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Is customer trying to scam me?

ams

ams

New Member
I actually have a sign above my front door on the inside so they see it when leaving, it states that once the signs leave the shop, the customer agrees they are in good shape and accepted them as is. Sometimes this makes a customer double check before leaving to look for issues. Once it leaves, it's out of my hands.

Reason I did that is because one day a customer took a dozen yard signs, they were unlaminated printed vinyl. They checked them, loved them and took them. A week later they came back and said they stuck together and ripped the ink off them. I asked if they were pressed together, they said "No they have been in the back of my car since I picked them up" this is summer time, it was a high of 90 degrees. I asked if something were on top of them, they stated some real estate frames.

So all in all the customer abused them and they wanted them redone for free. I do now also put brown paper dividers between them so this won't happen again, but they will always find a way of screwing something up.
 
DerbyCitySignGuy

DerbyCitySignGuy

New Member
ams said:
I actually have a sign above my front door on the inside so they see it when leaving, it states that once the signs leave the shop, the customer agrees they are in good shape and accepted them as is. Sometimes this makes a customer double check before leaving to look for issues. Once it leaves, it's out of my hands.

Reason I did that is because one day a customer took a dozen yard signs, they were unlaminated printed vinyl. They checked them, loved them and took them. A week later they came back and said they stuck together and ripped the ink off them. I asked if they were pressed together, they said "No they have been in the back of my car since I picked them up" this is summer time, it was a high of 90 degrees. I asked if something were on top of them, they stated some real estate frames.

So all in all the customer abused them and they wanted them redone for free. I do now also put brown paper dividers between them so this won't happen again, but they will always find a way of screwing something up.
Click to expand...

The backer from roll vinyl makes great slip sheets. I usually save a roll or two and have them on hand.
 
T

tulsagraphics

New Member
Good news! My client paid the bill! =D

I sent them an email explaining how this could have happened, and that it wasn't from a production issue. Apparently, that was enough to convince them because they cut me a check for the full amount. Woohoo!

Thank you for all the input guys. Much appreciated!
 
T

tulsagraphics

New Member
DerbyCitySignGuy said:
The backer from roll vinyl makes great slip sheets. I usually save a roll or two and have them on hand.
Click to expand...
Yip. I usually try to do that. One time I actually had ink stick to the liner even though the ink was dry to the touch (found out after a customer unboxed my shipment). So it's still good to let the prints cure for a little while before stacking with liners (especially if they are getting stretch filmed).
 
2B

2B

Active Member
DerbyCitySignGuy said:
Where's Gino? Somebody tell him there's more good news.
Click to expand...

probably giving someone one of his famed happy endings


to the OP, glad it all got sorted and hopefully this was a good learning experience / good pointers picked up for future projects.
 
T

TimToad

Active Member
ams said:
I actually have a sign above my front door on the inside so they see it when leaving, it states that once the signs leave the shop, the customer agrees they are in good shape and accepted them as is. Sometimes this makes a customer double check before leaving to look for issues. Once it leaves, it's out of my hands.

Reason I did that is because one day a customer took a dozen yard signs, they were unlaminated printed vinyl. They checked them, loved them and took them. A week later they came back and said they stuck together and ripped the ink off them. I asked if they were pressed together, they said "No they have been in the back of my car since I picked them up" this is summer time, it was a high of 90 degrees. I asked if something were on top of them, they stated some real estate frames.

So all in all the customer abused them and they wanted them redone for free. I do now also put brown paper dividers between them so this won't happen again, but they will always find a way of screwing something up.
Click to expand...

Customers come in to pick up and we always show them their signs first. Then we'll grab the roll of spent media liner or brown kraft laminator paper to wrap them up for them. Some will try to stop us and we just tell them that they can get bumped around in the back of the car and we want them to look as good as the minute they were completed when they go into use. Very few refuse the special treatment and it cuts our waste stream of liner or paper.
 
dale911

dale911

President
I had this happen once with yard signs. Now I use super cheap instant one media laminate for stuff like this. The laminate is great as long as it’s short term and you won’t have the problem of the ink transfer. The other option is to use a printer with a different ink type. Latex or UV would be great since they don’t like to transfer like solvent inks.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 
Active Sign

Active Sign

Sign Guy
I’ve seen this personally with gloss IJ35. Stack the signs and they stick/transfer ink. We switched to cheap matte oracal for yard signs/cheap signs. No stacking sticking/transfer problems since we started using matte.

If they are repeat customers I’d offer a discount (maybe 10%) on the order to make them feel warm and fuzzy about it. Explain that you discovered a material issue that you haven’t seen before and are working to get it resolved. They are cheap Coro signs and you can take a small hit on them. Just cover your a$$ a little better next time they order.

