both the design itself and no overlay so I was left with a transparent area that should have been white. In the rip software there's a tab that will show me where each color is going to be firing so I could see which part was going to be skipped without wasting a ton of material.

Everything works now though. Learning curve error I guess

I have been having this issue and I also use FlexiSign for ripping. Is there any way you can explain how to adjust the settings to achieve White Ink using vector?

 

[JerryLZ]

I have been having this issue and I also use FlexiSign for ripping. Is there any way you can explain how to adjust the settings to achieve White Ink using vector?

I've just gotten into the habit of changing the whites in my artwork to c0 m0 y1 k0 and you wont run into issues. I still prefer vectors over using png's but if you have to use a png then you also need to go into the last tab in flexi and change your white option from 'solid under' for vectors to 'use transparency mask'