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Emergency Vehicle High Vis Reflective???

Discussion in 'Vehicle Graphics' started by Gforce1, Nov 19, 2009.

  1. Gforce1

    Gforce1 Member

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    All the firetrucks and emergency vehicles we have done in the past have been done with Avery A3 911 reflective. We have a couple new units to do and now the red A3 is discontinued. Can anyone recommend another product similar to that? I was looking at the 3M 4000 DG3 series but the local supplier has no stock and will only sell it in full rolls anyways. What is everyone else using for high vis reflective??:thankyou:
     
    Tags:
  2. SignTech

    SignTech Guest

    3M
     
  3. Kottwitz-Graphics

    Kottwitz-Graphics Very Active Member

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    Avery...

    With only 22 posts under your belt, I am going to assume that you haven't heard the horror stories of avery reflective.

    Lots of people here have been kicked in the south side by that crappy vinyl, so expect to hear it.

    Personally, I use 3M reflective for all my applications.

    :popcorn:
     
  4. Steve Werner

    Steve Werner Member

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    Aug 31, 2009
    Try Nippon Carbide Crystal Grade reflective, 800 821 4264 and ask for George Tamyori he's very knowledgable. Nippon Carbide offers great products. You can use my name if you'd like.
     
  5. SqueeGee

    SqueeGee Active Member

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    3M 680 series.
     
  6. Mosh

    Mosh Major Contributor

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    3M 680 as well
     
  7. Steve Werner

    Steve Werner Member

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    3M 4000 DG and 3M 680 are two completely different things in terms of reflectivity. You may need to qualify this better. 3M 680 is much closer to Avery A3 than 3M 4000 DG. Avery A3 is also very close to Nippon Carbide Flexible Engineering grade film. Good Luck !
     
  8. Mustang Guy

    Mustang Guy Member

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    Decent luck with Enduralite reflective.
     
  9. SignosaurusRex

    SignosaurusRex Major Contributor

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    3M is, and always has been the industry standard! 680 series is what you want. Stick with that and you as well as your customers will be very satisfied.
     
  10. Gforce1

    Gforce1 Member

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    Alberta, Canada

    22 Posts yes but 9 years in business and I'm well aware of the Avery situation. I absolutely refuse to use it for anything.......except that A3 911.......never had a single problem with it. I wouldn't be surprised to hear it's made by someone else actually. I use Oracal products almost exclusively for cut vinyl and digital material.


    The 3M 680 looks to be a solid color reflective, is that true? Is there something else similar to the A3 in terms of the pattern of the vinyl as well as reflectivity? It is the customers request not mine. If not I will try and convince him to use a solid color product but I would like to keep everything as similar as possible. Thanks everyone!!
     
  11. Gforce1

    Gforce1 Member

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    Alberta, Canada

    Ok, I have been doing some further research and the 3M 680 definitely will not work. It has a Retroreflection rating of 20 for the red compared to 115 for the Avery A3 so the reflectivity is nowhere close. The 3M 4000 DG3 series is almost identical to the A3 but everything I have read states it's for use on aluminum signs and such. Has anyone used this material on vehicles? I am going to keep digging but any other help or input is greatly appreciated.:thankyou:
     
  12. jay*doc

    jay*doc Member

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    I understand the situation that you are in. You use the 911 that has a specific pattern and now the color you need is gone, and you have to match other existing vehicles.

    I would say the only viable option would be to get the 911 in white and overlam with red 8300 from Oracal (Transparent Films).

    Thats what I'd do.
     
  13. Gforce1

    Gforce1 Member

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    Alberta, Canada

    That normally would be a solution but the customer actually made someone else peel an entire truck because they did just that but at night when the light hits it the vinyl was still reflecting white and not red. That should tell you the pickiness I'm dealing with.
     
  14. omgsideburns

    omgsideburns Very Active Member

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    start calling around looking for a roll.. someone has it sitting on a shelf.
     
  15. jay*doc

    jay*doc Member

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    That is great to know! I guess the reflectivity of the film over powers the transparancy..
     
  16. Gforce1

    Gforce1 Member

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    Alberta, Canada
    Oh I have no doubt about that, my thought though is this is a long standing customer that we will be doing more work for so if I can find something else that will work and will be available down the road that would be better than scrounging up old stock.
     
