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Sealing ACM panel signs?

SignDesignLady

Always Learning
Had a customer come in and we talked about providing new ACM signs for his church. He showed me images of a few that have obviously been out in the elements for awhile, (he says only a year) and the laminate is shrinking and vinyl pulling away from the edges. We didn't do the original signs but I have seen this with signs we have done in the past after about 3 years. Is there anyway to combat this issue? Is there a way to seal the edges on these signs? Customer is asking about this and I don't know the answer to this one.
 

MrDav3C

New Member
Sounds like poor quality vinyl and laminate have been used that probably weren't matched.

If they are matched they should at least shrink at the same rate so one won't pull away from the other but this certainly shouldn't be the case after a year if you use decent products.
 

Modern Ink Signs

Premium Subscriber
Sounds like someone used calandered vinyl for an exterior project.

Cast my friends, CAST! ALWAYS!

With cast SDL you should have no problem if install on the board correctly.


Why can’t some people get this through their thick skulls! I’m tired of seeing/hearing about this stuff. In the cost of the job, cast is not that much more than calandered. People that do this are just hurting our industry.


Hey this was a Geno-ish type rant! ….but true!
 

unclebun

Active Member
Sounds like someone used calandered vinyl for an exterior project.

Cast my friends, CAST! ALWAYS!

With cast SDL you should have no problem if install on the board correctly.


Why can’t some people get this through their thick skulls! I’m tired of seeing/hearing about this stuff. In the cost of the job, cast is not that much more than calandered. People that do this are just hurting our industry.


Hey this was a Geno-ish type rant! ….but true!
You can get edge lifting on ACM with cast materials too. We have found that how you treat the cut edges makes a big difference. There is often a ridge on the edge from cutting, and if you don't sand that down before installing the graphics, it will trigger premature vinyl failure.
 

MikePro

New Member
living in texas, you must be aware by now that the sun exposure can be brutal to signage.
either edge-cap or wrap the vinyl around the edges & onto the backside ....or use a premium cast vinyl&lam combo.

...or make clients aware that dibond & vinyl has a life expectancy out in the elements, and is priced affordably to replace every few years.

Dibond/Alumicor edgecap
 

MikePro

New Member
Why not just add a 1" border to the print and wrap the edges with the print? That's the only way I sell ij35c on acm.

Beat me to it!
hell i've even wrapped IJ35c onto the cheap double-sided gatorfoam with finished cardboard surfaces this way. the material naturally wants to shrink over time but the wrap holds it all tight to the face as long as it has a good grip around the perimeter.
 

JBurton

Signtologist
hell i've even wrapped IJ35c onto the cheap double-sided gatorfoam with finished cardboard surfaces this way. the material naturally wants to shrink over time but the wrap holds it all tight to the face as long as it has a good grip around the perimeter.
Yup, as long as the installers don't drag the edge across the bucket causing a slice that nobody notices until it's failing...
 
Sounds like someone used calandered vinyl for an exterior project.

Cast my friends, CAST! ALWAYS!

With cast SDL you should have no problem if install on the board correctly.


Why can’t some people get this through their thick skulls! I’m tired of seeing/hearing about this stuff. In the cost of the job, cast is not that much more than calandered. People that do this are just hurting our industry.


Hey this was a Geno-ish type rant! ….but true!
Where is cast not much more then calendared? In Canda 180 is over 1,000 and 35/40 is 500 a roll.
 

Modern Ink Signs

Premium Subscriber
Yes cast cost more and calandered but in this case the difference in cost might $20-$30.

Not worth it to me. Just price it accordingly…..


We don’t do the print and mount much in my shop. All flatbed printed and then a cast lam if needed.
 

Superior_Adam

New Member
Sounds like someone used calandered vinyl for an exterior project.

Cast my friends, CAST! ALWAYS!

With cast SDL you should have no problem if install on the board correctly.


Why can’t some people get this through their thick skulls! I’m tired of seeing/hearing about this stuff. In the cost of the job, cast is not that much more than calandered. People that do this are just hurting our industry.


Hey this was a Geno-ish type rant! ….but true!
a good, calendared vinyl/lam can last 5-7 years outdoors. I have had zero issues with vinyl lifting off the edges prematurely.
 

SignDesignLady

Always Learning
I wish I could do everything with cast, it just always looks better and wears longer. That said, someone mentioned the cost difference, I pay around $175 for a 150' roll calendared print media, 3m IJ180 150' roll costs me about $950, and I haven't even added in the overlaminate. I am not a math wiz but that is a pretty substantial cost difference. Unfortunately, people think in dollar signs first. When dealing with a non-profit, a school or a church they aren't going to want to pay for cast material, not to mention Joe Blow who is just plain cheap. I print with an eco-solvent Roland printer. I often outsource multiples of 10 or more to a partner who prints directly to the substrate with a flatbed, but I more often than not have the customers who want only one to 5 signs. I am on the hunt for a cast product that may work for this type of project but at a more budget friendly cost. Just doing my due diligence here because I don't know it all and am always learning about all the different products in this industry. I am 12 years in and still learn things every day. One of the reasons I come here asking questions is to learn from others.
 
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