Flatbed Printers- Entry Level Questions

[lkt1954]

I have been researching flatbed printers trying to find a good entry level one. Currently we do 10-15 4' x 8' acm (polymetal) signs per month as our main signs and various size coroplast signs (20 a month) using our roland 540 to print the vinyl, then laminate if needed, cut, weed and mount to the substrate. Recently we have went to mounting full prints to elimate the extra loading and unloading, cutting and weeding the media. This has reduced the time and labor involved, but to mount a 4' wide print with our rs laminator it takes two people to do it and since I have a full time job and my wife runs the shop during the day most if this is done of an evening or weekends. So I have been looking to purchase an entry level flatbed printer to make this a one man job. So here goes my questions:

1) Is white ink necessary on a flatbed? Most of what we do is on white substrate and I am thinking if a client wants a black sign with white lettering we print the black with the white letters being knockouts. While white would be nice I know first hand from our dtg machine the extra work and issues associated with white ink. Whay are the thoughts here?

2) Not being a high volumn sign shop is a flatbed printer a good choice? It may run daily or sit several days before there are any jobs. I realize the doors it could open to expand business. But at what point is it justified?

3) New or Used??? On any piece of equipment this is always a pressing question. I would like to stay under $ 30K for an entry level printer. Am I dreaming or is that possible- if one finds a good used printer. I do not care if it is an older printer just one that works and fairly easy to maintain and I can go up to 5' x 10' on print size.

4) I have seen several Gerber flatbeds for sale and have read they are no longer making them and soon to stop their support of them. So does that take Gerber out of the mix when looking for a printer?

5) What else do I need to consider in looking at flatbed printers?

Sorry for the long post, but I have lots of questions I am working on in making this decision.

Thanks
Larry

 

[Stevenelm]

Off topic

This is a little off topic, but check out a RollsRoller. You could stay with your current printer and mounting is a piece of cake for one person.

Steve

 

[HulkSmash]

dreaming.

entry level flatbeds. 80k-130k.

 

[particleman]

1. No

2. Based on that volume No, you'd never make your money back. If you intended on expanding your business by the purchase, then maybe.

3. New or Gently used, but yes I don't think you'll find anything in that budget other than old colorspans and gerber ions. Neither of which is a good idea to purchase. You might find an Agfa or Dilli near that range, which isn't a bad machine, but Agfa parts and service are insane. Oce/fuji flat beds have been out awhile now and they could be sub 50k possibly for an older one.

4. Exactly, not a good idea to buy one of those.


Overall we're talking generally about machines that are made in the hundreds not thousands, you'll be at the mercy of these companies in most cases for parts and service which is often very expensive. Older machines might not have parts at all. You'll just have to weigh the options. Even a used machine requires considerations such as possibly 3 phase electric (for the vacuum bed), compressed air (many machines need high volume clean compressed air), massive space requirements for true flatbeds, considerable moving costs. You also have consumables such as lamps to consider which may or may not be expensive depending on the printer. UV is also an entirely new class of headaches to deal with such as adhesion, static, material cleanliness, outdoor life, and curing on various substrates.

 

[Letterbox Mike]

From a strictly ROI standpoint, your current volume doesn't come close to justifying the purchase of a flatbed printer. You should be doing in a day what you are currently doing in a month to consider this, or close to it. Even if you are looking at this as an opportunity to expand your business you have a long way to go before you're making a profit.

On top of that, a $30k budget is going to get you a well used machine at best, which means significant maintenance and operating expenses, and a lot of costly down time.

The cheapest you will find a new machine is going to be in the $60k range with the Roland, but don't expect to increase business too much, it's going to severely limit your throughput.

Colorado Signs is right, a flatbed worth buying (new anyway) is going to be close to $100k when all is said and done.

That said, I would try to figure out why your current setup isn't working. Prior to purchasing our flatbed, we printed and mounted through a Royal Sovereign laminator just like you, and a single person could mount 50-75 full 4x8' sheets by themselves in a shift easily. For your volume, you should have no problem making money with hut current setup. Tell us what is causing you trouble, maybe there's an easier way to improve your business here.

 

[Gino]

I have to agree 100% with all the posts so far.

You're reaching for something which isn't there..... business-wise or money-wise.
​

 

[lkt1954]

Thanks for the information and replys. I know flatbed printers are expensive, but I thought maybe I could get like a mutoh 1608 for $ 30K or less. What triggered me thinking flatbed was time- I do all the sign work after I get off my day job and the weekends and thought a flatbed might help me save time and be more productive. I know that at the level we are currently running it does not justify the cost of a flatbed. Yet I keep thinking 3 years ago we bought a roland vp300i and less than 2 years after that a vs540 and there are days both run all day long. I think the next trade show I will check out some flatbeds and kick the tires, till we get more business I will keep doing what I have been doing to make signs. The advise has been a big help and gave me some good insight.

Thanks again
Larry