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Okay...So I'm gonna sign a SIGN WAREHOUSE Lease

Discussion in 'Miscellaneous Plotters' started by Brands Imaging, May 28, 2009.

  1. Brands Imaging

    Brands Imaging Active Member

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    I am about to sign least for a 54" Plotter with the print/cut registration mark system..

    I have read alot about this company and I hear mostly good...anyone wanna talk me out of it?? I cant afford a graphtec right now
     
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  2. omgsideburns

    omgsideburns Very Active Member

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    why lease it? you're probably better off getting a small loan or putting it on a credit card if you cant afford 5 grand of a rebranded plotter.
     
  3. Pat Whatley

    Pat Whatley Major Contributor

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    Have you figured up how much the lease will cost you?
     
  4. Jim Doggett

    Jim Doggett Very Active Member

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    Good honorable folks; and leasing can be a good way to go if you have at least a 20% residual payoff ... then 100% of your payments are deductable.

    BTW, I was with SignWarehouse until they downsized. Still, I think they're a good bunch. What little negative feedback you might hear is a function of their huge success. They've sold over 50,000 cutters.

    Best,

    Jim
     
  5. Brands Imaging

    Brands Imaging Active Member

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    sorry, I am financing it.

    yes...an unsecured loan...double what the machine is worth. However, I "intend" to pay it off within a year or 2. I just dont have the best credit and they got me bought.. I have been through such MAJOR BS with awful cutter and these guys have a 1/2 decent rep. The bulk of my business is printing but I'd like to be able to do window stuff and some cool partial wraps
     
  6. Pat Whatley

    Pat Whatley Major Contributor

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    You've done the math and figured out that paying double is doable for you. If you're cool with the amount and the payments then you sure as heck don't need my permission.

    Just one little thing...remember that the second leading cause of small business failure (behind inadequate startup capital} is overpurchasing business "toys"

    I mention that only because I know of three local businesses that have gone under in the last couple of months because they were drowning in debt from buying "toys" that they could have held out on.

    You can call SignWarehouse's problems a function of their size if you want to. Blatant disregard for the customer, horrible communication, and a joke of a shipping department are functions of mis-management. Do a search on any sign site for SignWarehouse and see how many complaints there are compared to recommendations. Here's a nice place to start.
    http://signs101.com/forums/showthread.php?t=45473&highlight=signwarehouse
     
  7. trakers

    trakers Very Active Member

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    Our Graphtec cutter came from SW. Robert Allen was a great guy to work with, although he is gone now. ;-(

    Am wanting to buy a Mutoh 1304 and have been talking with them about that.

    Fellers offers onsite setup and training for the printer so haven't decided who to buy from just yet. Also, SW charges a shipping charge even if I pick it up at their facility???

    What's up with that?

    Good luck on your new cutter!
     
  8. Jim Doggett

    Jim Doggett Very Active Member

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    Hi Pat,

    It was before my time at SW, but I think I got the gist of it. And I don't want to defend them and stir up old feelings. Clearly, they screwed up and sent an email that wasn't thoroughly proofed and verified. The SW rep chose a minimizing noun and should have just said: Yeah; we screwed up. Gasoline is the wrong way to put out a fire.

    My point in size being a function of more negative comments is based on simple numerics: You send out 500 orders a day, on average, running 7 days a week ... and even if you only screw up 1/2 of one percent of the time, that's 912.5 screw-ups on a non-leap-year. Then if only 1 in 10 screw-ups result in an angry customer, SW has 91 and one-quarter pissed-off customers per year.

    Everyone screws up. Folks who do more business transactions have more screw ups. Walmart is probably sued 90 times, per day ... excluding weekends and holidays. But I still shop at and like Walmart.

    SignWarehouse screws up too, and no doubt at times, royally. But I still think they're a good company.

    IMHO,

    Jim
     
  9. Brands Imaging

    Brands Imaging Active Member

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    Pat, i value your opinon and did chck out that thread, however from what i read (the first 2 pages) all of that huff and puff was about communication with supples/product.. not equipment. I purchase ALL of my vinyl from fellers and all my substrates and electrical from N Glantz so I dont plan of purchasing anything from them BUT this machine... so I suppose I should have just narrowed this down to thier equipment...not thier customer service, or vinyl or ship times...

    what do you think? or do you just dislike sign warehouse?

    also, about the "toys" and stuff...this is far from a toy, I get requests all the time to do windows, doors and partial wraps/lettering job for vehicles..and every time i do I have to p/u vinyl, drive to a friends shop 20min away and wait for it to be cut while i sit there and chit chat...I'm wasting time. I just hired a few sales people and really think I'll have this thing paid off in a year.
     
  10. Brands Imaging

    Brands Imaging Active Member

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    Thanks Jim...but once again...i dont care if the folks at sign ware house litter or have road roage... I just need to know if this cutter is gonna last me 5 years...
     
  11. Jim Doggett

    Jim Doggett Very Active Member

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    Yeah; it's a Graphtec. They last way longer. But individual results may vary :^)

    Kidding, sort of. I can say with the same certainty that the cutter will outlast your expectations as I can that a lottery ticket won't meet your expecations. There are exceptions to every rule.

