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JV33 Bulk ink????

SameDay Signs

New Member
So guys were looking at going to a bulk ink system in our JV33 as we already use triangle mss inks but go through alot of them and the fact we can possibly cut cost down in 1/2 it is intriguing....Was wondering if anyone had info on a couple different setups....

1) Jetbest ink i see pretty solid reviews across the board and well lets be honest the price is pretty amazing as long as the product is good. Wondering though we run 4 color and will the 4 cartridge setup work well and will the empty 4 lines end up drying up and going bad say we ever decide to go back to carts?

2) We have a tech who sells ink from solventcartridges and I'm not saying it is a bad ink just not sure as theres very little information on or about them. So if anyone uses them or knows anything that would be great...Was told it was actually made by Beadurx (however the hell you spell it) but I'm not sure how good that is either in itself. Plus the sytem being gravity fed downs tubes i always worry about as well compared to the jetbest being a sit on top style and clicking the lock in for the bottle

Any help is appreciated

thanks
 

Solventinkjet

DIY Printer Fixing Guide
1. With the 4 color setup, all 8 lines are still being used so you don't have to worry about them drying up or anything. Some bulk systems will fill all 8 slots and some will only fill 4. Either way works fine. Why not stick with Triangle's bulk system? I have personally installed one and it works great. If the ink works for you in cartridge form, I would stick with what works.

2. Bordeaux is a good brand. Just a disclaimer, my company sells that brand so take with a grain of salt. We went through about 5 different brands before finding Bordeaux and they were the only brand that didn't give us issues.

The best bulk systems have what are called, mid-cartridges. They will have a tank for each color that connects to the mid-cartridges via a tube and then the cartridge goes into the slot like a normal cartridge. These systems keep the pressure at the proper place so that you don't run into issues. Refillable cartridges without bags in them, do not work well over time so don't make that mistake.
 

SameDay Signs

New Member
1. With the 4 color setup, all 8 lines are still being used so you don't have to worry about them drying up or anything. Some bulk systems will fill all 8 slots and some will only fill 4. Either way works fine. Why not stick with Triangle's bulk system? I have personally installed one and it works great. If the ink works for you in cartridge form, I would stick with what works.

2. Bordeaux is a good brand. Just a disclaimer, my company sells that brand so take with a grain of salt. We went through about 5 different brands before finding Bordeaux and they were the only brand that didn't give us issues.

The best bulk systems have what are called, mid-cartridges. They will have a tank for each color that connects to the mid-cartridges via a tube and then the cartridge goes into the slot like a normal cartridge. These systems keep the pressure at the proper place so that you don't run into issues. Refillable cartridges without bags in them, do not work well over time so don't make that mistake.
I worry because the inks im not so much worried about but more the quality of the sytem itself....here is a pic of the system they are trying to sell me on....it just seems to cheap to me IDK but i do appreciate the help
 

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Solventinkjet

DIY Printer Fixing Guide
That one is kind of a middle ground type of system in my view. The floats work better than filling it yourself every time and allowing dust and particles to enter the system. I always have issues with these unless they have a bag in the cartridge. The Triangle one I installed for one of my customers didn't look like that. It had bags in the cartridges.
 

SameDay Signs

New Member
That one is kind of a middle ground type of system in my view. The floats work better than filling it yourself every time and allowing dust and particles to enter the system. I always have issues with these unless they have a bag in the cartridge. The Triangle one I installed for one of my customers didn't look like that. It had bags in the cartridges.
see i couldnt find traingle bulk systems anywhere with exception of the older systems on the JV3s.....will continue to do my homework though i appreciate all the help
 

Neil

New Member
I'm running Jetbest bulk system thorough my CJV30 no problems.
I get the 500ml bottles that plug straight onto the refillable carts with permanent chips.
I only use 4 slots, the other 4 have empty "dummy" carts in them that never get filled.
Never had any problems with this, or Jetbest inks, in over 3 years.
 

SightLine

║▌║█║▌│║▌║▌█
I very much agree with Vander on this. Even the middle ground setup like was pictured with the floats tend to be problematic. The (C)JV33 (as well as the newer (C)JV150/300) machines are extremely sensitive to pressures in the ink train. These machines have solenoid valves at the back of each cartridge slot and are much different than the ancient 4 head JV3 machines. Problem even with the float type setups is the pressures get screwy as the float goes up and down plus the fact that the inks are still in open tanks exposed to air, etc. Inks when made are degassed and when in a sealed ink bag setup like regular cartridges or ink bag bulk setups the ink is never exposed to air.

We have two JV33 machines both with Triangles Easy Bulk 2 liter bulk setups and I can say from experience that they do work excellent. That being said, I've heard that possibly Triangle might be out of the mid-cartridges for their setup and might not be getting any more.... I have not personally confirmed this though and with a bit of research one could almost certainly find suitable replacement mid cartridges. Triangle recommends replacing the mid-carts quarterly but over the years we have kept them in for as much as a year and a half or so. I think the main reason they need to periodically be replaced is the potential for the ink bag after so many times of expanding and contracting that it might weaken as well as to assure that if any pigments have possibly settled out of solution in the bottom of the bags in the mid carts that the settled solids will not get sucked up. Mimaki's own MBIS bulk ink system works in the same manner. The mid carts are simply a 220ml size cartridge that has a second port on the end of the cartridge that sticks out of the machine which a tube to the sealed ink bag on the stand on top feeds into.

