Permits for sign installation

[J Hill Designs]

Damn You guys have high fees. This must going thru an architectural board

haha in my city, normal sign permits are ~$700 -- 'special use', 'variance', etc cost minimum $3500

 

[AznSensation]

Haha in my city. The sign will take 7 months to get approved.

 

[visual800]

Gino, what in the h@ll is wrong with you? are you telling me if a customer calls you to get a name on a door in vinyl you pull a freaking permit? are you serious?

also pulling a permit does NOT release you from anything. As I said when you get permits here you carry a detailed drawing down, pay the cost and your done.....ITS A FREAKIN RACKET! its nothing but another bs way to get revenue. They dont ask for insurance, workers comp papers or anything.

lets disect what you posted

1. by getting a permit that proves you can do the work? really?
2. I have no freaking idea wtf you are saying here. please explain
3. They dont check my insurance so they have no idea
4. This makes no sense, why would someone sue the city if a Subway sign fell
5. again, wtf are you talking about
6. on this one I am never asked for ID, and what does it matter WHO pulls a permit?

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1. To be sure you can do the work and do it properly, safely and according to code.
2. To be sure your work does not violate anyone else's rights on the same street or district.
3. To be sure you have adequate insurance.
4. To be sure if no one has proper insurance and a sign falls on someone, the municipality will not be sued by sue happy people.
5. To be sure, you are not taking advantage of some end-user.
6. To be sure, you are who/what you say you are.

 

[Andy D]

haha in my city, normal sign permits are ~$700 -- 'special use', 'variance', etc cost minimum $3500

Holy cr@p! I think the sign permits here are $65.

 

[Bretbyron]

Even sandwich boards, banners and window graphics need to be approved in our little town of pop. 4,000. Window graphics or signs need to be 9" or more away from the inside of the window to not need approval.

 

[CanuckSigns]

Ya think ?? How do you get blood from a stone ?? What if he/she has nothing ?? The lawyers will have a field day suing everyone remotely possibly connected and at the bottom, the municipality will be the final straw should no one else pony up, especially if there is no permit. Around here, the various boroughs, townships cities and whatever have people on staff to do basically one thing..... enforce codes. The town across the bridge from us has two people who go out each and every day taking pictures of everything taking place from signs going up or down to additions, car ports, fences..... you name it, they have it on file. Now, get a load of this. If when someone does become honest and takes out a permit for something and what is already there does not meet code, you must immediately bring it up to code before moving forward. Not knowing the rules, codes or policies is no excuse for disobeying the law.

I ran into that one about a year ago. The guy bought 2 buildings next to each other and rented the one out. The tenants wanted t replace all the signs, awnings and other stuff around the property. Seems when we applied, some of the signs did not show up on their radar and were denied, even though they were there before the recent codes had been in effect. The sign was there for over 35 years. They had to pay to take them down, before they were granted permits for the other signs. The one's being removed were by far the largest of the signs. It had a lotta impact on their visual from the road.

You hafta have permits to letter a front window or door in most places around here. Does everyone get them ?? I dunno. I let the owners get them, show me the proof of having them and then I proceed. I do however, put in my invoice that the permits were obtained by others, meaning the owners. It also shows up on our quote that our prices do not reflect obtaining any permits. So, we have 2 pieces of a paper trail stating they were told to get them.

Now, on the other hand, most of these permits are a nuisance. I agree wholeheartedly. My beef is with telling people to purposely disobey the law on such a forum which is supposed to help people..... not put them in the slammer. So what, if some other guy doesn't do it. That means you haftas follow suit ?? Hardly. Listen to the d flemings and jean shimps and the others saying the same thing. That is the decent advice taking place.

It's rules and laws like this that cause issues in the first place! If I open a new business and I know that the city is going to require me to bring every single existing element up to current code when I apply for a permit, that is a huge incentive to not get a permit! I'm not saying I'm against permits, but I'm against local government using permits as an excuse to bleed their local businesses dry.

Around here, sign permits are handled by the building department, the last 3 times I've attempted to get a permit, I was bounced around from person to person for weeks because no one in the department knew who handled sign permits, I had money and drawing in hand and they couldn't figure out who's job it was to take my money, you can take a wild stab at how many people get permits around here.

 

[Gino]

I agree watson.

Now, for the nonbelievers, let's throw this out there.........

You have a sign to hang from a metal yard arm. 2 sided 30" x 42". No electric, but it has 2 spots on it. The customer wants it right by the front door at about 6 feet off the ground. You made a design and got a deposit of $350. Do you get a permit ?? Oh, it's 2 doors down from City Hall on the corner with 4 way stop sign intersection.

 

[Gino]

:Oops: double post

 

[signage]

Around here when you apply for a permit one of the first things they want to see is a copy of you r insurance rider

Also I do not believe they can make you take down something that was done before you bought the building and had passed older codes! It is called grandfathered!

 

[Gino]

Around here when you apply for a permit one of the first things they want to see is a copy of you r insurance rider

Also I do not believe they can make you take down something that was done before you bought the building and had passed older codes! It is called grandfathered!

