Oce Arizona 550XT Carriage motion error - Help!

[Afroartist]

Hey, everybody!

I have a problem with OCE Arizona 550XT printer.

When printing, the carriage moves to the start position and does not have time to stop.

This causes it to hit the stopper. This is shown in the video.

On flatbet this problem is always present.

On roll the problem looks a little different...
The printer prints, but when returning to the parking lot it hits the limiter.

I have SDS key
Attached logs and video.

Please help!

 

[Select Bulgaria Service]

Hey, everybody!

I have a problem with OCE Arizona 550XT printer.

When printing, the carriage moves to the start position and does not have time to stop.

This causes it to hit the stopper. This is shown in the video.

On flatbet this problem is always present.

On roll the problem looks a little different...
The printer prints, but when returning to the parking lot it hits the limiter.

I have SDS key
Attached logs and video.

Please help!

OK. Enter in SDS and in Carriage, press Cycle carriage. Do you have same problem?
Also ...
What happens when try to init the printer(when start the printer) or init carriage from SDS?
Enter in SDS/Carriage/ Information - Move the carriage by hand(very slowly). Take short video what happens with this big digit on monitor.
Send the result there or in Canon Oce Arizona printers group in FB. In FB group you can post the video easy.
Looks like encoder reader problem, but in some cases there is different reasons.

 

[Afroartist]

OK. Enter in SDS and in Carriage, press Cycle carriage. Do you have same problem?
Also ...
What happens when try to init the printer(when start the printer) or init carriage from SDS?
Enter in SDS/Carriage/ Information - Move the carriage by hand(very slowly). Take short video what happens with this big digit on monitor.
Send the result there or in Canon Oce Arizona printers group in FB. In FB group you can post the video easy.
Looks like encoder reader problem, but in some cases there is different reasons.

Hi! Thank you for your reply.

The printer is initializing correctly. In the SDS menu I ran a cyclic carriage test (50 cycles) everything is fine.

I did the test with the carriage encoders too, the numbers change.

I also pulled out the FireWire cable and unwrapped it, didn't help either.

Yesterday I cleared the encoder ribbon and the encoder window and the status light changed to red! But even this did not prevent the printer from initializing and the printer behavior did not change at all!

Judging by the logs, the problem is in the comparison of data from the linear encoder and the carriage motor encoder. But I don't understand what to do about it!?!?

I will send a video of the encoder tests soon.

Thanks for your attention!

 

[Afroartist]

I added a group on fb but couldn't create a post there.
Uploaded the encoder test videos to youtube.

 

[Select Bulgaria Service]

Hi! Thank you for your reply.

The printer is initializing correctly. In the SDS menu I ran a cyclic carriage test (50 cycles) everything is fine.

I did the test with the carriage encoders too, the numbers change.

I also pulled out the FireWire cable and unwrapped it, didn't help either.

Yesterday I cleared the encoder ribbon and the encoder window and the status light changed to red! But even this did not prevent the printer from initializing and the printer behavior did not change at all!

Judging by the logs, the problem is in the comparison of data from the linear encoder and the carriage motor encoder. But I don't understand what to do about it!?!?

I will send a video of the encoder tests soon.

Thanks for your attention!

Thank you for this good videos! Now it is clear that you have not problems with encoders and with readers.
I do not know why you can not post in FB group. Will check.
Your problem is not something new under the sun. I had same problem in 550 few times on different printers before years.
I can not remember what was the problem in this cases.
And yes ... If in SDS you can cycle the carriage this mean that you have a problem with Fireware. In this test the heads doesn't work.
But if the cable was changed ... it is clear that the problem is not in it.
However, there are two boards at either end of the cable. Carriage Board and Data Relay Board. Both play a very important role in the machine.
The problem may be related to a broken registry file as well.
Make a copy of the registry file for sure ... !
Try to use the old registry from before when the the printer was in normal condition.
Double click on file and test please! You can find registry files in HDD of the printer I hope.
Restart the printer from power supply. Not just software. Power off, 10 sec. Power on.

P.S.
It is not impossible for this problem to be caused by a partially malfunctioning electronic head, but it is extremely rare.

If you have a head in doubt, you can also remove the cable from the print head board for a test. If the registers do not resolve the problem, you may need to turn off the heads one at a time or turn off the power to the print head board.

At least that's what I would do if everything looks fine, but ends up not working as expected.

If the head cables (the white ribbon cables) have never been replaced, do not clean them with alcohol. The blue tape at the end will fall off and this will leave the cable pins completely free like a comb.
I really hope the problem is solved with registries.