  17. Steve G.

    Steve G. Member

    "... so if I can find something else that will work and will be available down the road..."

    How about 3M 3990 or series 983 ??? Slightly different in appearance, but very similar.

    983 Is for vehicles, but only available in up to 6" rolls. I use this, and it has very strong adhesive. (like vhb)
    I believe 3990 would work on vehicles too, but would need to be confirmed.
     
    Last edited: Nov 20, 2009
  18. Gforce1

    Gforce1 Member

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    Alberta, Canada

    Awesome, thanks Steve, I will look into those!!:thankyou:
     
  19. ABCDecals

    ABCDecals Member

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    speaking of reflective on firetrucks..how to i fix the reflective peeling where it is overlapping?
     
  20. ShawnLVESP

    ShawnLVESP Member

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    Not sure if you have this or not but here is the striping standard for fire trucks.
    Something i am seeing is Reflexite vinyl being used. They will use the yellow reflective and then use red translucent over the yellow for the chevrons.

    go ahead and copy/paste the info below for your use. Any questions i'll help the best i can.

    Here is the NFPA 1901 Vehicle Standard. This is a partial list. The information provided below is for vehicle striping. As of now this is only for vehicles that are made after January 1st 2009.

    14.1.6 Any door of the apparatus designed to allow persons
    to enter or exit the apparatus shall have at least 96 in.2
    (62,000 mm2) of retroreflective material affixed to the inside
    of the door.

    15.9.3.1* A retroreflective stripe(s) shall be affixed to at least
    50 percent of the cab and body length on each side, excluding
    the pump panel areas, and at least 25 percent of the width of
    the front of the apparatus.

    15.9.3.1.1 The stripe or combination of stripes shall be a
    minimum of 4 in. (100 mm) in total width.

    15.9.3.1.2 The 4 in. (100 mm) wide stripe or combination of
    stripes shall be permitted to be interrupted by objects (i.e.,
    receptacles, cracks between slats in roll up doors) provided
    the full stripe is seen as conspicuous when approaching the
    apparatus.

    15.9.3.1.3 A graphic design shall be permitted to replace all
    or part of the required striping material if the design or combination
    thereof covers at least the same perimeter length(s)
    required by 15.9.3.1.

    15.9.3.2 At least 50 percent of the rear-facing vertical surfaces,
    visible from the rear of the apparatus, excluding any
    pump panel areas not covered by a door, shall be equipped
    with retroreflective striping in a chevron pattern sloping
    downward and away from the centerline of the vehicle at an
    angle of 45 degrees.

    15.9.3.2.1 Each stripe in the chevron shall be a single color
    alternating between red and either yellow, fluorescent yellow,
    or fluorescent yellow-green.

    15.9.3.2.2 Each stripe shall be 6 in. (150 mm) in width.

    15.9.3.3 All retroreflective materials required by 15.9.3.1 and
    15.9.3.2 shall conform to the requirements of ASTM D 4956,
    Standard Specification for Retroreflective Sheeting for Traffic Control,
    Section 6.1.1 for Type I Sheeting.

    15.9.3.3.1 All retroreflective materials used to satisfy the requirements
    of 15.9.3.1 that are colors not listed inASTM D 4956,
    Section 6.1.1, shall have a minimum coefficient of retroreflection
    of 10 with observation angle of 0.2 degrees and entrance angle of
    −4 degrees.

    15.9.3.3.2 Fluorescent yellow and fluorescent yellow-green
    retroreflective materials used to meet the requirements of
    15.9.3.2 shall conform to the minimum requirements specified
    for yellow Type I Sheeting in ASTM D 4956, Section 6.1.1.

    15.9.3.3.3 Any printed or processed retroreflective film construction
    used to meet the requirements of 15.9.3.1 and
    15.9.3.2 shall conform to the standards required of an integral
    colored film as specified in ASTM D 4956, Section 6.1.1.


    19.18.11 Where the design of the aerial device incorporates a
    knuckle, the knuckle shall be as follows:
    (1) Equipped with position lights or continuously illuminated
    by boom lights
    (2) Painted with reflective paint or provided with retroreflective
    Striping


    19.21.4.3 All stabilizers that protrude beyond the body of the
    apparatus shall be striped or painted with retroreflective material
    so as to indicate a hazard or obstruction.

    --end--
     
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