Print Color versus Pantone vs CMYK vs printers

[Stormy Conner]

I hate trying to explain to people that printers print different and that Pantone is not print color. We have this job where they sent their pantone colors which I looked for the CYMK versions because we would need to print them. this is what I got.

We print on a Roland VG3-640 and the prints are not matching the vinyl already on the sign. Is there maybe something in settings on printer i need to do or something else. I am not a print expert. And when I asked GSG if i can get vinyl in that Pantone they said no.
Please help

Weird I kept getting an error when I was trying to post so didn't think it posted.
The bank president signed off on the swatch we sent but I appreciate all ya'lls help.

 

[Zendavor Signs]

First of all, matching colors exactly to something already existing is very difficult. There are so many factors that can affect it. I would never make a promise to match existing colors. Most people understand this with paint - you have to paint corner to corner because a patch will never match.

As for your colors not outputting correctly, you need to pay a professional to produce color profiles for your printer so Pantone colors come out reasonably close. It is a sizeable investment, but will make your life so much easier in being able to trust prints to come out correctly on your printer.

 

[bteifeld]

The most reliable way to get the right color is to measure it yourself and put
the information from the spectrophotometer measurement(L*a*b*/D50 or
spectral reflectance distribution) into your RIP's spot color table. See Ed Hagen's
www.projectbbcg.guide

For Pantone, you can only get L*a*b*/D50 from Pantone Live and/or Pantone Connect.
Your RIP software may have the information built-in. At that point, you need to be sure
you have properly calibrated and profiled media configurations.

 

[Pauly]

For proper colour matching, you need to profile your printer.

 

[bob]

Using whatever profile gets you off**, set your Rendering Intents to 'Perceptual' for bitmaps and set everything else to 'No Color Correction' or, failing that, 'Saturation'.. If given the option, select the highest dither algorithm possible. If you're printing any bitmaps, make them RGB if at all possible. If there's any gradients try to make those CMYK. Then print an entire Pantone, gloss coated, chart and hang it on the wall. Find the closest matching color on this chart. If given a choice between two colors, choose the darker of the two.

**Been printing vinyl etc. for twenty some years and have exactly two profiles, one for paper and one for everything else. Both with the modifications detailed above. With these two I come reasonably close to what you see is what you get.

 

[Ron at Forest Litho]

Yes this is an ongoing thing forever with my customers who are looking at their screens and thinking that THAT is the color that will print. I've done the RGB / CMYK explanation about 400 too many times. And the pantone match speech almost as much. I have a fashion customer who puts color swatches for their shirts on their order forms. That is the same problem. Pantone colors and cloth dyes are made with dyes that actually are the color they are because they reflect a specific mix of light wavelengths. Getting 4 other specific wavelengths - C,M,Y,K - to fool the eye into thinking it is seeing that pantone or dye is actually NOT possible in many cases. What I do for my color swatch customer is ... I've taught them to make a block of about 30 color swatch boxes of each color they are trying to get, and vary the CMYK values by 1% or 2% up and down and send me the CMYK PDF (same as what the final PDF will be). Then I print that color sheet(s) for them and mail it back. Then they use one of the 30 boxes that they are satisfied with and make that one the box for that particular color. Then they re-tweak the ones that they are still not happy with and we do it again. Take about 3 to 5 tests to get a group of 6 to 9 colors. And we do occasionally get a dye that absolutely cannot be made with CMYK. We decided that for that color they would pick a color box that "denotes the feeling" of that particular color. And then I print the multi-part ordered forms using the same machine, with the same settings that I used to make the text samples.
But for someone who is asked to match a previously printed color on a sign that was done via PMS color a long time ago.... Well you are really up against it. Not only did we find out that getting a can of the same Pantone mixed ink for the ink company may not be exactly the same color. (Yeah we yelled at them when their 072 blue was not the same as the last 072 blue!) But if it's old it could have faded. The material themself might cause a color shift, The surface of an old substrate may alter the way a color looks and you are now using a new, better, up-to-date substrate.
I think the most important thing is to get the customer involved as to what their expectations and needs are. Sometimes they have a fashion sense about the project and they are really wanting a perfection that cannot be done on your machines. But sometimes, you think they are demanding, but as long as its close, it doesnt really matter to them. You just have to make sure you are on the same page.

 

[Humble PM]

And we do occasionally get a dye that absolutely cannot be made with CMYK. We decided that for that color they would pick a color box that "denotes the feeling" of that particular color.

Reasonable clients, I ask them to not look at the original (flourescent) colours, but does this (the print proof preview) please you? Most times, the answer is yeah, looks good. Other times, I refer them to one or another firm up town, who have way more expensive facilities, and customer service reps who have more free time than I have.

I think you got and tamed a unicorn client there! I hope they appreciated the effort.