 

[Select Bulgaria Service]

I can't find you in group. What's your name there?

 

[Afroartist]

Thank you for this good videos! Now it is clear that you have not problems with encoders and with readers.
I do not know why you can not post in FB group. Will check.
Your problem is not something new under the sun. I had same problem in 550 few times on different printers before years.
I can not remember what was the problem in this cases.
And yes ... If in SDS you can cycle the carriage this mean that you have a problem with Fireware. In this test the heads doesn't work.
But if the cable was changed ... it is clear that the problem is not in it.
However, there are two boards at either end of the cable. Carriage Board and Data Relay Board. Both play a very important role in the machine.
The problem may be related to a broken registry file as well.
Make a copy of the registry file for sure ... !
Try to use the old registry from before when the the printer was in normal condition.
Double click on file and test please! You can find registry files in HDD of the printer I hope.
Restart the printer from power supply. Not just software. Power off, 10 sec. Power on.

P.S.
It is not impossible for this problem to be caused by a partially malfunctioning electronic head, but it is extremely rare.

If you have a head in doubt, you can also remove the cable from the print head board for a test. If the registers do not resolve the problem, you may need to turn off the heads one at a time or turn off the power to the print head board.

At least that's what I would do if everything looks fine, but ends up not working as expected.

If the head cables (the white ribbon cables) have never been replaced, do not clean them with alcohol. The blue tape at the end will fall off and this will leave the cable pins completely free like a comb.
I really hope the problem is solved with registries.

I have an old HDD with a known working OS. I plugged it in and the problem still persists.
There is a very unusual fact...
It turns out that the printer can work on a roll !
But when returning to the parking lot it also hits the limiter ....
I observe that the speeds and accelerations of the carriage acceleration/deceleration when working on flatbet and when working on roll are different!
The printer is always slower and smoother on the roll. It's always been that way.
But the acceleration and speed of the carriage leaving after finishing printing on roll is as sharp as on flatbet!
Hence, I have the impression that the problem is overcurrent overload when the carriage brakes.
I want to note that I have a version of the printer with a brushless carriage motor!
It turns out that there are versions of the printer with brushes.

 

[Afroartist]

I can't find you in group. What's your name there?

I just figured it out now. I didn't log in to my account, I logged in to a restricted account.
Now I've added it to my account and everything's fine.

 

[Afroartist]

I have an old HDD with a known working OS. I plugged it in and the problem still persists.
There is a very unusual fact...
It turns out that the printer can work on a roll !
But when returning to the parking lot it also hits the limiter ....
I observe that the speeds and accelerations of the carriage acceleration/deceleration when working on flatbet and when working on roll are different!
The printer is always slower and smoother on the roll. It's always been that way.
But the acceleration and speed of the carriage leaving after finishing printing on roll is as sharp as on flatbet!
Hence, I have the impression that the problem is overcurrent overload when the carriage brakes.
I want to note that I have a version of the printer with a brushless carriage motor!
It turns out that there are versions of the printer with brushes.

 

[Select Bulgaria Service]

I saw this in your carriage log.
"
Logged on 3:39:16
Current motor state = 8
State table:
2 -- ramp up
3 -- at speed
4 -- ramp down
5 -- hold
6 -- hold
7 -- direct duty
8 -- no motion error. No encoder change in spite of high duty. Cable disconnected?
9 -- following error too big or encoder fault (big jump)
Dual drive case: the difference of the two encoders too big?
10 -- PWM fault. Carriage guard tripped? Over current or voltage?
"
Can you check something? In the end of the encoder strip you must have small magnet with size like dark gray matchstick.
This magnet must work with Hall sensor in encoder reader like end stop switch. Check please! Do you have it?
Try to find how to check this stop switch from SDS/Carriage. I think that there is test.
Next step is to change the encoder reader from Gantry with encoder reader from Carriage.
Try to find what is the color of this encoder reader. Must be green in all path of the carriage.

There is an option that the reader work like reader but the Hall sensor in it doesn't work correctly.
Do you have encoder on motor? Like in 660. Take picture please. I can check and take photos in Tuesday. This is first working day here.

