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Is this a polycarb sign face?

gnubler

Active Member
Went on a site visit to check out an existing backlit sign that needs a new face. It's an oval and looks like it has a metal lip that fits around the cabinet, with screw fasteners all around. Has anyone dealt with a backlit sign like this? It's about 12 feet up so these are the best pictures I could get for now.

20240617_154446.jpg 20240617_160131.jpg 20240617_1544462.jpg
 

Gino

Premium Subscriber
I don't know how you could tell from those pictures, but if I was doing that size, it would be poly and possibly have bumpers on the inside. About what size is it ??
 

Gino

Premium Subscriber
I thought it was 12' wide. Probably acrylic in that case and like he said, trim around it. It would be easiest to take down and do it all, if you're replacing the face itself.
 

weyandsign

New Member
You would either need to trace the face on cardboard or paper, or take the face back with you. You shouldn't need to take the whole sign down, but that's up to you depending on how comfortable you are with making a new face and having it fitting properly. It should be pretty easy to re-design since it's just an oval. The trimcap adds about an extra 0.1" so take that into consideration when you make the oval your design program.
 

unclebun

Active Member
It looks to me like the face was made like a channel letter. That gold trim would be something like Edgelite, glued to the edge of the face. It doesn't look real big so it could be acrylic or polycarbonate. To take the face off you unscrew all those screws around the edge and it just pulls off, face and trim as one piece. Unless the face was UV printed directly on the plastic you can probably just peel off the old lettering and reletter it.
 

gnubler

Active Member
My plan was to take the face off to either trace it for a new piece of substrate or reuse the old one. New design will be solid coverage and would cover any discoloration on the poly. I've never worked with trimcap. The sign is old, maybe 11+ years old and I've seen mention in other threads that removing old trimcap can break it.
 

JBurton

Signtologist
I've never worked with trimcap.
Oh dear. This will at least be an easy one to learn on. Call your distributor, order some trimcap, I like channelbond typically but the guys have been using weldon, at any rate you'll need glue. Also a big fan of poly over acrylic for these, polycarbonate can take a beating, acrylic stays white, pick your need based on that. Remove the old face, trace onto new polycarbonate face down with a sharpie (poly has a back side, make sure you put face down on the back, cut right on the line, decorate, then trimcap. Easiest (cheapest?) way is to get a piece of plywood, put 4 nails down to hold it in place. then start putting the trimcap to the edge, adding nails every 1" or so to hold it tight to the plastic, trace with channelbond, allow time to dry, 15 minutes or so, and do 3 coats. Carefully remove the nails after a couple hours, slip it over the can, add new screws in totally different places.
 

Texas_Signmaker

Very Active Signmaker
Exactly what Burton said. When tracing, pull the old trimcap off.i think it's Weldon 4 with that little plastic bottle. I just did one last week
 

Ryze Signs

New Member
Polycarbonate won't glue well to trim cap. Trim cap is made using acrylic so it can be glued to acrylic faces using acrylic glue. For extra strength you can order sign grade acrylic such as optix which glues well and is stronger than plain acrylic. The acrylic glue is available in different viscosities. Usually the thin glue is applied first followed by the thicker glue. I also like to run the thin glue on the face after pulling the letter on larger faces.
 

visual800

Active Member
its got to be acrylic with trimcap, once you take trimcap off you can use it for a pattern, IF graphics can be reused I would try that. Call another sign shop and ask them if you can buy ebuff trimcap to do this ob instead of getting a whole roll
 

JBurton

Signtologist
Polycarbonate won't glue well to trim cap.
Never had a problem, except when channelbond got hit with additional hazmat shipping, and it was all stuck at the warehouse until they got an exemption or found a courier, no clue how that shook out. Though I'd avoid getting channel bond on vinyl, it will blister it pretty bad.
its got to be acrylic with trimcap

wensco-sign-supply-ventex-channelbond-qt.png

Channel Bond Adhesive is a quick-setting, medium bodied cement designed to bond polycarbonate to polycarbonate, acrylic to polycarbonate, Jewelite® (Butyrate) to polycarbonate, and modified acrylic (DR) to polycarbonate and acrylic.
 

gnubler

Active Member
Yeah, what's the wow? That a seemingly simple face replacement has become somewhat complicated? (at least for my small shop) I'm open to trying new things but this is sounding like a PITA.

Estimating these signs (there are two) of ovals 64" wide x 30" tall I'll need about 30 feet of trimcap plus whatever appropriate adhesive. I doubt any of my friendly local sign shops stock this material, nobody around here does electric signs. I was able to get a picture of the manufacturer tag and it was made by a shop in a city 100 miles away.
 

JBurton

Signtologist
Yeah, what's the wow? That a seemingly simple face replacement has become somewhat complicated? (at least for my small shop) I'm open to trying new things but this is sounding like a PITA.

Estimating these signs (there are two) of ovals 64" wide x 30" tall I'll need about 30 feet of trimcap plus whatever appropriate adhesive. I doubt any of my friendly local sign shops stock this material, nobody around here does electric signs. I was able to get a picture of the manufacturer tag and it was made by a shop in a city 100 miles away.
I'd wager you could holler at signfab and have them produce a face, but it will be exactly the shape you send to them, so it would be best to pen a pattern that is close enough that dropping the face over it matches precisely. Only problem for them would be shipping economically. Though based off the snazzy looking roof and beams, I'd price it high and tell them a new rectangular cabinet wouldn't be too much more expensive in the end.
My distributors would be happy to sell footage of trimcap as long as it's not an odd color, gold really looks crappy as the sign ages anyway, so I'd opt for black. It's a pain for sure, but it's a staple of my work, and I have guys who don't mind pounding a hammer all day long.
 

unclebun

Active Member
Yeah, what's the wow? That a seemingly simple face replacement has become somewhat complicated? (at least for my small shop) I'm open to trying new things but this is sounding like a PITA.

Estimating these signs (there are two) of ovals 64" wide x 30" tall I'll need about 30 feet of trimcap plus whatever appropriate adhesive. I doubt any of my friendly local sign shops stock this material, nobody around here does electric signs. I was able to get a picture of the manufacturer tag and it was made by a shop in a city 100 miles away.
If it's only 64"x30" it's small as I suspected. It's likely acrylic. No need for the disadvantages of polycarb on a small face like that. The trimcap isn't all that expensive. A 150' roll ranges from $60-80 depending on brand and color for 1" wide. 2" wide is about $110. You can get it from Glantz or any supplier that sells things for electric signs. They sell the cement you need as well. You can also buy 10' lengths for about $5. You'll have tons of it left over on the roll, but you can charge the customer for the whole roll.
 

gnubler

Active Member
Thanks for all the info, very helpful. Gonna read back through the thread to see if I can do this one.

Questions:
Trimcap is adhered to the acrylic face in the shop, and then fastened with screws around the can at the job site, correct?

When removing faces on electric signs like this, do you leave it open to the elements or cover it with something? Banner material?
 
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