This way you get paid, gain a little experience and keep a repeat customer. Everyone goes home happy.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 
ams

ams

New Member
dale911 said:
I had this happen once with yard signs. Now I use super cheap instant one media laminate for stuff like this. The laminate is great as long as it’s short term and you won’t have the problem of the ink transfer. The other option is to use a printer with a different ink type. Latex or UV would be great since they don’t like to transfer like solvent inks.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
Click to expand...

Unlaminated vinyl will always outlast the coroplast anyways, so adding laminate is a waste of money and an extra step. However it does protect the ink. But then there is another issue, buying cheap laminate to apply to a vinyl that may not be compatible and could fail quickly.
 
T

tulsagraphics

New Member
ams said:
Unlaminated vinyl will always outlast the coroplast anyways, so adding laminate is a waste of money and an extra step. However it does protect the ink. But then there is another issue, buying cheap laminate to apply to a vinyl that may not be compatible and could fail quickly.
Click to expand...
True. And it's hard enough to be competitive using the printed vinyl method anyway (compared to vendors using flatbed printers), let alone adding a 2nd film to the mix. I'm going to try matte vinyl instead and see if that helps.
 
Gino

Gino

Premium Subscriber
Seriously, using a flatbed, the cost is basically $1.30 to produce an 18" × 24" two-sided...... for us. And it only takes about 30 minutes all total, plus maybe 2 minutes to slice them up. So, when comparing that to a layer of printed vinyl, regardless of the sheen or cast or whatever, then applying it or adding a laminate..... you cannot compete. Even the least effective flatbed will last 2 years. Almost longer than the substrate itself. It's a no-brainer.

In fact, I just did a set of magnetics on Friday. Cost of magnetic material, about 80 cents for ink and I clear-coated a liquid lam on it.... took about 10 minutes to produce and 20 minutes for the laminate to completely dry. Got $225.00 cor them.
 
T

tulsagraphics

New Member
Nice. I would love to have a flatbed. (maybe one day!)

Just curious -- how do you apply liquid laminate to flatbed prints? Spray can?
 
S

stew1tx

Centex Wraps and Signs
thats why we usually have a policy that payment is due when material is picked up or delivered. Do I deviate? Sure, but only by those that I know. Last time it happened I printed and installed 3 4x8 MDO signs at a wrecking services new yard. We got into a pissing match of sorts, well my business partner did (the dude has sent her lude comments and solicitations in the past even though he is married) and he said come pick the signs up. I said since this isn't going well, I need payment now. That was the original issue, my business partner sent him invoices 3 times, the 4th she sent we will need this paid before the ___th or we will have to repossess the signs. he said OMG what kind of mickey mouse operation are you running that you can not give terms. Said we will never make if if we don't offer clients terms and continued about how many millions he has in wreckers etc... We she said so much so that you can not pay your bills huh. Great thing happened, he removed the signs and brought them back for me. Saw that the old sign company he used copied our signs haha. They also did one of the worst $8500 wrap jobs I have seen on one of his big wreckers.

So, my point is be careful even when you know someone well. I am going to offer a finance company to those that can not pay on the spot.
 
S

stew1tx

Centex Wraps and Signs
Gino said:
Seriously, using a flatbed, the cost is basically $1.30 to produce an 18" × 24" two-sided...... for us. And it only takes about 30 minutes all total, plus maybe 2 minutes to slice them up. So, when comparing that to a layer of printed vinyl, regardless of the sheen or cast or whatever, then applying it or adding a laminate..... you cannot compete. Even the least effective flatbed will last 2 years. Almost longer than the substrate itself. It's a no-brainer.

In fact, I just did a set of magnetics on Friday. Cost of magnetic material, about 80 cents for ink and I clear-coated a liquid lam on it.... took about 10 minutes to produce and 20 minutes for the laminate to completely dry. Got $225.00 cor them.
Click to expand...

WHOLLY CRAP 225 for magnets? I need to be in your market. But, apples being apples I wonder how your ink cost compares to our using latex and vinyl. If we are running a cheap, lets call it .30/ft2 and .17 for ink, thats about .80 for a much lower investment. With that said, an affiliate shop bought a fb500 for a theme park job and I asked about running full color print on boards and they quoted me about 99/board and thats with me providing the substrate. I said broski, that is not wholesale pricing lol.

I forgot to mention the spray laminate thing just for reasons like this. I do that with our magnets.
 
ams

ams

New Member
tulsagraphics said:
True. And it's hard enough to be competitive using the printed vinyl method anyway (compared to vendors using flatbed printers), let alone adding a 2nd film to the mix. I'm going to try matte vinyl instead and see if that helps.
Click to expand...

Beware, matte vinyl doesn't hold up as well outdoors as gloss vinyl does.
 
James Piland

James Piland

New Member
hey! does anyone have an instruction sheet they give to the customers on how to handle and take care of their printed signs?

We are new to digital printing.

thanks in advance!
 
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