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Nightmare Latex Printer

jkdbjj

jkdbjj

New Member
Hi first post here everyone, so be nice :D
We bought our L25500 in November and from the get go it has had wetting issues. Once we got the heat/dry/airflow dialed in, we are now experiencing re-wetting issues.
Print will come off perfectly dry, only to re-wet the next day (oily)
HP and our dealer who sold us the printer are perplexed.
It seems to do it on a variety of media, but specifically I am using today Feller's 8M Solvex Matte Vinyl.
It is listed as a latex material, and on a 54" roll I may print 2 - 24"x36" prints 2up. The print on the right will be dry the print on the left will stay oily, or re-oilize the next day.
So fed up at this point.
HP has actually asked if we would ship our medias (yes plural) to them so they can test it.
We are using various profiles, various passes, and airflow maxed, drying almost maxed (max is next step) and curing about 85%

For those that don't know, HP explained the following:

Cure Temp sets the stability of the ink
Dry Temp sets the stability of the carrier that is blended with the ink
Airflow disperses and aids in settle the carrier as well.

Please add more info if you have it, or correct my info.

Look forward to talking with you all.

Thanks
 
HulkSmash

HulkSmash

New Member
Welcome from Denver. I have the latex, we love it so much we're getting another. Never had any issues like you're describing. What rip are you using. Also in my opinion Solvex is junk.. try some ij35 - good stuff

good luck
 
HulkSmash

HulkSmash

New Member
Yeah he fixed it with more airflow. But it was right off the printer splotches of wet ink, not the next day - that's odd
 
JoshLoring

JoshLoring

New Member
Condensation on The latex as the core cools creates the oily. (from what I gather

Your baking it on and then leaving in a room that's much cooler than the actual print was created. Warm your room :)
 
P Wagner

P Wagner

--
jkdbjj said:
Hi first post here everyone, so be nice :D
We bought our L25500 in November and from the get go it has had wetting issues. Once we got the heat/dry/airflow dialed in, we are now experiencing re-wetting issues.
Print will come off perfectly dry, only to re-wet the next day (oily)
HP and our dealer who sold us the printer are perplexed.
It seems to do it on a variety of media, but specifically I am using today Feller's 8M Solvex Matte Vinyl.
It is listed as a latex material, and on a 54" roll I may print 2 - 24"x36" prints 2up. The print on the right will be dry the print on the left will stay oily, or re-oilize the next day.
So fed up at this point.
HP has actually asked if we would ship our medias (yes plural) to them so they can test it.
We are using various profiles, various passes, and airflow maxed, drying almost maxed (max is next step) and curing about 85%

For those that don't know, HP explained the following:

Cure Temp sets the stability of the ink
Dry Temp sets the stability of the carrier that is blended with the ink
Airflow disperses and aids in settle the carrier as well.

Please add more info if you have it, or correct my info.

Look forward to talking with you all.

Thanks
Click to expand...

What RIP are you driving the printer from?

Oily looking blacks can result from several root causes. These can include temp/ airflow settings, pass counts too low, and ink restrictions/ total ink limits too high for the media to handle. Some of the canned profiles that some RIPs ship with are using too much of the light inks, which can cause oily, or even wet prints in some cases.
 
P Wagner

P Wagner

--
Coloradosigns said:
Welcome from Denver. I have the latex, we love it so much we're getting another. Never had any issues like you're describing. What rip are you using. Also in my opinion Solvex is junk.. try some ij35 - good stuff

good luck
Click to expand...

Agree on the IJ35. Works well with latex.

Have you tried the new 3M IJ10 / 11C? In my testing, this material curls a tremendous amount after curing the ink (think potato chip), far more than any other media that I've tested on the latex printers. I am assuming that the backing paper is the cause of the curling, but 3M has not been able to explain why this media seems to exhibit curling more than other products.
 
ProColorGraphics

ProColorGraphics

New Member
Castek Resources said:
Agree on the IJ35. Works well with latex.

Have you tried the new 3M IJ10 / 11C? In my testing, this material curls a tremendous amount after curing the ink (think potato chip), far more than any other media that I've tested on the latex printers. I am assuming that the backing paper is the cause of the curling, but 3M has not been able to explain why this media seems to exhibit curling more than other products.
Click to expand...

I really like the IJ10 and IJ11. I have noticed curling after it comes out of the printer, but I roll it up loosely and within an hour or so when I get back to finishing it and unrolling it, the curl is gone.

I agree too that IJ35 is great vinyl.
 
S

Salmoneye

New Member
But why is it dry on one side and not the other? I am not familiar with this printer but can you take temp readings with an infrared temp gun on both sides of the platen when printing to see if the printer is heating the same on each side? Just an idea.
 
Bly

Bly

New Member
Increase the cure temp or increase number of passes.
If the media melts before the ink dries it is not compatible.
 
