How many of you could leave your shop behind for at least a month and not have any issues?

[Texas_Signmaker]

How do you reach your goals if you're not planning for them well in advance? Leave it up to luck?

I make big plans and then I put in the work to reach them...but I've got to know what I'm working toward if I'm ever going to get there.

You guys are fun and I appreciate the challenge. It motivates me to show people these things can be done (even if people say they can't).

It can... it's just that it would be tough in the sign business.

If you really want to make "mailbox money" there are ways to do it... real-estate is one of them (which I have rental property and a management company oversees it so it so it truly is mailbox money...) The stock market is the true way for you to be a true absentee owner... Those are passive income streams that you don't need to be involved in...

Even things like franchise restaurants make about double what you can earn in the market, but still require time and effort.


When you unlock the secrete to own a business and it just runs itself... be sure to write a book and make ads on radio that tell people to show up to a hotel ball room for $200 a pop... because those are the only people apparently that know how to do it..... maybe I should take them up on that offer????

 

[WhatsYourSign?]

I would think in terms of niche equipment (either hardware and/or software) more then just out purchasing with what's out in the wild.

Fair enough - that's helpful and something to consider.

Niche processes (even tools that are developed in house) can be a huge boon.

I personally would be hesitant to solely think about competing on price personally. I'm not much older then you are, but have been doing what I do for a very long time starting out working for family. Competing on price wasn't the thing. We had found that when you compete on price, the customers don't tend to be quite as loyal. That's just our experience.

Now, this could be small shop thinking versus big business thinking.

I agree with you. My goal isn't to be a Signs365, I just want the freedom that comes with a business that runs itself...I don't need a million dollars/year to be happy (or even close to it).

I was able to get to this point with my marketing agency within around 3 years but it seems as though it's going to take longer in the sign business. I'm okay with that.

There is always something to be gleaned, even from the naysayers (your probably thinking I'm one of them as well, I wasn't totally a naysayer, just make sure your house is in order and still not learning the ropes with what you have before adding more to it), the trick is gleaning what you can use and leave the rest.

Always something to be learned.

No doubt!

I was hoping somebody would step up and say, "I've done this and here's the lessons I learned along the way."

That hasn't been the case, but I've still learned plenty from this thread.

 

[Texas_Signmaker]

I just want the freedom that comes with a business that runs itself...I don't need a million dollars/year to be happy (or even close to it).
.

Your just in the wrong business for that to happen. Sign business requires skilled labor, is kind of complicated with computer knowledge, installation knowledge, fabrication, permit pulling, electrical...

Now.. maybe you could buy a storage facility and it run itself. All you need is a slightly above minimum wage worker to man the desk and he/she can run the whole show.

 

[Christian @ 2CT Media]

I'm a bit green in this industry, but I don't see an issue with what you are asking.

I have learned over the last few years that people make the biggest difference. Last March, I stepped away from my business for 3 months and worked 3000 miles away while supporting my wife's goals... Even with my Brother and Business partner present the company nearly burned to the ground due to the actions of an employee trying to launch their own company.

This was due to a string of bad hires, this year after another bad hire we finally made a great hire. Jake not only brings 14+ years of knowledge but he also brings an attitude of let my hard work reward me for the good of the company. 100% due to his actions and efforts we finally converted a large client that was a small part of our business into our number 1 client in gross sales and we were just informed that they may have over a million dollars worth of work for us through the end of year. He has not once asked for anything, and sales isn't even his position.

So to circle back, I do feel that you can build a self running business with the right people at the right time, but you will have a grueling battle to get there. We turned 10 in June and we still aren't there, but we are on track to be with all the changes that Jake has brought about. He even has helped turn around another employee of ours and helped bring on a new promising go getter.

Good luck in your venture, if I can give insight let me know.

 

[equippaint]

How do you reach your goals if you're not planning for them well in advance? Leave it up to luck?

I make big plans and then I put in the work to reach them...but I've got to know what I'm working toward if I'm ever going to get there.

You guys are fun and I appreciate the challenge. It motivates me to show people these things can be done (even if people say they can't).

You need to know what youre doing today before you know what youre doing tomorrow. The annoying thing is you come off as a know it all and we are all dumb and doing it wrong cuz we have no goals, plans etc. ill clue you in here, Many of the “naysayers” have real thought out actual plans, experience and capital to back it. These real specific plans are grounded in reality and experience which has be gained by doing this dreaming, like youre doing, and making tons of mistakes just to wind up learning that its not that simple. You can poo poo advice all that you want but it doesnt do you any justice. Keep on being the smartest guy in the room, that always ends well.
Not 1 person said you wont succeed or cant grow either.

