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Start a new business Yes or No

Bobo33

New Member
Hi Everyone

just after some advice,

Considering starting a new signage business with my partner - we will be doing Signs, Vehicle Wraps, window graphics, exhition graphics etc, both of us have graphic design experience and have a free work shop available.

we would hope to get business from Networking, Adwords & going from business to business on foot but I'm after some cold hard advice - Is this a good business to get into ? And how hard is it to get started?

Would really appreciate any advice

thanks
 

2B

Active Member
the industry is very easy to get into, and there are MANY MANY quality wholesalers who will fill your orders promptly and professionally.
Which means you will not have to invest lots of capital to get up and running.

it is rewarding and a challenge.
Rewarding because you can point and say I did that, rarely do you have the same mundane tasks, even a FOR SALE sign can be different with added colors / fonts / etc...

Challenging because this industry has and is continuing to be labeled as a commodity item. IE bottom dollar wins with little or no concern about quality.
you will constantly get told, "ABC will do the work for XXX.XX beat their price or I'm leaving"

bottom line if you like graphics then yeah give it a go, again make sure to use wholesalers when you are starting to test the market. once you have a solid foundation then you can buy your own equipment.

NOTE: your design's are your life line and your property as such protect them!!! we have been bit more than I want to recall from legit companies and individuals who have us do a design and then take it to a hack and rips the design even after we have an obvious watermark and clearly stated who owns the design.
 

Solventinkjet

DIY Printer Fixing Guide
The first sign shop I worked for was a small start-up. The owner and his wife put in just as much time, plus more, as I did but I was the only person to take a check in 2 years as their employee. We had enough work to keep me busy full time but not enough revenue to have the owner quit his day job. It took about another 2 years for him to be able to quit his job and work at his shop full time. Now they are thriving and have a lot of cool new equipment that makes their lives easier.

A lot of people go into this industry thinking it's a slam dunk easy way to get rich but it is just like any other industry. It takes a lot of hard work and frustration to last a significant time and reap the benefits. The most important thing to think about is whether you are willing to put in the time and effort necessary to learn the trade and make quality products. Having design skills is a great background to get started but if your signs fall apart in less than a year, it won't matter how good they look. Knowing what kind of materials to use for certain jobs, how to apply them and the best way to print them is key. Many people start out in this industry thinking they can live off making decals for the local schools and end up very surprised when it doesn't work out. Be diverse and knowledgeable and you can survive.
 

Bobo33

New Member
Thanks for the replies

I was considering going out networking and finding business then outsourcing the work for a few months while I build a customer base is this a good idea ?

i already know the equipment i will be getting which includes a Roland VS540 - but my worry is actually getting the work in, with no prior knowledge of the industry im not sure what level of demand to expect especially as it's such a saturated market.

lastly what should I learn ? I have already done a few vinyl signs and had practice of vehicle wrapping but what other things should I be learning

thanks
 

Gino

Premium Subscriber
It doesn't sound like you have a real grip on what or how you'll be doing anything, other than you think you can do it.

With your mindset, I don't think it would matter what business you are going to enter into. Your efforts sound small...... it doesn't seem as if you want to do anything more than just try it for the sake of trying it.

Many people in this line of work...... or any line of work, tend to have an appraoch of, they have a store front, they sell their product and they treat their customers like customers. Myself and many others see it as my company is an extension of my home, open to my cherished customers and employees..... all wanting to be given respect and be appreciated. That makes a humongous difference. Fishwrapper stuff.



Good luck................ :wink:
 

HDvinyl

Trump 2020
Nothing worse than an idle printer after a large investment.

Quality control is another thing you don't have to worry about when outsource to a reputable company. Would be a horrible start to get a large client to start, only to lose them because of your learning curve on your printer. Missed deadlines or flawed prints.
 

Bobo33

New Member
It doesn't sound like you have a real grip on what or how you'll be doing anything, other than you think you can do it.

With your mindset, I don't think it would matter what business you are going to enter into. Your efforts sound small...... it doesn't seem as if you want to do anything more than just try it for the sake of trying it.

Many people in this line of work...... or any line of work, tend to have an appraoch of, they have a store front, they sell their product and they treat their customers like customers. Myself and many others see it as my company is an extension of my home, open to my cherished customers and employees..... all wanting to be given respect and be appreciated. That makes a humongous difference. Fishwrapper stuff.



