Sign Installation Pricing

[Gino]

The point is that if you sell a sign in Sioux Falls, SD and the customer puts it up himself, by definition the sign was put up without a permit since the customer is not a licensed sign contractor and only licensed sign contractors are allowed to pull permits. There are penalties for putting up a sign without a permit. There are also penalties for licensed sign contractors who violate the ordinances, and they are required to keep records of who buys portable signs for two years. So the sign company can be tracked for a non-permitted sign and can be penalized, which is what Bxtr stated that you said he didn't know what he was talking about or misread the ordinance.

I don't see it that way.

The first step is, the sign must be permitted to be made in the first place. bxtr comes from a franchise shop. They offer all the services needed to perform any part of the sign job, therefore, he must know what he's talking about. However, he also knows if he doesn't tell the customer these things up front, such as any other sign shop should know, they cannot perform the job required if the customer says he'll put it up. So, ya know the rules going in, why is this so hard to understand for you ??

As for these rules, I still never heard of such a thing and I don't see it clearly stated in what you outlined.

So, if a customer comes into a shop in that area and says they'd like a sign to sell my house, they need to get a permit by the sign shop ??
If another customer comes in and wants to put up a banner for the enlistment of participants in a play, they need to have the sign shop go get a permit and put it up ??
I little league ball park wants to put up 4' x 8' sponsorship signs, they need to get a permit for every sign and have the sign shop get permits for all the various signs ??

 

[Boudica]

§ 155.020 PORTABLE SIGNS.
It shall be the duty of persons engaged in the activity or business of renting or providing portable signs to others to record the date of the transaction, the name of the sign users, and the proposed location of the portable sign and to maintain these records for a period of two years. Furthermore, it shall be their duty to require applicants placing portable signs within city limits to produce a valid permit prior to transfer of the sign. All portable signs must prominently display the name of its owner, whether business or individual.

This is insane, and I don't see how it can be enforceable. The insanity of this part should nullify all of it.
Someone with a cricuit cuts some lettering, slaps it on a piece of substrate for an A-frame sidewalk sign... WTF - how are they going to police and enforce this?

 

[Geneva Olson]

In our city, if you make the sign and the customer installs it they can come back on you and fine or take your sign license.
The thought is only to have professional sign installers installing signs. That way they aren't falling off the building killing people.
It's a pain, but ever since we had a building collapse due to crappy construction practices. OSHA has been very present in the city.

what city is this?

 

[Texas_Signmaker]

In what you highlighted, it's only discussing portable signs... Keeping a record.

I've had clients take the option of putting a sign up and paying double the fee for it to be faster....at the city's recommendation (Boulder, CO).

 

[unclebun]

what city is this?

Sioux Falls, SD

 

[unclebun]

I don't see it that way.

The first step is, the sign must be permitted to be made in the first place. bxtr comes from a franchise shop. They offer all the services needed to perform any part of the sign job, therefore, he must know what he's talking about. However, he also knows if he doesn't tell the customer these things up front, such as any other sign shop should know, they cannot perform the job required if the customer says he'll put it up. So, ya know the rules going in, why is this so hard to understand for you ??

As for these rules, I still never heard of such a thing and I don't see it clearly stated in what you outlined.

So, if a customer comes into a shop in that area and says they'd like a sign to sell my house, they need to get a permit by the sign shop ??
If another customer comes in and wants to put up a banner for the enlistment of participants in a play, they need to have the sign shop go get a permit and put it up ??
I little league ball park wants to put up 4' x 8' sponsorship signs, they need to get a permit for every sign and have the sign shop get permits for all the various signs ??

You have now heard of such a thing so stop saying you've never heard of it. It might be the only time you've heard of it, but you have.

I understand it very clearly. As Bxtr stated, the city can come back on the seller of the sign if it wasn't permitted yet was installed.

If you took the time to read the sign ordinance, you'd know that house for sale real estate signs don't require permits. Banners up to 100 sq ft also don't require a permit (although banners strung between two stakes are not allowed at all, permit or not).

As far as I can tell the ball park signs would not require a permit because they are not located along a public right of way or in the sightline of the right of way, which is the area the sign ordinance primarily controls, although electronic scoreboard structures and channel letters and signs on the stadium would be controlled by the ordinance.

As far as the sign Sticker Mule put up, if it were in Sioux Falls it would not require a sign permit from the standpoint that it is a campaign/election sign. However, since it is an electrically lit sign located on a building, it would still require an electrical inspection and permit, and likely could be subject to structural inspection since it is located on a building and if it fell it would fall on a right of way. This is probably also the case in the city Sticker Mule's building is located. It's one of those weird areas of the law where cities have stayed away from trampling on first amendment rights pertaining to elections and campaigns even though one might argue that all sign restrictions are first amendment violations.

 

[Gino]

You have now heard of such a thing so stop saying you've never heard of it. It might be the only time you've heard of it, but you have.

I understand it very clearly. As Bxtr stated, the city can come back on the seller of the sign if it wasn't permitted yet was installed.

If you took the time to read the sign ordinance, you'd know that house for sale real estate signs don't require permits. Banners up to 100 sq ft also don't require a permit (although banners strung between two stakes are not allowed at all, permit or not).

As far as I can tell the ball park signs would not require a permit because they are not located along a public right of way or in the sightline of the right of way, which is the area the sign ordinance primarily controls, although electronic scoreboard structures and channel letters and signs on the stadium would be controlled by the ordinance.

As far as the sign Sticker Mule put up, if it were in Sioux Falls it would not require a sign permit from the standpoint that it is a campaign/election sign. However, since it is an electrically lit sign located on a building, it would still require an electrical inspection and permit, and likely could be subject to structural inspection since it is located on a building and if it fell it would fall on a right of way. This is probably also the case in the city Sticker Mule's building is located. It's one of those weird areas of the law where cities have stayed away from trampling on first amendment rights pertaining to elections and campaigns even though one might argue that all sign restrictions are first amendment violations.

At this point, don't YOU ever tell me what to hear of or not to hear of. You can suggest or invite me to entertain certain things, but don't ever tell me what I MUST think by your standards.

This has nothing to do with the rules/codes of this city's conduct. Cripes, for all you know, they're never enforced anyway.