 

[WhatsYourSign?]

I'm a bit green in this industry, but I don't see an issue with what you are asking.

I have learned over the last few years that people make the biggest difference. Last March, I stepped away from my business and worked 3000 miles away while supporting my wife's goals... Even with my Brother and Business partner present the company nearly burned to the ground due to the actions of an employee trying to launch their own company.

This was due to a string of bad hires, this year after another bad hire we finally made a great hire. Jake not only brings 14+ years of knowledge but he also brings an attitude of let my hard work reward me for the good of the company. 100% due to his actions and efforts we finally converted a large client that was a small part of our business into our number 1 client in gross sales and we were just informed that they may have over a million dollars worth of work for us through the end of year. He has not once asked for anything, and sales isn't even his position.

So to circle back, I do feel that you can build a self running business with the right people at the right time, but you will have a grueling battle to get there. We turned 10 in June and we still aren't there, but we are on track to be with all the changes that Jake has brought about. He even has helped turn around another employee of ours and helped bring on a new promising go getter.

Good luck in your venture, if I can give insight let me know.

Thank you for offering a glimmer of hope in the face of so much doubt.


I completely agree that people are everything.

In the 16 months I've owned the sign company, I've made my fair share of bad hires but I've weeded them out quickly and the team we have in place now are rockstars. They show up on time, treat our customers extremely well, work hard, and when we make mistakes, we all learn from them.

I pay them well and although we have bad days, we have fun and it's created a lot of loyalty both internally and with our clients.


It sounds like you have a great thing going for yourself...I hope to be where you are someday. Goals!

 

[WhatsYourSign?]

You need to know what youre doing today before you know what youre doing tomorrow. The annoying thing is you come off as a know it all and we are all dumb and doing it wrong cuz we have no goals, plans etc. ill clue you in here, Many of the “naysayers” have real thought out actual plans, experience and capital to back it. These real specific plans are grounded in reality and experience which has be gained by doing this dreaming, like youre doing, and making tons of mistakes just to wind up learning that its not that simple. You can poo poo advice all that you want but it doesnt do you any justice. Keep on being the smartest guy in the room, that always ends well.
Not 1 person said you wont succeed or cant grow either.

It's hard to be a know-it-all while I'm here asking people for their advice. I disagree about the things that are and are not possible, but I'm well aware that my knowledge of the industry is limited compared to the industry vets here at Signs101.

We're not going to see eye-to-eye, and that's okay. It doesn't mean I don't wish all you guys well...even you.


Hope you enjoy the rest of your weekend man.

 

[equippaint]

Thing is employees come and go. They start good and end bad, start bad and end good or are meiocre at best. 1 thing they usually do is leave at some point. Not being negative, its just reality.
If you think youre going to build a successful business based on a key emoloyee you will get burned. Ive seen businesses fail from this. Hows tx old employer doing after stepping back?
From my house it looks like 2ct and his brother know every aspect and part of their business and could do any bit of it 100% on their own. This allows them to steer the ship. Them losing a key guy just means they have to work a bit more. It wont play out the same with the way you wabt to go. You need to get your hands around what you have.

 

[Bly]

I think it's a fantastic goal to be able to step away from your business and ideally that's what I hope to be able to do myself in the coming few years.
Setting up repeatable systems for staff to follow is key. Also as you've pointed out a very experienced manager is needed due to the complex nature of our industry.
Unless your business can run without you being there it's worth very little if you want to sell it.
You'll be lucky to get what the second hand stock and equipment is worth.

 

[Gino]

​

 

[WhatsYourSign?]

​

No thoughts Gino?

You've been in the game for awhile...do you think it's possible to build the business to run itself?

 

[Gino]

Yo what'sme........ it's Saturday night and quite frankly, not a subject worth getting into at this time. Of course I have some thoughts on the subject, but I'm recharging at the moment. Now, either try a fun subject or let me outta your problems, if I may so kindly suggest.

 

[WhatsYourSign?]

Yo what'sme........ it's Saturday night and quite frankly, not a subject worth getting into at this time. Of course I have some thoughts on the subject, but I'm recharging at the moment. Now, either try a fun subject or let me outta your problems, if I may so kindly suggest.

Fair enough!

No problems here, it's more morphed into a discussion about whether the sign business is suitable to have absentee owners or not.

 

[Johnny Best]

Exactly where do you want to go for a month.
Maybe if you have children you can work on your business for 18 years, get them a college education and have them take over the business while you take off for the rest of your life. That was the way farmers would do it for a long time and also why so many children sold the families farms or some being still run for 4 generations.
Your right about not being an "artisan" because if you were you would just say I am leaving for a month to do some plein air painting in Italy.