 

[Afroartist]

I saw this in your carriage log.
"
Logged on 3:39:16
Current motor state = 8
State table:
2 -- ramp up
3 -- at speed
4 -- ramp down
5 -- hold
6 -- hold
7 -- direct duty
8 -- no motion error. No encoder change in spite of high duty. Cable disconnected?
9 -- following error too big or encoder fault (big jump)
Dual drive case: the difference of the two encoders too big?
10 -- PWM fault. Carriage guard tripped? Over current or voltage?
"
Can you check something? In the end of the encoder strip you must have small magnet with size like dark gray matchstick.
This magnet must work with Hall sensor in encoder reader like end stop switch. Check please! Do you have it?
Try to find how to check this stop switch from SDS/Carriage. I think that there is test.
Next step is to change the encoder reader from Gantry with encoder reader from Carriage.
Try to find what is the color of this encoder reader. Must be green in all path of the carriage.

There is an option that the reader work like reader but the Hall sensor in it doesn't work correctly.
Do you have encoder on motor? Like in 660. Take picture please. I can check and take photos in Tuesday. This is first working day here.

I've seen this error once, but it was logged before the problem was even discovered. All the time since then, error 9 has been recorded.

 

[Afroartist]

I saw this in your carriage log.
"
Logged on 3:39:16
Current motor state = 8
State table:
2 -- ramp up
3 -- at speed
4 -- ramp down
5 -- hold
6 -- hold
7 -- direct duty
8 -- no motion error. No encoder change in spite of high duty. Cable disconnected?
9 -- following error too big or encoder fault (big jump)
Dual drive case: the difference of the two encoders too big?
10 -- PWM fault. Carriage guard tripped? Over current or voltage?
"
Can you check something? In the end of the encoder strip you must have small magnet with size like dark gray matchstick.
This magnet must work with Hall sensor in encoder reader like end stop switch. Check please! Do you have it?
Try to find how to check this stop switch from SDS/Carriage. I think that there is test.
Next step is to change the encoder reader from Gantry with encoder reader from Carriage.
Try to find what is the color of this encoder reader. Must be green in all path of the carriage.

There is an option that the reader work like reader but the Hall sensor in it doesn't work correctly.
Do you have encoder on motor? Like in 660. Take picture please. I can check and take photos in Tuesday. This is first working day here.

 

[Afroartist]

I saw this in your carriage log.
"
Logged on 3:39:16
Current motor state = 8
State table:
2 -- ramp up
3 -- at speed
4 -- ramp down
5 -- hold
6 -- hold
7 -- direct duty
8 -- no motion error. No encoder change in spite of high duty. Cable disconnected?
9 -- following error too big or encoder fault (big jump)
Dual drive case: the difference of the two encoders too big?
10 -- PWM fault. Carriage guard tripped? Over current or voltage?
"
Can you check something? In the end of the encoder strip you must have small magnet with size like dark gray matchstick.
This magnet must work with Hall sensor in encoder reader like end stop switch. Check please! Do you have it?
Try to find how to check this stop switch from SDS/Carriage. I think that there is test.
Next step is to change the encoder reader from Gantry with encoder reader from Carriage.
Try to find what is the color of this encoder reader. Must be green in all path of the carriage.

There is an option that the reader work like reader but the Hall sensor in it doesn't work correctly.
Do you have encoder on motor? Like in 660. Take picture please. I can check and take photos in Tuesday. This is first working day here.

The magnet is present. The test in SDS passes successfully.
Yes and the printer prints correctly on the roll!
Thanks to these magnets it passes the initialization always successfully.
As far as I know, magnets are only needed in the beginning to determine the starting point. Afterwards the printer tracks itself by the linear encoders...

 

[Select Bulgaria Service]

The magnet is present. The test in SDS passes successfully.
Yes and the printer prints correctly on the roll!
Thanks to these magnets it passes the initialization always successfully.
As far as I know, magnets are only needed in the beginning to determine the starting point. Afterwards the printer tracks itself by the linear encoders...

 

[Select Bulgaria Service]

I have never had a problem with this magnet and have not played with it. The problem is interesting, especially with the machine initializing correctly.
Did you check how the encoder under the motor works too? I've had it not work and the result is similar. There's a test for that too. Similar to the one who makes and takes pictures. Somehow we have to reject all easy-to-test possibilities.
Is this on the table the first pass?
So ....
1. The machine initializes normally and goes into Ready mode without any errors.
This almost completely rules out a problem with any encoders, readers, etc. but who knows in cases like this one.
2. The machine succeeds in printing on the RMO and dies at the end of the job when it should go home.
3. The machine dies on the first pass when the task is for a table.
4. The sensor glows green all the way through the carriage and does not flash orange or red.
5. You replaced the hard drive with an old one from when the machine was working.
Still, I would try older logs from that hard drive.
6. You changed the cable.

