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Light Cyan and Light Magenta

Discussion in 'Roland' started by jason91, Dec 2, 2015.

  1. Correct Color

    Correct Color Member

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    Andy,

    Thanks for the warning. But then trolls like him are all over the Internet.

    Fact is though that he left me an easy layup and I had to take it.

    Of course he doesn't care and I'm sure he'll have some country/cutesy reply.

    But I'm not talking to him anyway.

    I'm just using him to get the point across.



    Mike
     
    • Like Like x 1
  2. Andy D

    Andy D Very Active Member

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    I wouldn't say a troll, just extremely sure of his knowledge of all the facts regardless of his limited experience.
    A real smart guy to be sure, but totally blind to knowing what he doesn't know.
    Probably a nice guy in real life though.
     
  3. bob

    bob Major Contributor

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    Which word didn't you understand? The statement is inarguable. What comes out of the printer is not what you hope will come out of the printer, not what you wish would come out of the printer, not what you beseech whatever gods to which you pray to make come out of the printer. What comes out of the printer is the truth. Given the inputs that you gave it, what rolls out the front is what you get. It's mind boggling that a specimen even as dull as you give every indication of being cannot comprehend this simple principle.

    The statement is merely a corollary to the first axiom of software, that being "The code is the truth." Meaning that the code is not going do what you hope it will do, what you wish it would do, what you get down on your knees and pray to your gods it will do. It will do exactly what's written, no more no less.

    A note to pretentious microcephalics such as you and your posse [of one apparently]. I was dealing with color processing and digital imaging when you, and your parents as well, were making in their pants. Try to follow along here, it's important. Like many if not most things in life, this topic is like an onion, the more you peel it the simpler it gets. Perhaps it seems complicated to your child-like mind because you do not understand it, not because you do.
     
  4. Andy D

    Andy D Very Active Member

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    Haha, see what I mean? Thanks Bob, that's awesome! You never disappoint!

    On a side note Bob, have you ever read Confederacy of Dunces? If not, you should, you're Ignatius J. Reilly come to life!
    Someone needs to compile your posts.
     
  5. bob

    bob Major Contributor

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    You artfully managed to 'blah-blah' over the entire point. Is this what passes for witty repartee there in your tribe when you're not grooming each other's pelts and pointing at the sun?
     
  6. Andy D

    Andy D Very Active Member

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    :smile: I actually laughed out loud, good one.
    To answer your question though, the blah blah blah were an attempt to be witty, but also to bring focus to the gem encrusted turds you like to drop...
     
  7. DerbyCitySignGuy

    DerbyCitySignGuy Very Active Member

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    I like to read all your posts in Chris Pratt's voice and it makes them even better.
     
    • Like Like x 1
  8. Correct Color

    Correct Color Member

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    Andy,

    I dunno. I’ve seen a lot of trolls in my day, and right off, I’d say this guy looks like one to me.

    Bob,

    Wow…

    Seven insults in three paragraphs. If I was one to be impressed by such things, I suppose I’d be impressed. However, the simple fact is that one of the central tenets by which I live my life is that in any argument in any forum, if you feel you have to resort to insults in order to get your point across, then you are losing the argument.

    Facts speak for themselves.

    Plus there’s the fact that you don’t even know me. And for any insult to have any sting what-so-ever, it is helpful if it has some grounding, some basis, in reality.

    So, for instance, lets take, “A note to pretentious microcephalics such as you and your posse [of one apparently]. I was dealing with color processing and digital imaging when you, and your parents as well, were making in their pants.”

    Well…

    I’ll just say that I wish that were truly so. Sadly, the fact is that I’ve been involved in the business of putting ink onto media since then 1970’s. And it so happens that in 1980 — as I recall — I stood in a room with some clients at Blanks Engraving in Dallas and watched the first computer laser scan ever produced in Texas. Since that was basically at the dawn of digital imaging, there isn’t any way you can have been in it longer than me.

    I’m afraid all the rest of your insults fall just as far from their intended targets, so I’m afraid their cumulative effect is not to make you look like a cutting an insightful wit, but just to make you seem buffoonish.

    Okay, so…

    Actually, no. This is the statement in dispute:

    Nice try though.

     
    • Like Like x 1
  9. Andy D

    Andy D Very Active Member

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    Damn Bob, I believe Correct Color put a "FULL GAMUT" whoop *** down on you!

    C'mon Bob, it's time to bring the big
    thesaurus out for this one!