 

[WhatsYourSign?]

Exactly where do you want to go for a month.
Maybe if you have children you can work on your business for 18 years, get them a college education and have them take over the business while you take off for the rest of your life. That was the way farmers would do it for a long time and also why so many children sold the families farms or some being still run for 4 generations.
Your right about not being an "artisan" because if you were you would just say I am leaving for a month to do some plein air painting in Italy.

I have no plans to go anywhere for a month.

I asked the question because having the ability to leave for a month is the difference between owning a business and being self-employed.

I was hoping to learn some lessons from those on this board who have been able to turn their sign shop into a business but unfortunately the consensus is that it's simply not possible.

 

[WildWestDesigns]

I asked the question because having the ability to leave for a month is the difference between owning a business and being self-employed.

This, in my mind, really only matters if you plan on selling it or wanting to transfer it to the next generation. It's a business that can be sold more then just equipment. Of course, the bar of just going away for a month needs to be exponentially longer, like being on vacation for forever, not just a month.

I think, and this is just me personally, that businesses like these deal with a lot of passion from the owners (or should). There is a lot of blood sweat and tears built into these business from people that want to go for the long haul.

Now that has it's pros and it's cons, but I think that's a big mental road block for a lot of people (or it is atleast my mental roadblock).

I'm a little older then you (not by much), started when I was 14 working for my mom. I've already going upwards of the upper end of experience range that you listed.

I was hoping to learn some lessons from those on this board who have been able to turn their sign shop into a business but unfortunately the consensus is that it's simply not possible.

I think the definition of "business" is radically different between the consensus and what you have determined it to be.

I think your stuck on a "business that can be sold (or transferred more then just equipment)". Nothing wrong with that objective, but I do think that's different then the kind of "business" that most on here strive for. Just my opinion.

Just on my end, I plan on doing this until I'm either dead or physically and/or mentally unable to do this. Transferring it to my kids, while has some good feelings mentally, having something for them, while I love my trade and glad that I've been apart of it for as long as I have, I wouldn't do that to them. I wouldn't actively try to get them involved. If they want to be involved, that's one thing and I would support them, but I'm not going to be active about it. And passing it on to my kids would be the one thing that would get me to setup my business in such a way as to transfer it.

I'm by no means saying that last bit is the best, correct or any derivation of that "you" can think of, just where I'm at is all.

 

[Johnny Best]

Do not think anyone on here has a consensus it would not work. It is just not their goal as it seems to be for you. You feel if you hire the right people and get everything running right you should be able to walk away from it and start on something else without you being there to solve problems that might arise. Not everyone has the same skill sets as you and that seems to be the problem.
I have a good friend who started his own law firm years ago and his plan was to make enough money to sail around the world and still maintain his life style because his law firm would still make the money. Turned out he was always sought after by his clients who wanted him and not his associates to be their lawyer. Now he has like three partners and 20 plus lawyers working for him, large house, lots of money with large catamaran floating out back that he takes his two weeks off a year to sail somewhere. Family gone because he worked to much. He is the business and he is good at it and still has his dream.
Good luck with yours.

 

[HulkSmash]

Goals are important. Your employees are everything. Walking away for a month is not easy. Some people are lucky enough to have "business partners" who are family.. and they care as much as they do... well sometimes... You want to train your employees to think like owners, and when they reach that plateau, then you're close. we're 10 years in business - and im going on my first 1 week vacation in September. I guess I mostly to blame for that. I just do things myself because it's done faster and right. I use to have a problem releasing my responsibilities to others. I'm getting better at it. Good luck.

 

[HulkSmash]

I think where you're rubbing people the wrong way is how you're talking about opening in another location.,. lol that is a silly thing to do. We serve 4 states all around us. It's absolutely pointless. You're better off head hunting who you want rather than buying our an entire company to get them

 

[equippaint]

I’d like to hear from the guy that said Im going to start my own business so I dont have to take holidays and vacation and can work 60-70 hours a week. I want to go off on my own to do all of the physical work myself. Wheres the person who said I want to be there every single day? Your core logic about what owning a small business entails is flawed and its not just signs.
Can you even think of one person you know that owns a successfully run absentee business? I cant and its not cuz they dont want to make money doing nothing.
Our neighbor has about 200-300 employees and flys his helicopter to work everyday. Im sure he has other things hed rather be doing and the resources to do it.
A big customer of ours did $17m last year 60+ employees, key people in place and the 2 owners are there every single day 7-4. They will take a week or 2 off for vacations here and there but thats about it.
Its not this way because people don’t get it, it’s this way because the best one to manage your business is you. Someone thats better than you at it will just go do it on their own and find the resources to do it.