Phototex alternative for curved surface?

[peazley]

This may be a little different request, but there are not many places to ask the question.

We have project using a dome that needs labels attached. Currently using an Aqueous printer (Epson Surecolor P600), hoping to find something that works with that.

The major problem is that a normal paper doesn't conform to the curved surface. We tried a handful of adhesive backed vinyls, more of the craft variety that worked with our printer, but those didn't seem to work. So we looked into adhesive backed polyesters. So far we have only tried Phototex and LexJet Print-N-Stick, mainly due to costs, we can't justify hundreds of dollars in rolls we may never end up using.

The Phototex shapes perfectly, we really like it. The problem is that the image tends to look washed out and fine details/text look blurry. The LexJet Print-N-Stick looks beautiful and prints perfectly, but has the issues with shaping, and tends to buckle/wrinkle on the edges, instead of laying flat on the curved surface.

I've had a chance to read through many of the posts regarding Phototex, but I think most have the opposite issue and would rather have something that does not stretch.

Does anyone have some thought or guidance for a product that prints sharp detailed images on a curved surface? Preferably Aqueous compatible.

 

[AKwrapguy]

This may be a little different request, but there are not many places to ask the question.

We have project using a dome that needs labels attached. Currently using an Aqueous printer (Epson Surecolor P600), hoping to find something that works with that.

The major problem is that a normal paper doesn't conform to the curved surface. We tried a handful of adhesive backed vinyls, more of the craft variety that worked with our printer, but those didn't seem to work. So we looked into adhesive backed polyesters. So far we have only tried Phototex and LexJet Print-N-Stick, mainly due to costs, we can't justify hundreds of dollars in rolls we may never end up using.

The Phototex shapes perfectly, we really like it. The problem is that the image tends to look washed out and fine details/text look blurry. The LexJet Print-N-Stick looks beautiful and prints perfectly, but has the issues with shaping, and tends to buckle/wrinkle on the edges, instead of laying flat on the curved surface.

I've had a chance to read through many of the posts regarding Phototex, but I think most have the opposite issue and would rather have something that does not stretch.

Does anyone have some thought or guidance for a product that prints sharp detailed images on a curved surface? Preferably Aqueous compatible.

Not sure, is IJ180 suitable for the job or your printer?

 

[peazley]

We don't have a compatible printer, ours is aqueous with pigment inks. I don't know enough about Controltac. How much does it stretch? Due to shape of the final design, multiple prints will need to align around the dome.

 

[AKwrapguy]

We don't have a compatible printer, ours is aqueous with pigment inks. I don't know enough about Controltac. How much does it stretch? Due to shape of the final design, multiple prints will need to align around the dome.

IJ180 will both stretch and shrink to fit. It's made for contour curves.

 

[TSC1985]

I would probably wholesale the print, Sign365 or others all use Ij-180 and comparable laminates. Depending on the size/curvature you could align the panels in house, keeping backing paper on all but the overlaps, then apply as one large piece, that would help to keep registration accurate.

 

[peazley]

Ah, ok. This is pretty new to us. I think I might be on the wrong track. I was trying to generalize the issue we were having. Let me be a little more specific.

We are trying to build world map globes. Problem being that current methods use a vacuum form process where a printed disc is stretched through a dome, and images/text become distorted. Or a cardboard cutout is pressed into shape and parts are not precisely aligned. Traditional methods used watercolor paper that is wetted/pasted to a sphere, very challenging and time consuming as paper has to be carefully manipulated or it will tear. I was hoping to speed up the process using a adhesive backed material.

The globes are around 15 inches in diameter, so details are pretty small and more difficult to align accurately. Latitude/longitude grids need to be straight. Another concern is replicating the process over large quantities. Like I mentioned, Phototex stretches good, but text tends to be a bit blurry at that size. While LexJet print-n-stick prints beautifully, but the edges on the gores (slices of the map) end up curling.

The reason I'm concerned about using a different printer is that we were hoping to print in-house so we could adjust the map as needed, e.g. different location markers, color combinations, languages, etc.

I apologize if our project does not fit in this forum. There are just not many companies making globes and even less information about how to make them, sort of a lost art.

 

[Jester1167]

I guess I don't understand why you are trying to reinvent the globe? They exist far cheaper than you could ever hope to make them... You could even pay to have them customized far cheaper than the time and trouble you probably already have invested.

 

[peazley]

By that logic I could say the same thing about signs, I'm sure I could buy a can of spray paint and make one much cheaper. I don't want to sound defensive, but I feel your comment is condescending. I thought this was a forum for help?

Frankly the globes available today are pretty cheap in quality. Methods used for manufacturing today tend to distort the map, which is in essence what a globe is made to display. On top of that they're not perfectly round (trust me, a perfect sphere is not so simple). There are a few globe makers whose globes start at over $1000. We want to make our own version with a map that matches our expectations.

If nobody took the challenge to try and make something better, every sign in the world would still be painted by hand.

 

[Christian @ 2CT Media]

You aren't going to find a vinyl or linen product that can do all that you need. Do you have the ability to get different equipment?

You may be better getting a flatbed then direct printing sheets then thermoforming them

 

[peazley]

Sure, we could get another printer. I'm just not sure which type is the direction we should look towards. We went with the aqueous because we started with watercolor linen papers. Having archival quality pigment inks was also a plus.

Are you suggesting something that can print onto a sheet of acrylic then vacuum forming to shape into a dome? We have a vacuum former. But that's something we wanted to avoid since the image tends to distort. I'd prefer a label sort of thing. But I am open to other options, just don't want to jump the gun with a new system if its not exactly what we will need. Or is there a method of thermoforming just the label itself?

Ideally the paper really only needs to stretch in one direction.

 

[studio 440]

Sure, we could get another printer. I'm just not sure which type is the direction we should look towards. We went with the aqueous because we started with watercolor linen papers. Having archival quality pigment inks was also a plus.

Are you suggesting something that can print onto a sheet of acrylic then vacuum forming to shape into a dome? We have a vacuum former. But that's something we wanted to avoid since the image tends to distort. I'd prefer a label sort of thing. But I am open to other options, just don't want to jump the gun with a new system if its not exactly what we will need. Or is there a method of thermoforming just the label itself?

Ideally the paper really only needs to stretch in one direction.

saw a great episode on how its made season 9 on making a globe and it was facinating how they sliced the globe print in a special sliced shape and then attached it to the globe worth a look

 

[peazley]

Yeah, that one gives you a good look at how most commercial globes are made these days. We're sorta following how its done in this video