    Best,

    Jim
     
  12. Pat Whatley

    Pat Whatley Major Contributor

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    The plotter will probably last you 20 years. I just have a personal problem with Sign Warehouse.
     
  13. DRamm76

    DRamm76 Member

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    I've been around the industry long enough to know that Sign Warehouse like any other dealer on this earth..present company included have their good points and bad. I've been a customer and a seller of this equipment for over 10 years.

    One thing that frequently fell in my lap was support and service with Sign Warehouse. I would give a customer a price, they would call them..get a "great deal" and then when they needed help it was MY phone they were ringing because they couldn't get anyone on the line..Now yes this could have been due to the downsizing issues..I am 100% that for every 10 people that have issues with Sign Warehouse there's 10 more that don't.

    My complaint is how customers think they can come back to ME for the support when they didnt buy it from me?!?! Am I wrong in this? "Hi..I am going to buy based on price..but not from you..but when i need help will you still help me and I'll take up your entire day by not allowing you to get to your paying customers so you can help me" LOL

    In closing, no matter WHAT company you buy from. If you believe in that company and if you believe that company will stand behind you and support you no matter what..then you're on solid ground. Good luck
     
  14. JBarraxSW

    JBarraxSW Member

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    Since I'm the official SignWarehouse representative here my response may be seen as less objective: and of course it is. So I'll just give you all a few facts to consider (some of which Jim has already alluded to).

    • SignWarehouse maintains one of largest tech support staff at the reseller level in this industry.
    • They are all well trained and certified by our manufacturers so you get good quality support for your equipment.
    • We receive about 500 live calls per week for tech support. At the conclusion of each ticket, the customer is sent a survey asking for feedback on the quality of their experience.
    • Over 90% of those customers report that they are either satisfied or very satisfied.

    Bottom line, our guys and gals do an excellent job at supporting a LOT of equipment customers.

    So mmgsport, although we don't do everything perfectly (and some people get really upset and decide to bash us when we drop the ball), we do provide both good equipment and good service for the vast majority of our customers. We support a whole lot of people in this industry.

    As to whether you should lease or use a bank, you should consult with your financial advisor. Each has advantages and disadvantages. There are tax advantages to leasing that don't apply to bank loans, but bank loans tend to have lower interest rates. Someone who has detailed knowledge of your financials should be able to tell you whether you qualify for the tax break and give you more specific dollars and sense direction.
     
  15. nesscoben

    nesscoben New Member

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    If they didnt buy it from you, I assume tech support comes with a cost!

    I couldnt agree with you more. It seems we are pushing the "Buy Local" theme today! When I get a quote, and they ask how much tech support is, my reply is "priceless". You arent just buying the product its also the support with it.
    No offense, I'm not going to use a contractor to shingle my roof 100 miles away for a small savings. If something goes wrong, my hands need to be close to his neck. :thumb:
     
  16. jiarby

    jiarby Major Contributor

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    I dont know anything about Sign WArehouse, but I would advise anyone to shop their leasing deal to 2 or 3 places to ensure you are getting the best terms and also have your accountant look at it before signing it.
     
  17. saktrnch

    saktrnch Member

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    What progrags are you designing in?
    From SW Sale people- We actually get the Q series cutter from Graphtec they have the ARMS(Automatic Registration Mark Sensor) for contour cutting, 50 ft. true tracking most of the specs are the same except it doesn't come with a catch basket. It runs w/ LXI or FLEXI software directly.
    The Graphtec has the same specs I mentioned here except it comes with a catch basket and has plug ins for correll draw and adobe illustrator.

    The Graphtec only cost $700 more

    Got my Mutoh from Fellers with their setup package. Couldn't imagine doing it any other way now. Also can't say enough good things about Fellers follow up and support. I was having some problems with my cutter, sent the file to Fellers and they printed, cut and sent the job for me. All at no charge.
     
  18. luggnut

    luggnut Very Active Member

    i bought a SW print and cut package... a few problems with my original salesperson, but after that all has been good. except i had to send my cutter back on my dime 2 times (maybe should have bought local) its running great now. my printer has not had any issues except the known ones with the heaters.
    when i needed tech support my experience was good, the Tech (Ron) called me to assists repeatedly until my problems were fixed, above and beyond my expectations.
    i would buy from them again... but i already had a good working knowledge of the equipment and programs from working in other sign shops, so i didn't need much hand holding.
     
  19. CES020

    CES020 Very Active Member

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    Wow, we must have two totally different definitions of running good and no problems. My definition is that when I buy it, it works, not I buy it, it doesn't work right and I have to send it back twice on my dime, and then a printer with a heater problem.

    I don't know anything about your business, but I can't afford to have my machine not available for weeks at a time because it's in transit.

    If you buy it from out of state, how much business do you think they will send you? Zero? If you buy it local, and create a good relationship with your local guys, then there's a good chance when they run across something you can help them with, they will call you. Shut them out by buying on the cheapest price and you'll have zero chance of them ever helping you with work.

    Pay me now or pay me later.
     
  20. Mikeifg

    Mikeifg Active Member

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    Has anyone ever really paid one of those things off in 1-2yrs. I'm currious to hear how you've done it. I'm still paying on mine.
     
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