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Looks like it wasn't meant to be.

Dan Antonelli

New Member
It's mind boggling the hours wasted... and how
much money is in it for the host.

Hmm no stats for logos designed that commit copyright or trademark infringement. Probably very close to the number of logos designed.

Get a logo for $99. Spend thousands on the subsequent trademark infringement claim later. Have fun!

Best we can do is keep educating. I have a section in my new book that speaks on the issue and the pitfalls of crowdsourcing a brand.
 

John Butto

New Member
pitfalls in our business

Sometimes talking cannot solve a problem...
“Delusional” consensus:[FONT=Helvetica, Arial, sans-serif] Conversations are also often held in order to achieve consensus, but consensus on its own does not imply effective leadership. Humans as a group are prone to multiple illusions, distortions and psychological traps, and having a consensus about these may lead to mass delusion rather than actually effective leadership." from a professor at Harvard Business School.[/FONT]
[FONT=Helvetica, Arial, sans-serif]This is a conversation not an argument from myself and above all do not want to lead you, just a messenger. I have been in the trenches with this group who sell the artwork for cheap, not to make monies but to observe. Am I upset about it, no, it is a reality, in a more sinister way as we watched as the person had his head cut off last week. It is a mass communication at lighting speed and if you stand on the side and just talk and read about it and not physically get involved, and I mean that by bettering your talents, you will lose. No lawsuit is going to affect Raji in some remote country from a screen shot of your artwork. Just as we buy billions of dollars of Chinese products with US patents that have been tweaked, so it goes with artwork. So If you want to stay stagnet and stay in your little spot you have claimed, the tide will eventually wash your sandcastle away. Its here and it is not going away. [/FONT]
 

Joe Diaz

New Member
I'm just not sure doing spec work on one of those sites is a good way of "bettering your talents". If practicing and honing your skills is what it's all about, I can think of a bunch of ways that are better than participating on those sites. I might create a fictitious brand, something that is really challenging or something I have never done before. Let's say I want to do more beer label designs, but beer companies aren't knocking down my door, create a fake brand, practice on that. This way you aren't restricted by a client with bad taste and a dirt cheap budget. The sky is the limit, you can really challenge yourself and then you will have something amazing for you portfolio that shows people you can do that type of packaging design. This is how you develop a niche, or target the type of work you would like to have. If you have a portfolio full of nothing but 15 minute $50 designs, guess what? That's the type of work you are going to attract when people see that portfolio.

Practicing or not practicing, why just give away your ideas to a company that should value their image and branding enough to hire professionals so that those professionals can spend the needed amount of time to create something unique and that works? If a person wanted to donate their time and expertise, they should create some designs for a charity they believe in, or how about something that they can swap with other fellow designers. Anything but spec work.

Spending 15 minutes scraping something together to compete against people who are also spending a few minutes drive-by-designing, or worst, who are just out their ripping off other designers, isn't challenging IMO. You wouldn't be "bettering your talents", unless your talents are throwing something together as fast as you can. Those particular talents won't necessarily serve you well when you are working with a real client who expect well thought out and well executed final results. If those other designers were really good and challenging to compete against, they wouldn't be on those sites making pennies on the dollar, they would be to busy selling real jobs and making real money.

While some folks are wasting time "in the trenches", "observing" and at best winning 5-10% of the contests they compete in and giving away 90-95% of their time, they aren't leaning the other major part of being a designer, and that is the art of selling it. In fact, by competing on those sites, their actions are actually counterproductive to "bettering your talents" as a seller of design.

So this isn't about whether or not I can except that spec work is and will continue to be a reality. I except it, just like I except that there will most likely always be mosquitoes in my lifetime... but that doesn't mean I going to go and try to get bit by as many of them as I can, and I'm certainly not going compete on one of those sites. If we as professionals can convince just one designer that they are wasting their time on one of those sites then that's a good thing.
 

John Butto

New Member
"So this isn't about whether or not I can except that spec work is and will continue to be a reality. I except it, just like I except that their will most likely always be mosquitoes in my lifetime... but that doesn't mean I going to go and try to get bit by as many of them as I can, and I'm certainly not going compete on one of those sites. If we as professionals can convince just one designer that they are wasting their time on one of those sites than that's a good thing."

When I was young, maybe 12 or 13 years old, some of the many things that went through my mind, I just remembered two the them.

The first one was listening to the pastor give his sermons and while he was trying to get his point across I wanted to stand up and tell him that I did not agree with him on all his points. Well I am much older now and realize that sometimes it is not worth arguing or giving your opinion to someone who puts themselves up on a pedestal.

The second though was why God made mosquitoes to inflict such aggravation on humans. But like the first though as I grew older I realized that they serve a purpose in life. They are food for a
variety of species and not just a bother to us but like birds blood and other mammals before they will go to us. And I have been places on this earth that have more mosquitoes than specs of sands in the Sahara.

But to end this conversation I want to say a "good thing" happened, I have been saved, "Thank you Jesus"! not going to waste my time anymore and not go on those evil sites any more.
 
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