Need Help HP 310 Latex Problem...

[TomK]

Hey All, Having a weird issue with my HP 310 Latex. I have a case open with HP, support is trying to help, but it is moving slow and at this point they don't have any answers nor making any real progress.

What happened..

- Print quality issues, banding on blues/oranges/reds, ran a drop test and my lclm head had 1k bad nozzles showing
- Ordered a new print head, replaced it, printed once, looked good
- Next day, print problems return, ran a drop test, and > 1k bad nozzles on lclm
- HP said almost impossible, but could have 2 bad print heads in a row, so they sent me new print head
- Replace it, and still having the same issue
- Replace the maintenance cartridge and the lclm print head again, and same.....issues....still.....happening

I created a CMYK only profile, and I am having the same issues, which leads me to believe that it isn't a lclm only print head issue, however why new lclm print heads are going bad with only a few ml of ink through them, no one knows.

I've attached a couple of pics showing the dropped nozzles as well as color calibration showing the 1st half prints fine, the 2nd half has banding/streaking.

I've tried 2 different Oracal vinyls, 2 (new rolls) of substance media, and the same issues.

So, 4 new print heads for lclm, 1 new maintenance cartridge, and 4 different rolls of vinyl, nothing has worked yet.

 

[Christian @ Visual Graphx]

Have you checked to see if you have any ink or vacuum leaks?

 

[TomK]

Have you checked to see if you have any ink or vacuum leaks?

Thank you for your suggestions!

I'm not seeing any obvious ink leaks, at least visually. No idea how to check for vacuum issues.

There are no errors on the LCD or in the all support page dump.

 

[Christian @ Visual Graphx]

Most of the time ink and vac leaks don't show a error, but eventually you will end up with puddles on the floor.

 

[TomK]

Yea, no puddles on the floor or inside the printer that I can see, yet.

 

[TrustMoore_TN]

Seems like the only thing you haven't changed out is the actually ink yet. It may be bad batch of ink (but two carts with bad ink seems unlikely).

 

[TomK]

Seems like the only thing you haven't changed out is the actually ink yet. It may be bad batch of ink (but two carts with bad ink seems unlikely).

Yea, ink was next on my list. However, I'm at the point of not wanting to put another penny into this printer.

I'd have an Epson S60600 tomorrow if I had the room for it, unfortunately I don't. So I am looking at the Mimaki JV150 or JV300 or something else. My main priority is quality output since we do close up stickers and the HP hasn't been the best printer in terms of quality thanks to how grainy they print and a fixed picoliter droplet the size of a softball.

Someone on here recently used the term for the HP Latex machines - The Grain Train, and they couldn't be more spot on. That being said, it has been a solid and reliable machine for 3 years, but now...I've got a large heater and HP hasn't been able to zero in on it, going on 3 weeks of back and forth with them.

 

[Christian @ Visual Graphx]

Yea, ink was next on my list. However, I'm at the point of not wanting to put another penny into this printer.

I'd have an Epson S60600 tomorrow if I had the room for it, unfortunately I don't. So I am looking at the Mimaki JV150 or JV300 or something else. My main priority is quality output since we do close up stickers and the HP hasn't been the best printer in terms of quality thanks to how grainy they print and a fixed picoliter droplet the size of a softball.

Someone on here recently used the term for the HP Latex machines - The Grain Train, and they couldn't be more spot on. That being said, it has been a solid and reliable machine for 3 years, but now...I've got a large heater and HP hasn't been able to zero in on it, going on 3 weeks of back and forth with them.

You know almost all of that can be fixed with profiling and adjusting settings right? Yes there is always grain as the HP isn't variable dot but there are ways to mitigate it.

Canned profiles are not always great.

 

[HulkSmash]

Yea, ink was next on my list. However, I'm at the point of not wanting to put another penny into this printer.

I'd have an Epson S60600 tomorrow if I had the room for it, unfortunately I don't. So I am looking at the Mimaki JV150 or JV300 or something else. My main priority is quality output since we do close up stickers and the HP hasn't been the best printer in terms of quality thanks to how grainy they print and a fixed picoliter droplet the size of a softball.

Someone on here recently used the term for the HP Latex machines - The Grain Train, and they couldn't be more spot on. That being said, it has been a solid and reliable machine for 3 years, but now...I've got a large heater and HP hasn't been able to zero in on it, going on 3 weeks of back and forth with them.

yeah, we have 2 HP l360s and 2 hp 310s and, our print quality is phenomenal. You're just setup incorrectly, wrong profile.. or something else.

also your problem could be a bad encoder strip.

