Tell me I made the right move dealing with this customer

[TheSnowman]

Over the last 10+ years in the business, I've had those customers that have always tried to push me around and run MY business the way THEY think it should run. As I've gotten older, I've taken less and less crap, and seen more and more bad warning signs. Here's how this customer went. Just looking for confirmation that I made the right move walking away.

Guy calls, renting a place in a little development office area with a bunch of offices, and they have a big sign out front with all the tenants. He says he needs me to put his logo on it, and wants a quote. I tell him no problem, email me the logo, and sure enough...it begins. Dude doesn't know how to email, and all he's got is a picture of it. He HAS to text it to me. So now the guy has my cell phone number, sends me the picture, and starts calling me after 7 in the evenings (I don't answer) so he starts texting, wanting to talk about his project. I call him back the next morning and he goes on and on about how no one else in town will return his calls or get back to him (red flag), and can't even remember the name of his business (twice now).

I go measure it up, give him a quote, then he tells me he found out he also needs the faces. Well, that totally changes the quote, so I get a quote on new acrylic, and I tell him that I have to buy a 4X8 to do the job because I don't just have scraps of acrylic around and his comment is "Well I'm not gonna pay for a full 4X8" and I'm thinking...I'm sure as heck not going to do it, so there's the next red flag.

I get him the quote, he says it sounds good, I tell him I just need payment up front since it's all special order custom stuff, give him the price, and it includes the artwork and all. He says "let me talk to the wife because she may want to pay cash."

So a while later he calls me back and says "She wants to see the design before we pay for it" and I inform him I'm not going to design anything until I get payment for it (as everyone here has taught me, and as I've tried to follow more lately for people I have zero history with) and he said "well, we may just have to part ways then, because if you design something she doesn't like, you have her money and there's nothing you can do about it". I inform him that it's also the same way that I can spend time designing it, and him take my design somewhere else as well, and he seems to think that I'm crazy and that it would never happen (which we all know happens more with this personality of people than we'd like it to) and I basically tell him to pound sand if that's how he wants to handle it, and we part ways.

So all in all, I feel like I made the right call firing the dude. When one of the first conversations is how no one would call someone back, or didn't give them a quote, there's normally a reason for that, and it's normally because the person I'm talking to is a major pain in the rear.

In the end, it was like a $250 job...so I wasn't willing to do spec work for a job that I probably wouldn't have profited much more than $150 or so on. The fact the dude couldn't even remember his business name pretty much tells me he's no way going to survive...but that's not my problem now. He can go to the hacks in town. I didn't feel like I needed to defend myself that in the last 10 years we've never had a client not end up with a design that they like in the end.

 

[Gino]

In another thread, you made a comment about not letting your customers know more than they need to know. However, in this scenario, you explained wa-a-a-ay more than you needed. In my opinion, you allowed him to almost dictate to you his terms and you decided if you wanted to do business with him or not, instead of you just explaining his options up front and just letting him deal with it.

You have a company policy. No deposit, no work. Talk whatever over with your wife, but the end result is..... here's my policy..... hand it over or I'll be seeing ya. You did way more than needed, just by measuring up a coupla little signs. Nothing is worth $250 that demands up front designs or conversation about anything.

 

[FatCat]

Gino brings up a good point - telling the customer how you do things can sometimes backfire on you. Had you not mentioned you had to cut the faces out of a new 4x8 sheet (that you didn't have) and just gave him a price for what it was worth, you probably wouldn't have had to deal with that. Or put it this way - if you told him you had 2 pieces of scrap in the back that would do the job, he would have probably whined that he should get a lower price. The point is the customer doesn't need to know any of that. Always be fair and charge what the job is worth, not because misc. circumstances change.

Also, payment in full up front we only use on particular scenarios - for the most part we're 50% down with balance due on completion. So this way you both have "skin in the game" without being 1-sided.

Just my .02¢

 

[CanuckSigns]

100% of the time, when a new client comes to us complaining how xzy signs won't return their calls it's because the client is a pain in the a$$, I have yet to find an exception.