Good luck................ :wink:

im very intent on starting this business and building it up. There will be two sides Signage & Design/Branding. My only concern is I have never entered such a saturated market so I don't know what to expect in terms of demand and gaining customers. Also it's incredibly hard in the UK to find any industry stats worth knowing.

i just want to know can this business be started and be successful ? Or is it so saturared that it's hard to find the work ?
 

Gino

Premium Subscriber
im very intent on starting this business and building it up. There will be two sides Signage & Design/Branding. My only concern is I have never entered such a saturated market so I don't know what to expect in terms of demand and gaining customers. Also it's incredibly hard in the UK to find any industry stats worth knowing.

i just want to know can this business be started and be successful ? Or is it so saturared that it's hard to find the work ?


You haven't changed my mind with your last entry, but in answering you again...... Yes, it is OVER saturated with people like you. No experience, no business sense, no hands on knowledge, no equipment, no nothing, except a lotta empty questions. If you wanna do it right, you and your partner should probably work in different shops for two years, learn what you can, then see if you still wanna do it.



I'd like to open a taxi service in New York. Heck, that's where they all collect, huh ?? What do I hafta do ?? I intend to buy some cars. Do they hafta look like real taxis ?? Just to get started, I'll rent some Volkswagens. Must I hire drivers, or could my partner and I do all the work ?? Is there any restrictions to my territory ?? I'll just drive around until someone waves me down. Can I buy gas discounted for taxis ?? Where can I get cheap gasoline ?? If my engine light comes on, can you guys help me fix it ?? Or can I just put some black tape over the dash ?? Where do you get tires..... but cheap ones. How do you get customers to use a taxi ?? Word of mouth ?? Is this a saturated endeavor ?? I just wanna know, before I sink too much into it and find out it's not for me.................. :smile:
 

HDvinyl

Trump 2020
I'd like to open a taxi service in New York. Heck, that's where they all collect, huh ?? What do I hafta do ?? I intend to buy some cars. Do they hafta look like real taxis ?? Just to get started, I'll rent some Volkswagens. Must I hire drivers, or could my partner and I do all the work ?? Is there any restrictions to my territory ?? I'll just drive around until someone waves me down. Can I buy gas discounted for taxis ?? Where can I get cheap gasoline ?? If my engine light comes on, can you guys help me fix it ?? Or can I just put some black tape over the dash ?? Where do you get tires..... but cheap ones. How do you get customers to use a taxi ?? Word of mouth ?? Is this a saturated endeavor ?? I just wanna know, before I sink too much into it and find out it's not for me.................. :smile:
Uber. Pay other people to do the dirty work and just collect each transaction.
 

Centro Graphics

New Member
Im afraid Gino is completely spot on with what he has said. How can you start a business from scratch in signs/ graphics etc if you have no knowledge at all of the industry.

How will you deal with an enquiry that needs at least some experience so you can advise the customer what is the best solution to their request. How can you beat the competition to win that business. Yes you will learn over time, but you cant run before you can walk.

Even the franchise brigade get some sort of training.

if you are serious, then get some part time work to start you off. DONT try to do everything at once either. You mentioned exhibition, wraps, signs. Thats a lot to learn from the off. Concentrate on one of them. Yes they all have the similar principal but are vastly different at the same time.

Good luck and keep in mind it will take time before you know what you are doing. dont forget to get your prices right, if you mess that up you may as well go fishing.
 

Biker Scout

New Member
I don't post a lot in this area because questions like this irritate me. Jumping in with the sharks then asking the boat captain if this was a good idea, and if he could throw you a life jacket, oh and some shark repellant.

But we've all got to start somewhere, right? So I'll share with you some of my experience in this industry.

First off, if you think you are a designer, your feelings will get hurt. Secondly, really good designers rarely make good businessmen. Thirdly, have some design principles and stick by them. That's the only way to be able to stand out in a crowded field, is to have good design, and a no-compromise attitude. (But there's the double edge sword, because that's not good business sense all the time. Sometimes you have to take it up the arse to be able to pay the bills) Then when you've thoroughly compromised your design principles, and put 5000 yard signs with Helvetica Black, because the client didn't share your vision for visual eye candy design, your feelings will get hurt.