 

[TomK]

I keep hearing how proper profiles will fix the grain issue, however I've had samples run by two national HP vendors, one HP fanboi vendor that is on this site, even a printer guru from HP Latex labs, and two members here that run HP's, and they all said the same thing - the lighter colors produce grain mainly due to the droplet size, and this printer wasn't made for photo quality like prints at close viewing.

My blues, reds, blacks all look awesome, my greys, pastels, lighter mixes, etc not so awesome.

I'd be happy to put my money where my mouth is (and frustration) and if someone can "fix" this issue, I'd compensate them for their time. Just not sure how you profile away a droplet size of 12+ picoliters with an output that uses a lot of lighter shades and pastel colors.

For the folks saying how profiles will fix this, can you PM or post some close up of your prints that have lighter/pastel/grey colors in them? I'd love to see your output!

 

[Christian @ Visual Graphx]

These are some of my icc profile test swatches at .25" x .25" on 6 pass

There is some graininess, but this is 6 pass, If I ran this profiling on 10+ pass it would be significantly different.

 

[TomK]

These are some of my icc profile test swatches at .25" x .25" on 6 pass

There is some graininess, but this is 6 pass, If I ran this profiling on 10+ pass it would be significantly different.

Yea, those are...grainy for sure. I'd love to see those at 10 pass or higher!

 

[Christian @ Visual Graphx]

Just out of curiosity, what is it that you do that requires no grain?

 

[TomK]

Just out of curiosity, what is it that you do that requires no grain?

My wife runs a planner sticker business, small stickers that go in planners, notebooks, teacher journals, stuff like that, viewed from a very close pov, and after complaints of "omg your stickers are grainy" we moved to Canon printers.

Today, I use Canon Pro 2000 and 4000 aqueous printers for this stuff, after I tried for a long time to stick with Latex. But as you know, the media and inks on the aqueous are 2.5x the cost as they are for latex or solvent media and ink.

Plus the fact that aqueous vinyl has a resin coating that makes it pretty messy with cutting and such, and leaves lots of "dust" on the final product.

 

[HulkSmash]

printed on latex machines, with a correct profile, in the right environment. Not grainy, 10 pass.

 

[Christian @ Visual Graphx]

Here is 6 pass after profiling on Magnetic stock, The Source image for the Girl has grain in it.

 

[Christian @ Visual Graphx]

My wife runs a planner sticker business, small stickers that go in planners, notebooks, teacher journals, stuff like that, viewed from a very close pov, and after complaints of "omg your stickers are grainy" we moved to Canon printers.

Today, I use Canon Pro 2000 and 4000 aqueous printers for this stuff, after I tried for a long time to stick with Latex. But as you know, the media and inks on the aqueous are 2.5x the cost as they are for latex or solvent media and ink.

Plus the fact that aqueous vinyl has a resin coating that makes it pretty messy with cutting and such, and leaves lots of "dust" on the final product.

Makes sense as to the need, but Outdoor printers aren't suitable for this type of application and good aqueous is your better option due to the ink technology and resolution levels. Have you looked at a good high-resolution Toner printer?

 

[TomK]

Makes sense as to the need, but Outdoor printers aren't suitable for this type of application and good aqueous is your better option due to the ink technology and resolution levels. Have you looked at a good high-resolution Toner printer?

I have not looked at high res toner printers, how would that compare to the aqueous printers and aqueous media?

Any model/brands you can point me to?

 

[Christian @ Visual Graphx]

Some Hig Res toner machines have great quality, not as high resolution as aqueous but still very good.

Brands that I like and Trust are OkiData and Ricoh... I think they have some of the best toner machines on the market. Toner is pretty universal so you can use all kinds of lower cost label stock.

 

[dypinc]

I have not looked at high res toner printers, how would that compare to the aqueous printers and aqueous media?

Any model/brands you can point me to?

With toner based digital presses you can sheet feed precut labels, or not as practical but with 13 x 19 you can you can run them through your cutter. You can figure about .50 to .75 a sheet cost paper or polyester if you but bulk labels wholesale. Xerox Phasers would be what I would look at for quality and good color management.

I run most shall labels on our digital press unless they need to be high durability and or fade resistance. Way too expensive to run small labels on our aqueous or even the latex. Toner based printers would be perfect for planners, notebooks, teacher journals, stuff like that.