I think for a $250 job you put up with more bull$hit than you should have. 3 clients have my cell phone #, anyone else that asks gets told I don't have a cellphone, please email me the information, if some guy like this called me at 7 pm while I was trying to put my son to bed to talk about his project, I wouldn't answer either.

You did the right thing!

 

[TXFB.INS]

100% of the time, when a new client comes to us complaining how xzy signs won't return their calls it's because the client is a pain in the a$$, I have yet to find an exception.

I think for a $250 job you put up with more bull$hit than you should have. 3 clients have my cell phone #, anyone else that asks gets told I don't have a cellphone, please email me the information, if some guy like this called me at 7 pm while I was trying to put my son to bed to talk about his project, I wouldn't answer either.

You did the right thing!

I would have answered and told him exactly where he could go.....


to the OP You did way more than I would have done for this project.

 

[2B]

You are better than I for handling this type of PITA.



now to play


The next time someone wants your cell number to text you an image, have them text you the image to your E-mail address.

this will allow them to send you the image while keeping your cell number private.
Also when you want to send them a proof for review and they don't have an E-mail you do the same thing, E-mail them the proof (the proof must be embedded in the body, cannot be an attachment) to their cell number
example 10digitphonenumber@mms.att.net each cell provider has their own URL domain to use, just get their cell provider and then google the URL domain for E-mail to text for MMS

 

[GAC05]

Next time when you get a logo via email and they want a proof before paying, take their image and run it through a pixelating mosaic filter - so it looks like an adult video promo shot.
Send it back explaining this is as far as you can go without a deposit.


wayne k
guam usa

 

[ams]

When he said "If you design something that we don't like, we're screwed" You should have told him that you'd tweak the design and give him proofs before making it.
Your post sounded like "Once you pay me, I am going to design something and put it up, case closed".

Other than that, that guy is a real loser.

 

[decalman]

Pros and cons

I design stuff up front lots of times. In this case, I may have as long as it was simple enough. It usually pays off good.
People don't like buying a pig in a poke.

His refusal to not pay for the material is indeed a red flag, and I would have proceeded with caution with him also.

So the guy can't remember his business. So thats just him.
250 is still live money. I love small, and medium jobs, because they add up, and don't take long.

Lots of people call me at all hours on my cell, They just want to do business with me. If I'm off duty, my phone shows whos calling, and I can choose to answer, or swipe " don't answer".
You saw his demeanor, not I so You probably made the correct choice.

 

[chester215]

It may seem to be overkill but i now have 2 cell phones just for this reason.
If I call a customer from the road they will save and call back my cell # the next time they want to talk to me.

The second cell phone is from ringplus and has no monthly charges.
It stays in the office or my truck and I never answer it, just outgoing calls.

I think you did the right thing by dropping him.
Let him be a PIA to someone else. Probably would have wanted changes after the job is done. (my wife doesn't like how it looks)
I probably would have given him a very low resolution proof.

 

[TheSnowman]

Thanks for the thoughts on this. Gino, and others, you are right, I'm not sure why I play the 4X8 card...it doesn't matter. What it costs is what it costs, I need to remember that.

Far as emailing from a text message, I forgot about this, I have done it before but screwed up. This will now be my go to.

I do have a few customers that I'd do something in the middle of the night for if they called, because they're my bread and butter and that's the relationship we have, but it is getting excessive how people get my number now.

I have a google voice number but that's seemed like a pain to call out from in the past. I need to revisit that for outgoing calls, or find me a cheap phone like someone said for outgoing calls only, and it stays in my car. Period. You call the office of you need me, and I'll route it however I need.

 

[TheSnowman]

And I normally do 50% up front, but when I have no history with someone, and I get all the red flags I was seeing, and they tell me that they're in a big hurry and can't even send an email, I don't even waste time.

The amount I would have made would have been ok, but it's not worth what every single one of these projects turns out like. The customer rushes into it, approves mistakes, tries to pin it on me, and it always ends up bad. I rarely have rush jobs that go through without a hiccup where the customer screwed up in approvals. I know, shouldn't be my problem, but I want everyone happy when they leave.