The main plus to the sealed ink bag bulk setups is that they give the exact same pressures and as far as the ink train goes work and act just like a regular cartridge does. As ink gets used, the ink bag inside collapses down. No air exposure for the inks, no spills, no funky pressures being introduced to the system, etc.

I would however say that if you are not using maybe more than about 1000ml a week in inks that I'd personally stay with 440ml cartridges (quality aftermarket would still be fine) as you do tend to have to stock a good bit more ink with bulk setups. A 2 liter bulk setup requires the equivalent of over 4.5 440ml cartridges of ink per color. There are a couple of other sealed ink bag bulk setups available from different ink companies that use smaller bags though. I know STS and Bordeaux has bulk systems that uses 1 liter bags and I think I've seen one that uses 600ml bags around but I think that might only be for overseas models with the BS inks.

I would also not go with the idea of not worrying so much about the quality of the inks.... There are some very inferior and poorly made inks out there that can and will cause you major problems. On ink brands I'd personally say to go with a proven brand that has been around a long time that has had good reviews. The most well known big dogs are Triangle, Bordeaux, Nazdar followed by STS, Jetbest, and probably Sam Ink and Inktec.

The list is pretty fresh on my mind because I just bought two JV150 machines to replace our aging JV33's and I'm not going to continue with Triangle MSS inks. To be honest I have not been very happy with that ink. For years we ran Triangle JVV inks which were great but early last year Triangle discontinued the JVV inks which forced us to change to their MSS inks. The MSS inks are what I would call "stickier" if I had to put a term on it - since switching from their JVV inks to their MSS inks our maintenance on the printer has doubled and we get more frequent nozzles out when the machine sits over a weekend. The MSS inks just seems to gunk up everywhere around the printhead, bottom of the print carriage, and around the wiper and capping station a LOT more than the older JVV inks did. So on the two new machines I'm going to change brands. I'm deciding between Bordeaux, STS, and Nazdar....
 

SameDay Signs

New Member
I
I very much agree with Vander on this. Even the middle ground setup like was pictured with the floats tend to be problematic. The (C)JV33 (as well as the newer (C)JV150/300) machines are extremely sensitive to pressures in the ink train. These machines have solenoid valves at the back of each cartridge slot and are much different than the ancient 4 head JV3 machines. Problem even with the float type setups is the pressures get screwy as the float goes up and down plus the fact that the inks are still in open tanks exposed to air, etc. Inks when made are degassed and when in a sealed ink bag setup like regular cartridges or ink bag bulk setups the ink is never exposed to air.

We have two JV33 machines both with Triangles Easy Bulk 2 liter bulk setups and I can say from experience that they do work excellent. That being said, I've heard that possibly Triangle might be out of the mid-cartridges for their setup and might not be getting any more.... I have not personally confirmed this though and with a bit of research one could almost certainly find suitable replacement mid cartridges. Triangle recommends replacing the mid-carts quarterly but over the years we have kept them in for as much as a year and a half or so. I think the main reason they need to periodically be replaced is the potential for the ink bag after so many times of expanding and contracting that it might weaken as well as to assure that if any pigments have possibly settled out of solution in the bottom of the bags in the mid carts that the settled solids will not get sucked up. Mimaki's own MBIS bulk ink system works in the same manner. The mid carts are simply a 220ml size cartridge that has a second port on the end of the cartridge that sticks out of the machine which a tube to the sealed ink bag on the stand on top feeds into.

The main plus to the sealed ink bag bulk setups is that they give the exact same pressures and as far as the ink train goes work and act just like a regular cartridge does. As ink gets used, the ink bag inside collapses down. No air exposure for the inks, no spills, no funky pressures being introduced to the system, etc.

I would however say that if you are not using maybe more than about 1000ml a week in inks that I'd personally stay with 440ml cartridges (quality aftermarket would still be fine) as you do tend to have to stock a good bit more ink with bulk setups. A 2 liter bulk setup requires the equivalent of over 4.5 440ml cartridges of ink per color. There are a couple of other sealed ink bag bulk setups available from different ink companies that use smaller bags though. I know STS and Bordeaux has bulk systems that uses 1 liter bags and I think I've seen one that uses 600ml bags around but I think that might only be for overseas models with the BS inks.

I would also not go with the idea of not worrying so much about the quality of the inks.... There are some very inferior and poorly made inks out there that can and will cause you major problems. On ink brands I'd personally say to go with a proven brand that has been around a long time that has had good reviews. The most well known big dogs are Triangle, Bordeaux, Nazdar followed by STS, Jetbest, and probably Sam Ink and Inktec.

The list is pretty fresh on my mind because I just bought two JV150 machines to replace our aging JV33's and I'm not going to continue with Triangle MSS inks. To be honest I have not been very happy with that ink. For years we ran Triangle JVV inks which were great but early last year Triangle discontinued the JVV inks which forced us to change to their MSS inks. The MSS inks are what I would call "stickier" if I had to put a term on it - since switching from their JVV inks to their MSS inks our maintenance on the printer has doubled and we get more frequent nozzles out when the machine sits over a weekend. The MSS inks just seems to gunk up everywhere around the printhead, bottom of the print carriage, and around the wiper and capping station a LOT more than the older JVV inks did. So on the two new machines I'm going to change brands. I'm deciding between Bordeaux, STS, and Nazdar....


If it' possible to send me info on wjat you paid for your triangle system and where that be great I actually emailed triangle about it but no response we and my 2 suppliers who I buy the mss carts from dont have the bulk ink system or bags.....I am going to look into STS system as well and your spot on a out the mss inks being sticks
 
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