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Orange peel?

Discussion in 'General Signmaking Topics' started by Sven, Apr 21, 2011.

  1. Sven

    Sven Member

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    Apr 1, 2011
    NE NJ
    Does anyone have a problem with an orange peel paint texture? A lot of times, I paint MDO and apply vinyl to it, but the vinyl does not stick well to the orange peel texture. I'm not setup for a sprayer, so I really need to get a smooth finish somehow with a roller. I’m using Benjamin Moore Impervex Latex High Gloss Enamel and a high quality roller sleeve. Any suggestions?
     
  2. SignosaurusRex

    SignosaurusRex Major Contributor

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    Use a foam roller and add Floetrol® to the latex paint. You'll develop over time a knack for getting a decent finish. IMHO.....You should be using a "Bulletin" or "Background" Enamel.
     
  3. Ned

    Ned New Member

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    Sven--Have you tried "floating" your finish? I use oil based enamel, MDO on level surface, roll good full coat of paint with a foam roller then insert a dry wall screw in a hole that I've pre-drilled in the end of the plastic roll.
    This screw sticks out far enough to contact the roller frame and prevents the roller from rolling. Using a real light touch drag the roller (not rolling) over the surface--Presto--dries to a spray-like finish.
     
  4. Sven

    Sven Member

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    I will definitely try the Floetrol and would like to try the "Bulletin"(Ronan?) color if it is water based. I know oil based paint usually gives better results, but I just want to avoid the fumes as much as possible. I was using foam rollers until recently. I tried a high quality roller sleeve, and it seemed to give a better finish but still problematic.

    The "Floating" sounds interesting too. Seems like it would take some practice to get it right.
     
  5. SignosaurusRex

    SignosaurusRex Major Contributor

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    "Floetrol" is for Latex paints, "Penetrol" for oils.
    One of the keys to rolling a proper finish is to only apply enough paint to cover the material. If a second coat is needed....so be it. To many try to get a desired finish in one coat which is possible most of the time with proper technique, but not by applying too much paint in one coat and figuring that the paint will flow out on its own. Multiple thin (covering) coats will dry much faster and produce a much nicer finish to work with.
     
  6. klemgraphics

    klemgraphics Active Member

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    Get a respirator to avoid the fumes and try a bulletin oil base, i bet your results will be much better.
     
  7. Fitch

    Fitch Member

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    The reason the orange peel is happening is because the top is drying faster than what is underneath, You are basically putting too much paint on. Thin it out, leave for a good 24 hrs, reapply a thin coat, leave 24 hrs, then do a final heavier but not too heavy coat. "Many light coats" will never get you in to trouble. If you need to slightly thin the first two coats, then so be it - turpentine or such. You could also add some Terebine dryers. This will help dry / harden immensely.

    Allow a good 24 hrs to apply vunyl and that sucker ain't ever gonna fail.

    Cheers - G
     
  8. Ned

    Ned New Member

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    Let me elaborate--I don't use a primer on MDO. Start with bulletin color thinned about 60% - 40%. It'll soak in and be nearly invisible. Continue coating with increasling heavier paint, observing proper drying times and scuffing between coats. The final coat (described ealier) is floated on.

    Good luck
     
  9. ionsigns

    ionsigns Member

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    I heard an old timers trick to [while OIL BASED final coat is wet] spray on a light coat of mineral spirits.

    Drys to an almost automotive quality finish - if the quality of the substrate and base coats are smooooth.

    Anyone heard this?

    Good wiki reference: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mineral_spirits
     
  10. Jillbeans

    Jillbeans Major Contributor

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    I don't use latex paint for backgrounds anymore, I do use the bulletin stuff from Ronan mainly.
    The tip about mineral spirits is not something I would try (with oil based paint) I don't use MS, as it makes oil based paints have a dull finish. I only use turpentine.
    Talk about fumes...
    :)
    But if using latex, I think Floetrol would be a big help.
    Love....Jill
     
  11. sardocs

    sardocs Active Member

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    pender harbour bc
    +1 for using the screw in the roller trick. We have been doing that for 15 years. I get people asking if we sprayed the background all the time. We use General Paint Marine Enamel over their Fast-Dry Plastic Primer almost exclusively for coating out mdo.
     
  12. J Hill Designs

    J Hill Designs Major Contributor

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    I just say textured finish - no extra charge!!
     
  13. Gino

    Gino Premium Subscriber

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    It's pretty hard to get 'Orange Peel' in latex. So, as mentioned several times... you need to cut back on how much paint you're putting down per coat.

    I would highly advise a prime coat and then two or three very thin top coats. When rolling, you almost want to put enough pressure on the roller as if you're trying to go through your substrate. This will spread your paint much further. Not enough pressure will result in putting more and more paint down to get the entire thing covered, but then your paint surface will dry to the touch, but not the actual paint underneath, forming a wrinklie appearance.

    If you don't like the fumes, then stop painting altogether and stay with pre-painted surfaces and vinyl. However, if you're a home-based set up, you need to be careful what fumes you are putting into your breathing air for all the other in the house. If you have young ones, these fumes could be dangerous to their little lungs.

    Like anything else, you just don't start doing something and find out the problems afterward.... you must do your homework ahead of time to prevent these situations.
     
  14. TyrantDesigner

    TyrantDesigner Art! Hot and fresh.

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    I do that with my oil paintings when I use enamels. Has to mist on though and must be flat otherwise you will have some running as it does it's thing. ... found that xylenol or xylene (same thing diff name) gets similar results with less issues.
     
  15. mrchips

    mrchips Member

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    If the orange peal isn't the problem but the vinyl sticking to the textured surface is, then this might help.

    I WANT a textured surface. To get the vinyl to conform, I heat the surface of the sign with an overhead quartz heater to about 110 degrees. Lay the vinyl on it and scrub it hard wih a natural hair floor brush.

    1st pic....textured surface

    2nd pic...quartz heater

    3rd pic...vinyl before "scrubbing"

    4th pic...scrubbing

    5th...vinyl conforming nicely.

    I would "scrub" it with the transfer tape still on.

    I got the idea from the rivit brush.

    Maybe this will help.

    Joe,

    Makin Chip$ and Havin Fun!
     

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  16. John Butto

    John Butto Very Active Member

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    clove oil

    A few drops of clove oil in the turps helps with the smell.
     
  17. Sven

    Sven Member

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    NE NJ
    I get used to the smell. It's the brain damage and cancer I'm worried about.
     
  18. Gino

    Gino Premium Subscriber

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    Don't worry about things you can't see or feel.... they don't exist. There are some people here who can explain that to you, but in the NHB.......:ROFLMAO:
     
  19. omgsideburns

    omgsideburns Very Active Member

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    +1 floetrol.. painted my new bathroom vanitys with a brush and it came out looking sprayed on.
     
  20. ionsigns

    ionsigns Member

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    re: Jillbeans...Ronan. YOU ROCK! The quick buck...sucks. Using Ronan / 1 Shot / Spraylat is a clear sign of a professional whose products LAST! I see dufus' who use latex on MDO and FAIL! Same as CROOKS!. Prime MDO with Blockout White. Coat with Bulletin color and the CUSTOMER WINS! The sign artist wins. I have a 16 year-old sign never touched that is still selling with oil based primer, top coat and oil-based art sprayed it GERBER MASK! Oil-based LEAD BASED paint... Outdoor...who is gonna eat it? Thanks OSHA. et al.
     
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