This will turn out to be some terrible nonsense. Do you remember how this first happened? It's going to be really stupid.
When you change the HDD, system board and data relay board copy the backup to it. On every reboot, the carriage board is reflashed.
It won't cost you anything to run an old registry file from this disk. It happens very, very quickly.

Just close the software from the SDS and look at one of the other partitions. At least to prove that this is not the problem.

 

[Select Bulgaria Service]

Can you generate logs from User interface, please! You have to copy 3 folders from PC with RIP when the page in User Interface is still open.
Maybe check the gantry board next to the motor for blown capacitors. Is the machine properly grounded? Sometimes the lack of real grounding or an overloaded phase can make you crazy. Some machine with big motors like big CNC around?
I had a case years ago with a 550XT that had its lamps dying quite randomly. I wasted a month until we found out the phase was overloaded and when a big cutter across the street turned on and the printer died. They replaced the cable and everything was fine.
Just giving you ideas. I'm not in front of the machine and it's a bit complicated.

 

[Afroartist]

Can you generate logs from User interface, please! You have to copy 3 folders from PC with RIP when the page in User Interface is still open.
Maybe check the gantry board next to the motor for blown capacitors. Is the machine properly grounded? Sometimes the lack of real grounding or an overloaded phase can make you crazy. Some machine with big motors like big CNC around?
I had a case years ago with a 550XT that had its lamps dying quite randomly. I wasted a month until we found out the phase was overloaded and when a big cutter across the street turned on and the printer died. They replaced the cable and everything was fine.
Just giving you ideas. I'm not in front of the machine and it's a bit complicated.

I'll try the registry files.
Yesterday I tried braking the carriage with my hand, as if to help brake, at each carriage edge position.
And the printer worked without error!
Most likely the problem is in the motor or in the gantry board....
I also changed capacitors on all three boards just in case - nothing changed.

 

[Select Bulgaria Service]

I'll try the registry files.
Yesterday I tried braking the carriage with my hand, as if to help brake, at each carriage edge position.
And the printer worked without error!
Most likely the problem is in the motor or in the gantry board....
I also changed capacitors on all three boards just in case - nothing changed.

Please send me the logs. This 3 folders.
It's unlikely to be the motor like motor.
Generate the three folders for me and I'll look at everything since the machine was created.
Is the carriage reader encoder green all the way on the carriage from home to end.
Such crazy problems end up being found with replacement parts. There is something that doesn't work as expected, but still works.

Look between the carriage and the beam above the lamp. You will only see light on one side of the carriage.
I see you have experience, but sometimes experience gets in the way.

 

[Afroartist]

Please send me the logs. This 3 folders.
It's unlikely to be the motor like motor.
Generate the three folders for me and I'll look at everything since the machine was created.
Is the carriage reader encoder green all the way on the carriage from home to end.
Such crazy problems end up being found with replacement parts. There is something that doesn't work as expected, but still works.

Look between the carriage and the beam above the lamp. You will only see light on one side of the carriage.
I see you have experience, but sometimes experience gets in the way.

Ok, I'll try to make a register and check the indicator all the way through the encoder.
But still, why does the roll work then? And why does hand braking work?!

 

[Select Bulgaria Service]

What do you mean by handbrake?
We need to create a diagnostic plan because otherwise we'll be going around in circles for days.
The RMO is another machine synchronized to work towards the table.
The roll part has a different control of the motors.
The two machines meet at the Data Relay Board.

I'll ask again. How and when did the machine start behaving this way?
I want you to generate the logs from the UI because I can open the database at my place and see everything that has happened to this machine since day 1.

There is some problem in the printer's operation logic. Then when the carriage is expected to stop and go back at the table it just keeps going and hits the end.
The roll part is a little different for some reason I just can't think of. So I want to look at the logs, but not what you posted here.

The direction of travel is changed by the group of power transistors located on the gantry board(Pulse with modulation), on the system board and on the small board to the left of the system board. The small one is only available at ХТ. If half the group of transistors does not work correctly, all sorts of stupid things are possible.

So I want you to run an older file from the registry. Back up this one and double click on the older file. Just for a sample. You can always return the last one if you created it. It's easy and quick.
Ask if you do not know hot to do this. It is very easy.

And so ...
Everything goes into the data relay board, but we can think of the printer as several separate machines.
I want to find out if the problem is in the management or in the executive part (PWM).
You have no problem with the movement of the beam. This group in system board work correctly.
The carriage and RMO are run by other groups.