Mimaki CJV30 Low Quality Print Vs. Risk Of Warping ?

[jlalasvt]

They did not tell me the "FINE DETAILS" when I purchased my solvent printer around the subject of: ( If you cut on a full bleed line, The edges are going to roll and the vinyl is going to shrink and warp etc.)

Sometimes it does not even have to be a full bleed it could be .25 away from the edge and it is pulling the parameter inward... Even if I let it air dry for 24 hours. It only seems to slow the shrinking process down.

could happen over night, in a week, Could happen six months down the road when it is already on my customers,CUSTOMERS car, toolbox etc.

I have also noticed the higher the quality, The higher DPI I select, (The more saturation of ink on the substrate) The higher the risk of warping..

So basically I am limited to low quality print just out of fear that it will warp. I started out on what my sales rep recommended. Ritrama 3mil. classic 100 gloss media. I have now switched to a thicker higher quality

Oracal 3164G 4mil in hopes that the thicker and better quality media will alleviate this issue. So far it seems to be doing a little better, But only time will tell.

The ss21 inks and my tech(s) recommend setting the heaters at PRE:35 PRINT:35 POST:50 CELSIUS.

I have researched and read that this is typically only an issue with calendered vinyl? how are other companies producing solid quality products on calendered vinyl?

Am I over heating the product? How can I get prices and quality to compete with the guy offering decals for 5 cents when a roll of cast cost 3,4,500 and so on. My business is skimming by on my own lack of knowledge. I should be able to feel confident while selling and delivering my product to my customers that it is a good product.

Any suggestions and help would be great and could honestly be the deciding factor of my future endeavors.

MORAL OF THE STORY:

Is it the machine?

Is it the media?

Is it the solvent?

Is it the Ink?

Is it the operator?

Is there an affordable cast vinyl on the market?

My guess would be a combination of all thee above...

Thanks for your help if you choose to help,

-Joe

 

[31legen]

Cjv

Not sure whats causing your issues. Ive never had an issue with mine. I mainly print on oracal 3751

 

[Solventinkjet]

I have a customer who only prints and cuts on 6mil calendered vinyl for a specific project and they never have issues with curling on the edges. I have another customer who only uses 3mil calendared vinyl and has way more issues. None of my customers have issues with the cast vinyls. It seems that there is a sweet spot with the thinner calendared vinyls that has the most issues. Try turning your heat up on the pre and print platens to around 40 to help the ink dry a little faster and that should help a little. I always recommend going for thicker vinyl if you are doing decals and stickers mostly so that it prevents the curl and it's easier for your customer to apply without transfer tape. Laminating goes a long way in stabilizing the sticker as well but adds cost obviously. Take a look a the Arlon DPF4560GTX. It's a calendared vinyl with air release that is made specifically to be a cheap alternative wrap material. You can't wrap a car with it but it is good for partial coverage on mild curves and flat surfaces.

 

[DougWestwood]

mimaki

Hi There,

I have printed 3M IJ-35 on a Mimaki and haven't had this problem when applying it to vehicles.
You don't mention if you are LAMINATING the vinyl prior to install.
That would explain the shrinkage and curling.

For vehicles, I have used Avery MPI 1005EZ vinyl, very pliable and made for vehicles.
There is an accompanying laminate specifically for this task. Ask your supplier.

Good Luck!
Please post fix/results.
- Doug
Vancouver

 

[toomeycustoms]

It is the vinyl. 3164 for us will always shrink with a full bleed. You don't need to use a cast vinyl, just a better intermediate calendared vinyl. You get what you pay for. The 3164 is pretty much the cheapest printable vinyl Oracal offers. We started using 3651 instead. Why would you even want to compete with the guy offering 5 cent decals? I'm assuming your not laminating the decals either?

 

[SameDay Signs]

If your trying to save on vinyl but still use a good material have you considered Instant One Media? They also have a cast vinyl that is really good and in all honesty really cheap compared to others. Just an idea, we use it and love it here

 

[jlalasvt]

Awesome! Thanks for the input everyone. No I have not been laminating anything being that I would have to job it out. I would like to purchase a hot roll within the next year or two. I have never really had a desire to wrap vehicles due to the liability and time consumption. I am more or less trying to gear up for mass production. I typically don't do runs under 1000 pcs. mostly 5 to 20,000. It's easy and quick and less room for error. same piece of art, 1 icc profile and typically don't have to worry about banding, like when doing one off jobs.

 

[jlalasvt]

It is the vinyl. 3164 for us will always shrink with a full bleed. You don't need to use a cast vinyl, just a better intermediate calendared vinyl. You get what you pay for. The 3164 is pretty much the cheapest printable vinyl Oracal offers. We started using 3651 instead. Why would you even want to compete with the guy offering 5 cent decals? I'm assuming your not laminating the decals either?

I think you are thinking of 3641g 3mil. That is the cheapest on the Orajet line that I have seen, 3164G is about 25.00 more per roll and 4mil. Please let me know because I wont order anymore if that is the case. I use 3651 for my typical weed out/transfer vinyl and love it. How much does a roll typically run for 3651(G) ?

 

[toomeycustoms]

Nope, I was speaking of 3164. Even with no bleed, I've had the 3164 shrink noticeably. If all your customers care about is price, use the 3164. The 3651 is about $70 more a roll for 54".

 

[jlalasvt]

Nope, I was speaking of 3164. Even with no bleed, I've had the 3164 shrink noticeably. If all your customers care about is price, use the 3164. The 3651 is about $70 more a roll for 54".

OK, After I wrote that back to you, I did some research. The 3651g is only 2.5MIL. honestly to the touch I thought 3mil was thin and cheap feeling, So you're suggesting that the quality of the 2.5mil makes up for the lesser quality of the 4mil? Because logic would suggest that a thicker media would be more resilient to the etching of the solvent, Thus preventing solvent effect on the substrate. Just seems confusing. lol. Now that would make sense if the bond of the material on a molecular level on the 3651 was more dense substantially. ? Anyway I can do more research on this?

Thank you for your time btw. I have no problem paying more for better material, But I am just tired of "shooting in the dark" Per se'

 

[toomeycustoms]

I laminate so with the lam its about 4-5 mil. Without the lam, the 3651 may be too thin for a retail RTA decal. Thicker doesn't mean better material. Look at the cast vinyls, they are usually 2mil or less. Thicker just makes it easier for the customer to apply. You could also try 3165.

 

[jlalasvt]

I laminate so with the lam its about 4-5 mil. Without the lam, the 3651 may be too thin for a retail RTA decal. Thicker doesn't mean better material. Look at the cast vinyls, they are usually 2mil or less. Thicker just makes it easier for the customer to apply. You could also try 3165.

OK, Thank you, I will give it a shot.