Sorry to inform you signage, but you are dead balls wrong. Grandfathered is exactly what we went back with for reasoning. It was flatly denied. Kindly, but forceably, so. The sign had to be removed..... and was by the owner and a new one was not allowed, at least not at the same size. It went from a 72" × 120" to a 36" × 48".

Our insurance and liability policy are registered with a dozen or more areas in out county. We renew them each and every year, same as with PA 800 DIG. When the customer applies for the permit, we are already on file and that step is omitted. Many of the surrounding municipalities know us and work with us. There is no problem getting a permit, not for anyone, unless you don't have the proper credentials.

Many signs are grandfathered in, but not the one I mentioned, whcih is why I brought it up. Things can change..... and if you aren't up on the latest codes in any particular area, you're up that famous creek without a paddle. You should, but perhaps you don't know, ya can't fight City Hall.

It's just all around bad advice for you guys/gals to be telling people not to get permits because someone else doesn't........ or its too inconvenient or something is grandfathered in. In almost all cases, ya need to apply. Let the authorities tell you it doesn't need a permit. Don't be talking out your wazoo about sh!t you aren't knowledgeable on.

 

[Moze]

I agree watson.

Now, for the nonbelievers, let's throw this out there.........

You have a sign to hang from a metal yard arm. 2 sided 30" x 42". No electric, but it has 2 spots on it. The customer wants it right by the front door at about 6 feet off the ground. You made a design and got a deposit of $350. Do you get a permit ?? Oh, it's 2 doors down from City Hall on the corner with 4 way stop sign intersection.

I wouldn't agree to hang it in the first place nor would the city (if they're on top of their game) issue the permit for that sign.

 

[signage]

Sorry to inform you Gino I have done work for 2 customers down here that the local code tried the "remove" and were over turned when proof of old code showed they were allowed! Still didn't have any signed paper work from previous owner/business!

Now if they were bigger than ever allowed I would agree!

 

[Gino]

Sorry to inform you Gino I have done work for 2 customers down here that the local code tried the "remove" and were over turned when proof of old code showed they were allowed! Still didn't have any signed paper work from previous owner/business!

Now if they were bigger than ever allowed I would agree!

Again, it doesnt matter if you agree or not, but what the codes people will do. Might've worked in your area. I never did anything out there. Your codes could be completely different. I was speaking of the places where we do work. Seemed like you were saying you didn't believe me.

This is the whole point of this entire thread. The rules, regulations or codes can vary from township to township, let alone on the other side of the state or a completely different state. This is why it is wrong to tell someome to just ignore the rules/codes. Most of these people are shooting from the hip, which is is bad policy for any business. The OP came here looking for help and got a lotta wives tales and bullsh!t mixed in. He needs to know the laws in his area and once he/she has it figured out, they can decide if they wanna skirt the laws or not. Each situation will be different, but the ultimate decision will be on each and every person.

 

[signage]

Gino you are the one that stated I was "dead balls wrong"! I still believe you just like to see yourself post weather the information is correct or not!

In your area who signs these permits "building code enforcement"?

If what you are saying is true I guess a lot of businesses in your area are always changing signs too keep up with the current codes!

 

[Gino]

Gino you are the one that stated I was "dead balls wrong"! I still believe you just like to see yourself post weather the information is correct or not!

In your area who signs these permits "building code enforcement"?

If what you are saying is true I guess a lot of businesses in your area are always changing signs too keep up with the current codes!

You're completely.... dead balls wrong in referral to what I was talking about. You introduced some information, which had nothing to do with my post, but you formed a wrong opinion/decision based on your area..... not mine. You were/are still 100% wrong.

So, you're just posting to prove me wrong, huh ?? Your post has nothing to do with trying to help this OP or any future posters or viewers. Real nice guy

According to what township, borough or municipality you work is to be performed determines who signs off on permits. Can't believe with your accusations, that you wouldn't know your own dumb question.

So, where'd you get the idea someone has to change signs all the time ?? To make this easy for you.... when a sign gets changed like a new business, new tenants, new signs added or some other reason.... you hafta meet codes. It just pays to know the codes wherever you are doing work, so you don't do something to get you in trouble.

 

[visual800]

Our city will allow either the property owner or sign contractor to obtain a sign permit for an exterior sign. I have done a number of jobs both ways, just depends on the customer (some like to save money by obtaining the permits themselves). My question is, what happens if my customer tells me they have the permit, but don't actually. Can I be liable for costs of removing or moving the sign? I have a case where the permit costs will be rather high due to a "special use" permit needed. The customer is complaining about the cost of the permit. I'm nervous he will tell me he has a permit just so I get the job done.

let me back up to original post and answer as I should. Where I live IF the customer told me they had the permit, I would take their word they did and go ahead with job. In this town they do not fine or scold you if you are caught.

being that they really dont care other than to get money, I dont bother with getting permits on insignificant jobs. I am NOT telling others to do what I do. In my opinion im not breaking a law Im just avoiding BS.

I hope I cleared all that up