Need suggestions on cast printed vinyl/lam

[john1]

Hey guys, I have used 3651 and concept 203 for about 2 years now and i love it. What i have noticed is since these are calendered vinyls they tend to shrink of course about 1/16" all around installed and or just on the backing paper after contour cutting.

I haven't had any issues at all other than this but this is what happens when you use calendered vinyl. I have a few deposits i'm waiting on and if all goes through I'd like to take the hit and order some cast vinyl and lam just as another reassurance that the products won't shrink like this and it's overall a better quality product. I've done really good in stocking more cast cut vinyl lately now that things have picked up this month.

I am looking at getting 3M 180C with matching laminate but i see Fellers sells the 180C in 30"x75' but doesn't sell the laminate in 30"x75'. Does anyone know a place that does?

My other option is Orajet 3951 with 293 laminate but i have had nothing but issues with the grey adhesive welding contour cuts together which is why i switched to the Concept 203 which has a clear adhesive.

I guess i could keep the cheaper vinyl in stock for bulk runs of stickers but really would like a all around vinyl that's good for anything.

Any suggestions on what to do?

 

[cdiesel]

Fellers will custom order you pretty much anything you want... and I'm sure if you ask your local sales rep they will stock a roll or two for you at your local branch. They've always done that for us.

As far as the grey adhesive being an issue.. not sure what you mean exactly??

 

[john1]

Fellers will custom order you pretty much anything you want... and I'm sure if you ask your local sales rep they will stock a roll or two for you at your local branch. They've always done that for us.

As far as the grey adhesive being an issue.. not sure what you mean exactly??

It's a known issue with grey adhesive and contour cutting. It welds back together and makes weeding impossible

I will call Fellers tomorrow and ask.

Another thing i forgot to mention, I want a gloss laminate, i see the 3M 8518 only has a 2 year durability, Why is this?

 

[toli13]

Which lam do you use with the 3651? I'm using 215 instead of the suggested 210. Costs a bit more but much less shrinking. To use the 3951/293 for stickers seems to me a bit overdressed. Also, as vinyl and lam are very thin, it may be a bit tricky to handle the stickers for your customers. I wouldn't suggest one vinyl for alle purposes.
Tilo

 

[FatCat]

I believe 8518 has a 3 year warranty because it has only been on the market a few years. I've used it a lot with no issues and I know Prowraps said he uses a bunch of it and hasn't had any problems.

It's a cast laminate from 3M - really shouldn't be any problems.

 

[MikePro]

3551RA with 290 laminate rocks my socks off. Same goes for 3M ij180cv3/8519.
just had to peel/redo a panel today that I applied 3551/290 to a few months ago (storm winds sheered the mounting screws and blew off building) and this stuff just did not want to be peeled! I bet it would have help up for over a decade, no problem.

also, my most favorite part of 3551RA is the fact that it doesn't get gooey after printing. was cut/peeling color swatches straight off the printer and the material stayed firm in my hands, whereas when I do this with other materials it feels like a warm fruit -rollup.

 

[john1]

What confuses me is the 3551RA is a calendered vinyl but yet you can still use it for wraps. Wouldn't it still do the shrinking deal being calendered?

Also, your saying you can weed the 3551RA easily when it comes to contour cut stickers? The 3651 was a nightmare for this for me.

 

[john1]

Also, called Fellers, Harbor and Beacon and nobody can get it in a short roll than 75', Might have to just order it in 150' and call it a day.

I don't see why some suppliers can supply the vinyl in 75' but not the matching lam in the same.

 

[HulkSmash]

Also, called Fellers, Harbor and Beacon and nobody can get it in a short roll than 75', Might have to just order it in 150' and call it a day.

I don't see why some suppliers can supply the vinyl in 75' but not the matching lam in the same.

the rolls come in 150,
you can't really cut it down and re roll it for the purposes of getting crap under the lam while re rolling it.

but with vinyl you can sweep it off as you load it in the lam.

 

[MikePro]

What confuses me is the 3551RA is a calendered vinyl but yet you can still use it for wraps. Wouldn't it still do the shrinking deal being calendered?

Also, your saying you can weed the 3551RA easily when it comes to contour cut stickers? The 3651 was a nightmare for this for me.

its calendered in terms of production process, but acts like a cast (and price is right in between). which is also why they recommend you use cast overlaminate for it. and no, this stuff doesn't shrink.

weeding air egress material will always be a chore, as it doesn't hold to the backing as well as standard vinyls... which is why i usually leave large portions of the negative to weed AFTER I lightly apply my graphic.

i still wouldn't use 3551RA for vehicle wraps as I'm in LOVE with 3M180Cv3, 3951RA I would, but flat/simple curve projects this stuff is ideal for. I just did a 9'x100' circular wall with 3551RA recently and it worked like a dream:

 

[john1]

Alright, Thanks for the information.

From what i am gathering i think i may end up with the 3M IJ35C-10, with a gloss over laminate.

I talked to a rep at Grimco and he was nothing but the biggest help in telling me what he would suggest and what lams would work with the 3M other than 3M overlams. He said the brite shield gloss would work fine as it's a calendered laminate but a member here told me otherwise. The reason i even thought of this is because Grimco doesn't have 30" gloss overlam in 8518 but recommended i get luster which I'm not thrilled at using since it's a dull look.

Any suggestions on using the IJ35C-10?

 

[MikePro]

IJ35 is nice stuff
id still be wary about mix/matching media/overlams, even though I do it all the time for small projects that I'm burning scrap on... if something goes wrong, you get no help from manufacturer's warranty.

 

[john1]

Would you guys recommend the 35C for signage such as aluminum signs, mdo signs, door logos etc?

Also does anyone have a up close photo of the luster lam?

 

[MikePro]

sure... if you're asking for a calendared vinyl recommendation. it is definately the best economy vinyl ive used.

personally, i stick with cast materials (and 3551RA) for everything except signs I don't expect to last more than a year. on that note, i usually don't bother laminating at that point.