Problems with Oracal Vinyl

[sign_noob]

I purchased several rolls of Oracal 751 from USCutter.

Some rolls have a plain cardboard tube and others have a tube that says Orafol.

The problem is that the vinyl with the Orafol label is a lot more difficult to weed and when I'm pulling the backing off the vinyl, the paper feels stiffer and is not as easy to roll back. Even the vinyl with the Orafol label has more of a plastic feel verses the plain tube which has more of a rubber feel.

Do you think that I'm getting older stock from USCutter?
Can you tell me if the stock your getting from either Fellers or NGlantz has the Orafol inner tube or is it a plain tube?

These feel like two completly different products to me even though the paper backing says OraCal 751c on both.

I'm also thinking that maybe I should look at Avery Dennison 900 instead.

Any help or suggestions would be great!

 

[rjssigns]

If you're trying to weed intricate details that may be your problem. If we need to do detailed work/tiny lettering we use 3M ElectroCut with the poly backer. Weeds like a dream. We also use the "manic weeding" process on that type of work.(grab and rip, don't laugh it works)

 

[sign_noob]

If you're trying to weed intricate details that may be your problem. If we need to do detailed work/tiny lettering we use 3M ElectroCut with the poly backer. Weeds like a dream. We also use the "manic weeding" process on that type of work.(grab and rip, don't laugh it works)

There is a lot of detailed work and tiny lettering. I'll have to look into 3M Cost.

 

[rjssigns]

There is a lot of detailed work and tiny lettering. I'll have to look into 3M Cost.

If you're going to put cost over saving your sanity then 3M Electrocut isn't for you. It is a lot more money, but the time saved along with a better yield of usable pieces more than makes up for it.

 

[sign_noob]

If you're going to put cost over saving your sanity then 3M Electrocut isn't for you. It is a lot more money, but the time saved along with a better yield of usable pieces more than makes up for it.

No, I'd rather put time savings over cost but I was just curious as to how much more it was. Looks like it is approx. $3.00 more per yard from Fellers. I can live with that and I don't have an issue with trying another brand. But before I do that I would like to see if I am getting old product from USCutter.

Again, I have no problem with some of the Oracal that I bought but other colors are giving me issues.

Do you think, based on the different inner tube of the Oracal, that I am getting old product from USCutter? Should I order from NGlantz or Fellers instead? Why would there be such an inconsistency with a Cast vinyl?

 

[rjssigns]

No, I'd rather put time savings over cost but I was just curious as to how much more it was. Looks like it is approx. $3.00 more per yard from Fellers. I can live with that and I don't have an issue with trying another brand. But before I do that I would like to see if I am getting old product from USCutter.

Again, I have no problem with some of the Oracal that I bought but other colors are giving me issues.

Do you think, based on the different inner tube of the Oracal, that I am getting old product from USCutter? Should I order from NGlantz or Fellers instead? Why would there be such an inconsistency with a Cast vinyl?

Quite possible you received some old stock. I'm not sure how many times USCutter "turns" their warehouse. Never had an issue with anything from Fellers. Although I usually get my ElectroCut from Midwest. Cut yardage is cheaper and I can have it at the shop in less than 24 hours.

 

[TimToad]

Have you tried reverse weeding with difficult material or really small text or graphics?

I used to work at a shop that did tons of museum work and we would have to weed dozens of wall size text panels of exhibition grade at a time with six to eight feet tall worth of text. I've done row after row of text as small as 1/4" this way.

You program cutlines between all of your text lines and cut like normal. Once cut, you can weed out the centers of all the letters if you like. Then apply oversized application tape and flip the whole thing over. Tape the app tape down to your work table securely all the way around and remove the liner. Then just start weeding as you normally would. Once you're done, put your baking liner back on and you're done.

Its not super fast, but for small or really delicate graphics, its sometimes the only thing that works.

 

[sign_noob]

Have you tried reverse weeding with difficult material or really small text or graphics?

I used to work at a shop that did tons of museum work and we would have to weed dozens of wall size text panels of exhibition grade at a time with six to eight feet tall worth of text. I've done row after row of text as small as 1/4" this way.

You program cutlines between all of your text lines and cut like normal. Once cut, you can weed out the centers of all the letters if you like. Then apply oversized application tape and flip the whole thing over. Tape the app tape down to your work table securely all the way around and remove the liner. Then just start weeding as you normally would. Once you're done, put your baking liner back on and you're done.

Its not super fast, but for small or really delicate graphics, its sometimes the only thing that works.

That's not going to work for me. I use a speed press for multi-color layouts and I need to get my vinyl cut, weeded and applied to aluminum as customers wait. The quicker the better. Some of my vinyl has a rubbery feel and weeds, sticks to my speed press app tape and removes beautifully. This is the Oracal 751 with a plain cardboard inner core. The rest of my vinyl has a plastic feel and weeds difficultly, doesn't want to stick to the app tape and wants to stick to the backing when I pull it off at a 180 degree angle. My cutting depth is set the same and does not cut into the paper backing. Also, the paper backing on the vinyl with the oracal printed core seems stiffer and doesn't fold back onto itself as easy.

If I go with a High tack application tape, then I run into the problem of it being so sticky that it doesn't want to pull off of the vinyl without forming bubbles or pulling the edges of graphics away. Of course if I fold the application back onto itself when removing this isn't an issue but that's not how a speed press works. You shouldn't have to disconnect the tape from the frame between layouts and application/removal.

Also, I'm in an outdoor environment and with the dust in the air, I don't want to expose the vinyl backing to the elements too long. It needs to be quick, clean and problem free.

 

[toucan_graphics]

If you are buying from US Cutter, you are probably getting old stock... that may be why their prices are so much cheaper than other places. I bought some vinyl from US Cutter about a year ago and I used it for one job (profanity laden weeding sessions) and the rest is still sitting on my rack. I use it for test cuts for new designs and if it weeds good with the stuff from US Cutter then weeding with the good vinyl is almost always a piece of cake.

 

[sign_noob]

If you are buying from US Cutter, you are probably getting old stock... that may be why their prices are so much cheaper than other places. I bought some vinyl from US Cutter about a year ago and I used it for one job (profanity laden weeding sessions) and the rest is still sitting on my rack. I use it for test cuts for new designs and if it weeds good with the stuff from US Cutter then weeding with the good vinyl is almost always a piece of cake.

I had suspected that it was old stock. I bough some stock from them one other time and it must have been the end of a roll. It was so bad that you couldn't lay the vinyl flat without it tunneling. Thanks for your help with this. I am going to call Oracal and see if they can tell me by the cardboard core if it is old stock. Looks like I will be buying my vinyl from somewhere else from now on.

 

[player]

Return it.

 

[sign_noob]

I discovered that US Cutter was sending me 3 year old stock. I purchase from NGlantz now and have not received anything older then 1 year. HUGE difference in weeding and application ease.

Thanks to all for your help in this.


Does anyone know exactly how to read the serial number printed on the backing of Oracal vinyl to determine how old it is?

 

[ChaseO]

I can't help you read the serial number or have any comment about the tube difference, but I can tell a difference in the backing paper. The newer Oracal has a much finer print grid and saya Oracal High Performance Cast 751C The older vinyl will have about a 1 inch tall 751C on it.