    Also, Fred Please don't lock this thread, I know it's sad, but this is all I have to look forward too.
     
    • Like Like x 1
  10. Andy D

    Andy D Very Active Member

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    Before the bell rings for the start of the next round, I did want to point out that Bob has his moments
    of insightfulness, he said I was a "microcephalics", which I wasn't familiar with & had to Google.

    I thought I was looking at one of my Face book images when I saw this one:

    [​IMG]
     

    Attached Files:

  11. bob

    bob Major Contributor

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    Really? That was around the same time that I was an MTS at HP labs. Dealing with much the same sort of stuff, just a taste more advanced and a lot more intense.

    That notwithstanding, there is a point to all of this. It has to do with a principle laid down by William of Ockham somewhere in the 13th or 14th century. You may know it as Occam's razor, perhaps the most misquoted and misunderstood principle in all of science and philosophy. That being "Entities should not be multiplied unnecessarily.". Meaning, among other things, don't make your work, or your life, any more complicated than it has to be.

    Your way probably works just fine, as does mine. The difference being that yours is spectacularly complex where mine is a model of simplicity. Both manage to get the job done but mine leaves time for smelling roses and riding horses. Yours does not. It's much like a geo-centric versus a helio-centric explanation of the movement of the solar system and objects beyond. Either one explains it. Hell, you could declare the tip of your nose to be the center of the universe and proceed to describe all motion about that point. It's simply that with a helio-centric model the arithmetic is so much simpler. Not having to deal with retrograde motion and all of that.

    The difference being that I understand your way but you really don't seem to understand mine. You accept your various inputs as constants and expect the printer to bend to your will. Whereas I accept what can come out of the printer and adjust my input accordingly. I unscrew the light bulb by turning the bulb, you unscrew the light buld by turning the room. Either way will work but mine's simpler and, by definition [old Bill's], better.
     
  12. player

    player Major Contributor

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    So what Bob seems to be saying is your printer prints what it prints,

    Color correct is say he can improve on that and make it noticeably better...
     
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  13. Gene@mpls

    Gene@mpls Premium Subscriber

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    And that it makes more difference to some people than others.
     
  14. Brink

    Brink Member

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    The original question was:

    And your answer according to Bob's philosophy is: Print spot colors until you figure it out.

    And according to Color Correct: Create a profile that allows you to specify your color.

    The "Truth" is somewhere in between. If you you have no profile, you will need to print spot colors till you figure out which RGB or CMYK colors cause the respective colors to fire solid spots as desired. If you have a profile set for a particular media, you will have to do the same thing. It would just be a different combination for each. No one will be able to answer your question with any certainty. What makes it happen for them will not apply to you unless you are using the same rip, profile, printer and inkset that they are using.
     
  15. Brink

    Brink Member

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    I would add that this has been quite the entertaining thread though.:thumb:
     
  16. dypinc

    dypinc Very Active Member

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    No you don't. Each Media profiled correctly and the proper LAB values in the RIPs Pantone Libraries and you won't have to waste your time with such nonsense.

    For those of you that don't get it, give it up. All you do is make yourself look ridiculous with your "try to make yourself feel good arguments because can't comprehend or refuse to comprehend how simple color management really is". Figure out by screwing around with RGB or CMYK colors to try to cause the respective colors to fire color as desired, is the most ridiculous waste of time and materials I can think of, unless that is something you really enjoy. Just because that might be something you enjoy does mean others of us do or have the time to do. Then to have to do that all over again after a hardware change or every time for the next Media etc. is laughable.
     
  17. Brink

    Brink Member

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    That was still a non answer to his question. Why don't you splain it for us ridiculous looking simple folk. What are our options? Spend big bucks for color profiling solutions or "waste" 5 bucks printing spots till we find the color we need?
     
  18. dypinc

    dypinc Very Active Member

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    What question?

    If you want to go cheap, why not paint, or crayons? RIPs and Printers cost big bucks too, so why not a complete tool set?

    Why just spots? How are you going to get process RGB or CMYK colors correct?
     
  19. Brink

    Brink Member

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    This question.

    Lots of flames. Lots of passion for people in both camps. Lots of insults being hurled. No real answers. Only philosophy.
     
  20. DerbyCitySignGuy

    DerbyCitySignGuy Very Active Member

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    Well, Mike did kind of answer that question: ink breaks. If you know where your printer switches from using magenta to light magenta or cyan to light cyan, you should be able to create a file that would print pure light magenta or pure light cyan.
     
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