OK, here's how it all got started... I worked so many different design jobs over the years, learning everything I could along the way. From Print Shops, Newspapers, Fancy White Shirt Design Studios etc... Hung out at a friend's garage based sign shop. Weeded vinyl while chit-chatting. Watched his business grow, and I even helped out in my spare time. He didn't have a printer, but just a plotter. Prints were outsourced, and almost rarely needed, because that wasn't his focus. Eventually, I thought I wanted a plotter... so I talked my boss into getting one, to add to the business offerings. (I was working at a mom & pop print shop at the time) So, I learned how to do everything on their dime, using their materials. Then I got good, and we were making good money. Sometimes more than the print shop part was making. Which allowed me to broker them a deal with one of their suppliers, about getting a printer. Wasn't a solvent printer, but just a really good wide format for indoor posters and prints etc. I subsequently struck a deal with one of their clients, that if we had this capability, would you be willing to buy your posters from us? Again, I never used any of my money, but was gaining valuable experience. In both the equipment side, and the customer service side and the owners were impressed.

Eventually, I got to the point where I knew I could do pretty much the same thing on my own. And once you get that in your head, look out... you can never work for someone else again. I knew what I wanted, and what equipment to buy first. I knew what I wanted to target, which was everything. (Bad Idea) Either just do trade show exhibition graphics, or just do car wraps or just do signs and store fronts. etc... pick a focus. Because if you've never wrapped a car, you will suck, and the job will suck, and it's not as profitable as it used to be. Plus you need to have good insurance in your shop space to house a car, especially if it might be overnight. Plus, wraps are practically commodity throw-away paint skin now. So if you want to do Events and Trade Shows... don't even bother with that toy printer Roland 540. Waaaay too small and slow to do the big jobs. Plus the ink alone will eat your profits. You need at least a 10 ft wide printer to enter that market. Where you buy bulk ink by the gallon, and it's really cheap then. Also, you'd need a router to do some of the POP work that those shops can crank out along with all the other associated media that is usually required at a Trade Show. Many vendors will likely pick the one printer that can handle all the needs and get the colors right.

Oh, and don't get me started on color consistency! Oh, man... that was so hard when I first started out. Mainly, because I was just starting out I couldn't afford real RIP software. Which is about $3500 for a decent one, and you'll need to figure out how to use a color calibrator. And those aren't cheap either. Matching client colors is paramount. Sometimes you can lose a client if you can't be consistent, month to month, year to year. It's happened to me. And all because I switched to a cheaper ink, because OEM ink was kicking my arse.

See my point is, I got hands on experience with other people's money and machines. And I when I finally branched out on my own, even hard a hard time. Because it was a battle between hitting the streets and passing out my flyers and business cards and going to the social business mixers to drum up new business. But that left me no time to be in the shop designing. Which was my real passion. Then I found I couldn't do the work and drum up business at the same time. God forbid if I had a stuck nozzle, or ran out of ink over the weekend. Try and get a salesperson who will only work on commission... haha! They aren't very good at sales if they take you up on that offer. Even if you offer to pay them 50% profit, just to get anybody to do your sales... they are lazy and don't know your product like you do, and don't share the same passion for what good design can actually do for a business.

So you wanna know what I do now... I'm back to being just a design studio... that happens to have a large format printer, plotter, router, large laser, printing and bindery machines etc... and they are all paid for cash. I only work on the jobs I want to work on, and ones that might utilize some of my equipment. If it happens to be a large sign job, I can do that. If it's just branding and they don't want anything else, well that's OK too. I have a package for them as well. But I name my price, and they can take it or leave it. I even offer retainer options for the more budget minded businesses. I did one wrap last year, only because I happen to have the space, and it was just a food truck, so it was easy. But I wasn't cheap... and they knew that coming in. I wanted to make sure it was worth my while. But they wanted my design, so the cost wasn't a factor. (I wasn't going let my design go out the door to a competing shop, unless they bought out the rights for it) But see, since I had the ability to keep it in house, I made money on both sides of the transaction. But I don't seek out the large trade show jobs anymore. Because just making money isn't important to me anymore. My free time is priceless, and I love being able to come in at 10 or 11, crank out some work and just leave and go and do whatever. Yeah, it's cool making 40k on one job... but you've got to work like you are earning 40k in a week! Then pay all that back in payroll, and taxes and materials... and you end up with only $5k in your pocket. Whereas, with my method now, I can make $5k just with a branding package and never have to turn on a single machine. But it's there when I need it.

Think real hard about how you want to do this sign business thing... because unless you've got a gift with a paint brush, it's really only the business to be in, if you are good at business. Design takes a back seat to sales, commitment to the client, seeing the work through and making deadlines at all costs.

I'd seriously work at a sign shop as an apprentice first. There are so many subtle nuances that can make the learning curve a cliff of insanity, especially if you don't have the experience to navigate the work-arounds.
 
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