Tim Aucoin

Tim Aucoin

New Member
I'd bet my left nut that it's your media! Bring in something good (like others have suggested) and see if the problem persists. I've had my L25500 for 14 months now without issue. I run 3M IJ35 and it runs like a dream. From reading your post, you've tried every variable EXCEPT the vinyl. :rolleyes:
 
Gino

Gino

Premium Subscriber
T3 said:
Awe, come on Pat... I think it's a good bet, plus I'm sure it's possible to live with just one?? :omg2:
Click to expand...


Yeah, ya can live with one and sport the name 'Sad Sack', but the thing which life doesn't prepare you for in betting your nuts is.... you start turning into a girl.... little by little and then one day... things shrivel up and drop off. I knew a guy who had this happen to him. Got it in a diving accident. Slowly joined the other camp. True story. :rolleyes:
 
jkdbjj

jkdbjj

New Member
I didn't skip town. Took the wife too lunch!

Solvex is simply a material I use when I am doing prints that aren't going to be laminated but need mounting to foamboard etc. The 8mil help is mounting.
I do realize it is cheap grade material, but...

I am having the same issue on Arlon 4500 material, Ultraflex Felxjet material, HP Perm Gloss Vinyl material. So I just posted that Solvex is what is loaded today.

Onyx 10.1 is my current version I believe, and I use the profiles from the HP website.

I was told creating profiles for this machine is a nightmare so to try the canned ones first. I make profiles for the Mutoh I use to have, but was hoping to avoid that with this machine.

One HP tech thinks maybe it is the heating element, another tech thinks it is the profiles.
However, what I do know is I am throwing prints away and basically running a science experiment for HP at this point. Try this, do that, etc...

Today, HP has sent me a script to run from DOS prompt, it will bypass the rip, and print to HP gloss vinyl. Then if tomorrow the print is dry, that he thinks he can isolate it to a profile issue. If tomorrow the print is wet, then he wants to tackle the heating element, or maybe the parameter in Onyx that control voltage.

Wish me luck... I wish I stayed with my Mutoh :(

Thanks for the replies...
 
P Wagner

P Wagner

--
jkdbjj said:
... and on a 54" roll I may print 2 - 24"x36" prints 2up. The print on the right will be dry the print on the left will stay oily, or re-oilize the next day.
Click to expand...

This points strongly toward inconsistent temps across the width of the print area (printer issue). A media profile cannot be responsible for this.
 
jkdbjj

jkdbjj

New Member
Castek Resources said:
This points strongly toward inconsistent temps across the width of the print area (printer issue). A media profile cannot be responsible for this.
Click to expand...
True, True...
As I type this I am waiting to send the script to the printer that HP has asked me to download.
Can you believe the file they send is 800mb????? Anyway, this maneuver should isolate if it is a profile issue. Hope so anyway...
 
ProWraps

ProWraps

New Member
we have the same problem. its condensation.

the media is storing heat on the core because of the print temperature that machine requires.

as it sits, the heat causes condensation as it squeaks out of the layers of material.

ill bet 9 times out of 10 the oily part is on the outsides of the media.

i can guarantee that in summer you probably wont have the same issues.

so far *knock on wood* we havent had any failures due to it.

so yeah, you are not alone.
 
jkdbjj

jkdbjj

New Member
ProWraps said:
we have the same problem. its condensation.

the media is storing heat on the core because of the print temperature that machine requires.

as it sits, the heat causes condensation as it squeaks out of the layers of material.

ill bet 9 times out of 10 the oily part is on the outsides of the media.

i can guarantee that in summer you probably wont have the same issues.

so far *knock on wood* we havent had any failures due to it.

so yeah, you are not alone.
Click to expand...
For me it seems to be most prevalent in maroon color reds, blacks, etc... What you say makes sense, and I was asked by the techinician over the phone if I see condensation on the printer, but I said I had not at this time.

When you say no failures what do you mean? For me, if I wipe the print the next day it is so oily I can see light smearing. I then zap it with my wife's hair dryer (yes she is very understanding) and it dries for the time being, but hour or so later it is wet again...

Is that what you are experiencing?
 
HulkSmash

HulkSmash

New Member
prowraps said:
we have the same problem. Its condensation.

The media is storing heat on the core because of the print temperature that machine requires.

As it sits, the heat causes condensation as it squeaks out of the layers of material.

Ill bet 9 times out of 10 the oily part is on the outsides of the media.

I can guarantee that in summer you probably wont have the same issues.

So far *knock on wood* we havent had any failures due to it.

So yeah, you are not alone.
Click to expand...

you're welcome
 
M

moggle

New Member
Left hand side becomes oily because the power supply for the fans is on the right and as your move across left it loses power. Try partially blocking the fans over the affected area with some masking tape.

Also increasing airflow isn't the solution, if anything you should try pulling it back.

People should really get their reseller to sit them down and explain how the machine works. Maxing out the temps and airflow isn't the solution and in many cases people will say it is not compatible only because they use a canned profile with the wrong settings.

Also offset, some people have rediculous offsets like 10+ degrees, sure fire way to screw up a job.

I could go on all day....
 
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