Onyx and L360 Cut Contour issues

[dan1942]

Ok I have been having lots of issues with misalignment of my cut contour lines when using Onyx Thrive. The misalignment is different from job to job sometimes its off to one side sometimes it's high etc. So I was thinking it was heat issues so I dropped my heat down to 190 and slowed down to 16pass but still the same problems. I then started using WinPlot and the cuts have been pretty much perfect. My issue now is WinPlot adds a lot of extra time in my production and I would really like to use the Onyx Cutserver. Is there a way to fix this ? I heard that this might be a known problem with Onyx and Caldera does not have this problem??

THanks as always for any help!
Dan

 

[ProColorGraphics]

What cutter are you using?

I use Caldera and Summa and haven't really had any issues. Other than user error.

 

[dan1942]

Sorry should have put that in there. I am using a Summa S2 T 160 and printing and cutting on 54" media.

 

[ProColorGraphics]

Have you done a OPOS alignment lately?

 

[AF]

It is an Onyx-specific issue. It may be limited to Thrive. It may have been patched in a recent update, so start there.

If user error is to blame, describe the material you are using. Some materials are heavy and slippery so you need to slow down the feed rate on the Summa in the service menu. Call Summa tech support for how to do this.

Colorgate and Caldera have no problems out of the box with proper registration. Using the barcode function and setting the Summa to "Force OPOS XY" is the closest thing to a guarantee that your cuts will be perfect. I have no experience with OPOS CAM so the process may not work with that setup.

 

[dan1942]

Thanks for the replys. I will check to see if there is a newer patch for Onyx. I am using the barcode registration marks in onyx and I do have it set up with the force Opos XY. I am using Avery 2921 Matte 3.4 mil. I will check the feed rate next.
Thanks!

 

[ProColorGraphics]

I have noticed that some cheap materials slip in the cutter. Like the 3M IJ10. I couldn't get that stuff to cut right to save my life.

 

[Bly]

We gave up on Cutserver and it's mysterious errors.

Now we just use Winplot with our Summa cutter and never have an error.

File setup does take a little extra - but how much longer does it take to add a Cut layer while you're already in Illy setting up your cut paths?

 

[dan1942]

I guess the issue with time with winplot is I have about 200 different designs that I continually print that I pull from a file and put in a print file for printing so every time I have to reassign the cutlines to a cut layer on the new file (I am using Corel) sometimes I have to put about 2000 cutlines on a new layer.

 

[Hotspur]

Hi

I have both Caldera and Onyx and there is no difference between the two or known accuracy issues in the current version although v10 had some issues a while ago - they both drive the cutter in the same way so any differences are usually down to your settings.

Accuracy with Latex is challenging - your best hope is as already mentioned to use OPOS XY in the rip settings - a black line will be printed at the front of the print that the Summa will read along to take into account any bowing.

In addition to this, media can slip - but depending on how your settings are applied this can be better or worse.

Eg If you select paneling on the cutter, the size of the media movement is minimized which will minimize slipping etc but it slows cutting down.

Thus it is probably a red herring to investigate a rip bug is causing issues - it is the media on the cutter and the settings utilized that are usually both the cause and the solution.

 

[AF]

Onyx Thrive 11 with the HP driver and Summa barcode had a bug that was supposedly corrected 3Q 2014. If the OP has not updated his product, he could very well be running a buggy version. I spent over a month working with Onyx to resolve the bug but switched to Colorgate because I could not wait months for the fix to be implemented. All the RIPs get the job done but some fit particular workflows better than others. In speaking with the local HP tech the other day, he mentioned that Onyx is by far the most common RIP used with the latex printers. After switching to Colorgate, I have come to appreciate the product and the company behind it more and more and highly recommend people to get a demo if in the market for a new rip.

 

[dan1942]

Thanks guys! I just downloaded the Thrive Patch from the Onyx site I have only installed the Onyx RIP a few months ago December so I am thinking it is pretty up to date but maybe not. Also I did not see a date on their patch release.
Media slippage seems to be an issue I had with some of the cheap material specifically Instant on Media it seemed that the summa pinch rollers were actually wearing down the backing paper even after adjusting pressure. that issue went away with both the avery and 3m material. I will also try turning on the paneling option as there may still be some slipping just enough to cause the contour to be off. I also timed contour cutting from Onyx and Winplot Onyx is almost twice as fast so that may be causing some slippage as well.
I will go to the shop today and try some of these fixes.

Also on another note I just want to thank everyone on here that has helped me with all the issues I had getting my first Latex printer up and going. It was specifically the members on here that gave me the most useful advice and help. I never thought I would have had such a learning curve coming from 12 years of solvent printer experience to a latex printer!

 

[SignMeUpGraphics]

I have noticed that some cheap materials slip in the cutter. Like the 3M IJ10. I couldn't get that stuff to cut right to save my life.

Tell me about it... I did troubleshooting for ages before realising IJ10 is a pile of crap for print & cut.
No other media has ever given us so many headaches with cutting after print.
3M have discontinued it apparently, and I can understand why.

 

[AF]

Tell me about it... I did troubleshooting for ages before realising IJ10 is a pile of crap for print & cut.
No other media has ever given us so many headaches with cutting after print.
3M have discontinued it apparently, and I can understand why.

Have you or anyone else on here found a reliable inexpensive air release vinyl that actually works with the latex pribter and can be cut on the Summa? I gave up up on the cheap stuff for all the reasons in this thread.

 

[ProColorGraphics]

Tell me about it... I did troubleshooting for ages before realising IJ10 is a pile of crap for print & cut.
No other media has ever given us so many headaches with cutting after print.
3M have discontinued it apparently, and I can understand why.

I wonder if they repackaged someone else's import? The 2 times I tried it, it had "made in China" printed on the box. Haha

 

[ProColorGraphics]

I think it could be a cheap media issue too. I have some decals I do that have to be done as cheap as possible. I found the alignment is best on a 30" or 38" wide roll with the cheap Kapco media. If I go the 54", it slips and the cuts are off. These are 1.5" by 36" decals, so the media moves back and forth A LOT! But, if I used a 54" roll of IJ35C, they cut out just fine. *I'm also not saying that it couldn't be an Onyx issue, I don't know as I use Caldera.

Cheap vinyl have cheap backing paper which doesn't like the heat.