Opinion I'm not sure what to do..........................

[Gino]

I don't usually bash vendors or product which has gone bad and don't really like when others do it, but something has happened here and I won't mention the member's name, but they are a somewhat large vendor on these boards.

Got an e-mail to quote on a number of double sided signs. The way the request came in, I thought it was odd how certain things were worded/asked..... almost too knowledgeable on particular things they normally don't know about.
So, I called the person and proceeded to ask some question verbally, instead of via the internet. The guy threw terms around like he knew what they meant, but had no idea of quite similar terms and couldn't pronounce half the stuff.

At the end, I asked who I was bidding against and he told me the name of one somewhat local shop, which he said was skyhigh in their prices and the other one..... who turned out..... not to be a sign shop at all, but a total wholesaler. I asked him how he could get pricing from them ?? He said, they wouldn't at first, but I gave them my business information and they quoted away.

This guy is not a sign shop, nor a screen printing or embroidery shop, not an electrical shop nor a broker of any sorts. He has nothing at all related to any kinda advertising or printing business. It's safe to say, he sorta lied to get his prices.

So, the company in question has quoted and no one can touch their prices, but I don't know if this member should be told or not ?? Afterall, business is business, but so is.... fair is fair.

Opinions ??​

Please... at this point, do not ask me for the name, as I'm not sure what'I'm going to do. I also use this member for things outta our range.

ps.. you'll never believe another source he told me about when searching for his prices.​

 

[equippaint]

I don't think it will get anyone anywhere. Big companies don't care about you but they fake it well. You can tell them in hopes that it was a mistake but that is doubtful. I get the idea of wholesale suppliers of finished goods and many people here lean on them. The downside is that every time you order from these guys you are building their business which is based on under market "wholesale" pricing. There is nothing to stop them from selling to the public and it's really in their best business interest to do so. That may be under another dba to keep the illusion of being trade only (like the ones selling wrap material) but either way you slice it, its the same company.

 

[JTBoh]

Years ago, when the new Fiats first came out, we were contacted by 3M directly as a certified wrap installer. Supposedly, they were under contract with 3M to provide OEM decals for new vehicles, with installation services on site at the dealership. It was marketed as an option, that any new buyer could put on. We did about 15 of them over the course of 6 months, then... nothing.

Fast forward to a few days ago - guy with an Abarth comes in, 3M graphics in hand, wants the same thing. Gave me a link to amazon ($24!) to show how they will be placed. Who knows what happened.

 

[fresh]

You can stop using the wholesaler if you believe they are undercutting you. But can you find out if this trade shop has a retail price list?

There are two local "wholesale to trade" shops near me that have done the exact same thing. One literally posts their wholesale rates on their website, and anyone can order from them. I know this because one of my clients sent me their link and asked me to price match them. Nope, I only used them a few times and never will again. And the same thing happened with another "wholesaler" who I found out charges the same price for retail and trade. That guy solicited ME with "wholesale pricing" which was BS.

 

[ikarasu]

When I wanted to buy my own printer/cutter/laminator I wanted to see the prices of all the vinyls and materials, see if it was worth it to me.

It took me 5 minutes of filling out forms, and I was a member able to see pricing from the 3 main vinyl suppliers in Canada. Only one called me to make sure I had my own business... His only questions to verify it was what kind of plotter / printer do you own.

Vendors / wholesalers generally don't care who you are... The bigger you are, the slimmer their proffit margin is since you get a bigger discount. This guys probably paying more for the signs than you would, if you were to order from them. So...why do they care? They never will, until it starts hitting their bottom line.

You can name and shame them, and vow to never order from them again... But unless everyone does the same, it's not going to hurt them or change their minds.


I'd follow up with the wholesaler, maybe they don't know. Maybe some sales guy wanted to pad his monthly commissions and just let it go through, but the owner doesn't agree with it. Too many variables, I'd say send a short email to the wholesaler, politely asking their policy on selling to non wholesalers, give the guy your normal price range quote and be done with it.

 

[Gino]

Exactly why I said I won't name them. I don't think they did anything wrong. They asked the guy if he had a sign business and he said yes, but he doesn't. He filled out all the necessary paperwork and they believed him.

I'll continue to use these guys, as they haven't wronged me, they've just been lied to. That's the hard part to handle.

To boot, they guy also said he was on s101 and that's how he found the name. Then, he googled it and did what was required to get our pricing.

I'm just wondering, if it's worth calling the wholesaler ?? It's not a huge job, but it's about $5,800.00. It wouldn't be tattling, but asking how or why does this kinda stuff happen ??​

 

[equippaint]

No harm in calling. I have a competitor friend that can always beat my prices. When I get someone in here that strikes me the wrong way by being cheap and pushy, I call my friend and tell him to be on the lookout for the guy and what I priced the job at so he doesn't drop his pants. I'd rather have my friend make a few bucks than have some random rude cheapo get something cheap. If the person is nice but cheap or the job only makes sense if its cheap, I just send them his way without a heads up.

 

[Texas_Signmaker]

If the potential customer was Savvy enough to find signs 101 and start calling wholesalers then maybe he deserves the wholesale pricing. I don't think it's very common for retail customers to research sign wholesalers and pretend to be a sign company in order to get wholesale pricing. I don't think it's the wholesalers fault, they got played but but luckily a lot of people don't do that.

 

[Pat Whatley]

Exactly why I said I won't name them. I don't think they did anything wrong. They asked the guy if he had a sign business and he said yes, but he doesn't. He filled out all the necessary paperwork and they believed him.

Gino, I can't tell you how many things I've bought over the years that I'm pretty sure I shouldn't have been able to. We were incorporated at the time as Allen-Whatley Enterprises, Inc. Usually all I had to do was apply for a wholesale account, they didn't even ask what kind of business we were.

 

[ikarasu]

If you have a good relationship with the wholesaler, I'd call and let them know. I wouldn't even call it tattling. Companies have policies like this for a reason.

It may just be what they need to realize they have a loop hole, and get them off their butts to fix it.

I'd love to call up Coke, give them my business # And say I'd like to buy a dozen cases of coke for 25% of what retailers sell them for. If everyone did that... it'd hurt retailers in the long run, and if retailers stopped stocking coke because the profit was so small... it would also hurt coke in the long run.

There's plenty of reasons people shouldn't be buying wholesale when they're not a wholesaler... So I say let the company know, if they choose to do something about it or not, that's up to them.

 

[Billct2]

I'd let them know in a friendly way that they may want to double check new customers...l

 

[unclebun]

I think you're supposed to drop your prices to the wholesale price.

We had a guy here whose dad from the big city set him up with a shipping shop that has mailboxes for rent. Except it's not a franchise. I first had contact with him when he couldn't install vinyl he'd bought online on his front windows. It was foot wide strips of printed calendared vinyl with no laminate and no application tape, to go across the top of his windows. When I saw it and told him how much it was going to be, he said I was robbing him and it wasn't worth that much. But he couldn't do it himself so he had me do it. I had to take it back to the shop and put application tape on it to get it to work in the 100 degree heat of summer. He started doing quick printing and copying, and then started calling me for quotes on small aluminum signs etc. he wanted to sell to his customers, but never ordered any. Fast forward about a year and a salesman for N. Glantz stopped in and asked me if I would go to lunch with him. I did, and essentially he wanted to vent about that place and another sign shop here in town. The shipping/copy/mailbox shop had gotten a printer and was selling signs and banners, and he'd been hammering the sales rep to give him lower prices, lower prices, and then he wouldn't order. He told the rep his goal was to be the cheapest sign shop in town and he was selling everything to beat internet pricing....but to retail customers. The other sign shop had apparently decided to try to race him to the bottom. A month later the sales rep emailed me to thank me for my business and to say he was quitting.

This is what happens when some young smart-aleck goes to business school and thinks he knows better how to do things. Of course, what happened was that he did siphon away a fair amount of banner and real estate sign business, and he drove prices down for a couple of years. He got busier and hired someone to work full time for him doing the signs. And lo and behold, all of a sudden I could sell banners at my old usual pricing and nobody tried to argue with me that they could get it cheaper elsewhere.

It's not exactly the same situation you're dealing with, Gino, but it's the same kind of person. A cheater, really. If I were you I would contact the wholesaler and explain to them what you found out and that you wanted to let them know they'd made a mistake on that job quote and that you're trying to help them out so they can keep the trust of the sign business by letting them know. After all, if people knew they were patronizing someone who was retailing to their own customer base at the same wholesale prices they were being charged, they would probably not want to keep patronizing them.

 

[equippaint]

Unclebun, Its because many tradesman dont understand business. They work for someone and see all the money they bring in and totally underestimate the costs and what is going out. So they think the boss is making a mint, quit, and start their own thing. To them, overhead is the rent and power bill and cost is the material in the finished product, nothing more. Their labor is free and profit is job minus material cost.
I'm sure this guy here said, rent is covered by the mailboxes, Ill pay for the printer cash so its pure 100% profit. People dont get it and there is no shortage of them.

 

[Terry01]

If I got a call with a price that is BS, I just say I'm way too busy.. best you get them to do it....Outfits like that don't last long..
The clients come back eventually and you tell them to go to that other dude again..They start crying cos that guy has
shifted on..Price is a price if you have done your homework..Do you wear a red suit and have a beard??? I'm not
santa claus either and I don't work for free

 

[FireSprint.com]

I dont know who the supplier was, but if it was us, I would want to know about it. We're growing fast and we have an amazing team, but we make mistakes too. I would want to know about it personally.

My biggest fear isn't that we might mess a job or interaction up. My biggest fear in our business is that we mess something up and we don't find out about it or offered a chance to fix it. (we're going to inevitably mess something up at some point)

Or even worse, we mess something up and then misunderstand the customer when they try to give us a chance to fix it.

Gene /at/ Firesprint.com

 

[Megagrafix]

I agree with Firesprint. We are wholesalers also and would want to know. And explain any extenuating circumstances if there are.

 

[JCinNY]

We're pretty small but as we grow I hope that our customers will bring any problems to our attention so we can fix them before we get a bad name. Not that you would say anything but another person/company may feel the need to bash them and sometimes that can be hard to overcome. Now days a bad rep spreads faster than a good one.

 

[visual800]

Dont waste your breath. Let them quote and have at it. Gemini does same thing, Fellers, Grimco. None of them care anymore its all about money